Open Carry in vehicle in VA?

RockyTop · May 7th, 2009, 05:38 PM

I was under the impression even without a ccw license you could carry a firearm in your vehicle in open view (seat/dash). But reading over the VA CC law it states without a cc license you can carry a firearm in a vehicle under certain circumstances, such as going to a range, gunshop, etc as long as the weapon is unloaded and securely wrapped while being transported.

So what's the deal, can VA citizens open carry in a vehicle or not?

JD · May 7th, 2009, 05:53 PM

Yes you can open carry the gun in a vehicle if it's in plain view (not really carried IMHO)

I'm guessing you're referring to 18.2.-308 which states the following:

Quote:

3. Any regularly enrolled member of a target shooting organization who is at, or going to or from, an established shooting range, provided that the weapons are unloaded and securely wrapped while being transported;

You have to go back up to the top and re-read:

Quote:

If any person carries about his person, hidden from common observation,

...

If it's in plain view, it's not hidden from common observation and is OK.

If it's in a case in a ready to fire condition, then it IS hidden from common observation and would be a no-no.

I know it's goofy, but that's legal gibberish for you.

RockyTop · May 7th, 2009, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD

You have to go back up to the top and re-read:

...

If it's in plain view, it's not hidden from common observation and is OK.

If it's in a case in a ready to fire condition, then it IS hidden from common observation and would be a no-no.

I know it's goofy, but that's legal gibberish for you.

Ah...thanks. I figured I was missing something.

patrol · May 9th, 2009, 02:17 PM

Plain view is legal. Just if you get pulled over tell the officer you have a gun in plain view and keep your hands on the steering wheel. Some local cities and counties throughout the state have ordinances on wheter or not the gun is loaded even though the State code says it's not supposed to be kept loaded. I don't mess with people if they have it loaded because it's ignorant to allow open carry and plain view and to have a firearm for your protection that is unloaded. Another stupid gun law that should not exist.

DaveH · May 9th, 2009, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patrol

Plain view is legal. Just if you get pulled over tell the officer you have a gun in plain view and keep your hands on the steering wheel. Some local cities and counties throughout the state have ordinances on wheter or not the gun is loaded even though the State code says it's not supposed to be kept loaded. I don't mess with people if they have it loaded because it's ignorant to allow open carry and plain view and to have a firearm for your protection that is unloaded. Another stupid gun law that should not exist.

Source citation please for the Statewide "unloaded" requirement for handguns, please?

Source citation please for the Statewide "unloaded" requirement, of long guns, please?

FWIIW -- Local cities and counties cannot enforce such ordinances to on long guns you if you "reasonably believes that a loaded rifle or shotgun is necessary for your personal safety in the course of your employment or business." -- See § 15.2-915.2.

BTW -- VCDL supported a bill to put teeth in Virginia's firearm preemption law. It will be law July 1. It requires a court to award reasonable attorney fees, expenses, and court costs to any entity that prevails in an action challenging an ordinance, resolution, motion, or administrative action as being in conflict with a locality's authority to control firearms pursuant to § 15.2-915

Quote:

§ 15.2-915. Control of firearms; applicability to authorities and local governmental agencies.

A. No locality shall adopt or enforce any ordinance, resolution or motion, as permitted by § 15.2-1425, and no agent of such locality shall take any administrative action, governing the purchase, possession, transfer, ownership, carrying, storage or transporting of firearms, ammunition, or components or combination thereof other than those expressly authorized by statute. For purposes of this section, a statute that does not refer to firearms, ammunition, or components or combination thereof, shall not be construed to provide express authorization.

Nothing in this section shall prohibit a locality from adopting workplace rules relating to terms and conditions of employment of the workforce. Nothing in this section shall prohibit a law-enforcement officer, as defined in § 9.1-101 from acting within the scope of his duties.

The provisions of this section applicable to a locality shall also apply to any authority or to a local governmental entity, including a department or agency, but not including any local or regional jail or juvenile detention facility.

B. Any local ordinance, resolution or motion adopted prior to the effective date of this act governing the purchase, possession, transfer, ownership, carrying or transporting of firearms, ammunition, or components or combination thereof, other than those expressly authorized by statute, is invalid.

§ 15.2-915.1. Limitations on authority of localities to bring lawsuits.

No locality shall have the authority to bring suit against a firearms or ammunition marketer, manufacturer, distributor, dealer, seller, or trade association for damages, abatement, injunctive relief or any other remedy resulting from or relating to the lawful design, marketing, manufacture, distribution, sale, or transfer of firearms or ammunition to the public. The right to bring any such action is hereby reserved exclusively to the Commonwealth. Any action brought by the Commonwealth pursuant to this section shall be brought by the Attorney General on behalf of the Commonwealth.

This section shall not prohibit (i) a locality from bringing an action against a firearms or ammunition marketer, manufacturer, distributor, dealer, seller, or trade association for breach of contract or warranty or negligence as to firearms or ammunition purchased by the locality or (ii) an action for injuries resulting from negligence or breach of warranty or contract.

The provisions of this section applicable to a locality shall also apply equally to any state governmental entity, including a department, agency, or authority.

§ 15.2-915.2. Regulation of transportation of a loaded rifle or shotgun.

