Man arrested for carrying at Obama rally

jahwarrior72 · August 30th, 2008, 01:49 AM

Beaver County Times & Allegheny Times Online - News

Quote:

Man arrested for having gun at rally

By Bill Vidonic, Times Staff
Published: Friday, August 29, 2008 11:10 PM EDT
BEAVER — An Industry man is facing a disorderly conduct charge for attending the Barack Obama rally in Irvine Park with a loaded gun that was holstered on his hip, according to state police and the Beaver County sheriff’s department.

John Noble, 50, was questioned by police for several hours Friday night after the incident, in which witnesses said he also was passing out fliers with writing about gun rights.

John Atkinson of Vanport Township said he saw Noble passing out the fliers and noticed the small-caliber handgun strapped to the man’s waist. He said he quickly notified nearby deputy sheriffs, and deputies Joseph O’Sche and Rich Yonlisky approached the man as he walked along Market Street.

Atkinson said that when the deputies asked why he had a gun, Noble replied, “Because I’m an American,” and one of the deputies responded, “Well, you’re under arrest.”

Noble was hustled to a nearby vehicle, and state police took him to the Brighton Township barracks to question him.

Beaver County Sheriff George David said that Noble insisted he had a right to have the gun because he has a permit to carry it. It wasn’t clear late Friday whether Noble had a valid permit.

David said Noble “wanted to show his rights.” He said Noble never removed the gun from the holster or threatened anyone.

Noble’s arrest took place around 7 p.m., nearly 90 minutes before Sen. Obama and the rest of his campaign team arrived in Beaver.

Bill Vidonic can be reached online at bvidonic@timesonline.com.

i want to start that i don't want this to turn into an OC/CC debate. granted, OCing at a political rally may not have been the smartest thing to do, but that's just my opinion. some will say he did us a disservice by proving we're a bunch of gun toting, bible thumping yahoos. that may be. but it doesn't excuse the fact that what he did, was perfectly legal. some facts about OC in PA: you cannot be charged with disorderly conduct, terroristic threats, or brandishing for simply wearing a gun. period.

in my town, the st. patty's day parade is the biggest event of the year. this past st. patty's day, i wore my gun to the parade. openly. i knew hillary clinton would be there, but i figured she'd be in a float or something. she walked by me, less than 20 feet away. walked by me, and the worst i got was some eyeballing by Scranton PD. and i got crap from some feminazis for waving my ron paul sign at clinton, but that's besides the point. i got within 20 feet of the woman who helped author the AWB, and i did it fully, visibly armed.

Eagleks · August 30th, 2008, 02:03 AM

sounds like a wrongful arrest without cause..... and a lawsuit in the process. There is nothing in the laws that I'm aware preventing him from doing what he did. Although, I can see why the SS would get sciddish about it, it is their job... but detain and question... not arrest and trump up some BS.

Free American · August 30th, 2008, 03:35 AM

papers please

Cupcake · August 30th, 2008, 09:53 AM

One shouldn't be arrested for doing something distasteful.

Double Naught Spy · August 30th, 2008, 10:02 AM

Quote:

you cannot be charged with disorderly conduct, terroristic threats, or brandishing for simply wearing a gun. period.

I believe this is in error, but only if a disturbance is being caused as a result of the act. The same would hold true for many legal activities. However, there is no indication that a disturbance was being created by the incident.

Kovernm · August 30th, 2008, 10:25 AM

When I was younger I worked for a company that vended at a local teams ball diamond. I was asked to work when President George W. Bush came to speak at the ball diamond. I showed up about four hours before his speech was to take place and there was secret service at the drive way. Sense I did not work directly for the ball diamond I was not issued a pass. Everyone working or attending the speech had to have a pass. I was able to call my boss who was already inside and get him to convince them that I worked for him. After all that I had to walk through a security setup at the gate. Here in Michigan you can not carry at any sports arena or stadium, but I am sure that had nothing to do with it.

jahwarrior72 · August 30th, 2008, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Double Naught Spy

I believe this is in error, but only if a disturbance is being caused as a result of the act. The same would hold true for many legal activities. However, there is no indication that a disturbance was being created by the incident.

that's the law in PA. to be charged disorderly conduct, terroristic threats, brandishing, or public nuisance, you have to be actually doing something. open carry of a gun doesn't qualify. threatening someone with it, or being drunk and obnoxious while carrying, would. also, trespassing on private property could result in a disorderly conduct charge.

automatic slim · August 30th, 2008, 12:43 PM

As a retired LEO allow me to comment. I read the article but was unable to determine which state this was in. If it was an open carry state this man was certainly within his rights. As for the disorderly conduct charge, that would depend wholly on how the statute was written. Many contain the phrase "any action which causes others distress". In this case the charges may stick. Such wording is intended to give law enforcement the upper hand when encountering
situations not specifically covered by law, such as pan handling, which many locales don't have on the books because it's never been a problem. Such wording however does invite abuse, when it is used just to get someone off the street. If I was this gentleman I would certainly consult a lawyer.

Phillep Harding · August 30th, 2008, 01:07 PM

Being detained like that is actual arrest, but some places allow people to be detained for a while without it counting as an arrest (unless they "resist arrest"). Yeah, this is going to depend on local laws and the local court system.

I wouldn't count him carrying as a criminal act, and the information given does not indicate the cop had a reason for bending the rules to prevent trouble.

cvhoss · August 30th, 2008, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by automatic slim

............I read the article but was unable to determine which state this was in. ............

On the article web page, I clicked on the weather report link and the report that came up was for Beaver, PA.

Hoss

August 30th, 2008, 03:35 AM	#3
Free American Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Virginia Posts: 703	papers please __________________ They who give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin Previously known as "cjm5874"

August 30th, 2008, 09:53 AM	#4
Cupcake VIP Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Michigan Posts: 2,996	One shouldn't be arrested for doing something distasteful. __________________ Sixto for President!

August 30th, 2008, 12:43 PM	#8
automatic slim Distinguished Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: The western edge of The Confederacy Posts: 1,223	As a retired LEO allow me to comment. I read the article but was unable to determine which state this was in. If it was an open carry state this man was certainly within his rights. As for the disorderly conduct charge, that would depend wholly on how the statute was written. Many contain the phrase "any action which causes others distress". In this case the charges may stick. Such wording is intended to give law enforcement the upper hand when encountering situations not specifically covered by law, such as pan handling, which many locales don't have on the books because it's never been a problem. Such wording however does invite abuse, when it is used just to get someone off the street. If I was this gentleman I would certainly consult a lawyer. __________________ "First gallant South Carolina nobly made the stand." Edge of Darkness

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August 30th, 2008, 02:03 AM	#2
Eagleks Distinguished Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Kansas Posts: 1,749	sounds like a wrongful arrest without cause..... and a lawsuit in the process. There is nothing in the laws that I'm aware preventing him from doing what he did. Although, I can see why the SS would get sciddish about it, it is their job... but detain and question... not arrest and trump up some BS.

August 30th, 2008, 10:25 AM	#6
Kovernm Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Michigan Posts: 392	When I was younger I worked for a company that vended at a local teams ball diamond. I was asked to work when President George W. Bush came to speak at the ball diamond. I showed up about four hours before his speech was to take place and there was secret service at the drive way. Sense I did not work directly for the ball diamond I was not issued a pass. Everyone working or attending the speech had to have a pass. I was able to call my boss who was already inside and get him to convince them that I worked for him. After all that I had to walk through a security setup at the gate. Here in Michigan you can not carry at any sports arena or stadium, but I am sure that had nothing to do with it.

August 30th, 2008, 01:07 PM	#9
Phillep Harding Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 357	Being detained like that is actual arrest, but some places allow people to be detained for a while without it counting as an arrest (unless they "resist arrest"). Yeah, this is going to depend on local laws and the local court system. I wouldn't count him carrying as a criminal act, and the information given does not indicate the cop had a reason for bending the rules to prevent trouble.