The governing body of any county or city may by ordinance make it unlawful for any person to transport, possess or carry a loaded shotgun or loaded rifle in any vehicle on any public street, road, or highway within such locality. Any violation of such ordinance shall be punishable by a fine of not more than $100. Conservation police officers, sheriffs and all other law-enforcement officers shall enforce the provisions of this section. No ordinance adopted pursuant to this section shall be enforceable unless the governing body adopting such ordinance so notifies the Director of the Department of Game and Inland Fisheries by registered mail prior to May 1 of the year in which such ordinance is to take effect.

The provisions of this section shall not apply to duly authorized law-enforcement officers or military personnel in the performance of their lawful duties, nor to any person who reasonably believes that a loaded rifle or shotgun is necessary for his personal safety in the course of his employment or business.

DaveH · May 14th, 2009, 10:44 PM

Earlier it was posted:

Quote:

Some local cities and counties throughout the state have ordinances on wheter or not the gun is loaded even though the State code says it's not supposed to be kept loaded.

I know it is hard to prove a negative. So, saying that this is not true for handguns would be a bit of folly on my part.

However, I'll ask again:

Does anyone know of an authority (code or case law) requiring handguns to be "unloaded" in a vehicle?

Statewide or local?

Also, does anyone know of code or case law defining "not hidden from common observation" when in a vehicle? I have read that some States require it be visible from either one of the front windows or through the windshield. However, I've not seen it defined in VA.

woodstock · May 14th, 2009, 11:24 PM

While state and local laws may vary, federal law still has the "Gun Free School Zone" law. A 1000 foot zone around all the schools in your village/town/city takes up a lot of real estate. I used Delorme mapping software and put an approximately sized circle around every school in my town. I can't get from one end of town to the other without passing through nearly every "school zone" in town and county. I won't get into whether this law is constitutional. I don't have the spare resources to be the test case. It's enough for me that it exists and Ii can't change it.

Now, if you have a permit this doesn't affect you - in Virginia, at least. In Virginia I can drive right on to school property to pick up and drop off my child as long as I remain in the vehicle and the pistol remains concealed.

Look before you leap on this one. Our local Commonwealth's Attorney was set to prosecute a kid under this statute for having an air gun within the "zone".

titleist · May 15th, 2009, 08:28 AM

There are no local regs that affect the Code of Virginia. It is state law that says no local ordinances may be made to modify 18.2-308. I've been pulled a few times with it on the front seat, no biggie.

DaveH · May 16th, 2009, 08:26 PM

Titleist, I agree!

However, I am still looking for the State code that says it's not supposed to be kept loaded which was posted earlier.

Don't want to say it doesn't exist -- but I can't find it.

May 7th, 2009, 05:38 PM	#1
RockyTop Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Virginia Posts: 60	Open Carry in vehicle in VA? I was under the impression even without a ccw license you could carry a firearm in your vehicle in open view (seat/dash). But reading over the VA CC law it states without a cc license you can carry a firearm in a vehicle under certain circumstances, such as going to a range, gunshop, etc as long as the weapon is unloaded and securely wrapped while being transported. So what's the deal, can VA citizens open carry in a vehicle or not?

May 9th, 2009, 02:17 PM	#4
patrol Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Virginia Posts: 81	Plain view is legal. Just if you get pulled over tell the officer you have a gun in plain view and keep your hands on the steering wheel. Some local cities and counties throughout the state have ordinances on wheter or not the gun is loaded even though the State code says it's not supposed to be kept loaded. I don't mess with people if they have it loaded because it's ignorant to allow open carry and plain view and to have a firearm for your protection that is unloaded. Another stupid gun law that should not exist. __________________ I DO NOT LIKE THE LANGUAGE OF VIOLENCE,HOWEVER DUE TO MY PROFESSION IAM FLUENT IN HOW IT IS SPOKEN

May 14th, 2009, 11:24 PM	#7
woodstock Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Culpeper, VA Posts: 113	Without a permit stay well clear of schools While state and local laws may vary, federal law still has the "Gun Free School Zone" law. A 1000 foot zone around all the schools in your village/town/city takes up a lot of real estate. I used Delorme mapping software and put an approximately sized circle around every school in my town. I can't get from one end of town to the other without passing through nearly every "school zone" in town and county. I won't get into whether this law is constitutional. I don't have the spare resources to be the test case. It's enough for me that it exists and Ii can't change it. Now, if you have a permit this doesn't affect you - in Virginia, at least. In Virginia I can drive right on to school property to pick up and drop off my child as long as I remain in the vehicle and the pistol remains concealed. Look before you leap on this one. Our local Commonwealth's Attorney was set to prosecute a kid under this statute for having an air gun within the "zone". __________________ Rick N. Culpeper, VA

May 16th, 2009, 08:26 PM	#9
DaveH VIP Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: SW Virginia Posts: 2,395	Titleist, I agree! However, I am still looking for the State code that says it's not supposed to be kept loaded which was posted earlier. Don't want to say it doesn't exist -- but I can't find it. __________________ Μολὼν λαβέ I'm just one root in a grassroots organization. No one should assume that I speak for the VCDL BTW -- I am neither a lawyer, nor I do not play one on television or on the Internet. I hope no one assumes that I am giving legal advice Veni, Vidi, Velcro

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May 15th, 2009, 08:28 AM	#8
titleist Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: NoVA Posts: 328	There are no local regs that affect the Code of Virginia. It is state law that says no local ordinances may be made to modify 18.2-308. I've been pulled a few times with it on the front seat, no biggie.