Open Carry at TD Bank - Police Called - Page 9

Eagleks · August 19th, 2009, 12:51 AM

All I have to say is... a bank I had been with for 46 yrs, lost my business.
I didn't think I needed "attitude" while they are holding my money....

darkstar11 · August 19th, 2009, 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by retsupt99

Do they make the Brinks guards disarm, too?

No sir. As a former Brinks employee I can say that the ONLY two places where I was required to disarm was in the Federal courthouse and the Federal Reserve Bank, both of which have their own in house police/security force. I do believe in the form of the Federal Reserve Police force and in the case of the Federal courthouse, U.S. Marshals.

Defensive Arms · August 19th, 2009, 06:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MadMac

Once, when she claimed you were in violation of federal law, and second, when she claimed to have called the police and you found out she did not.

No doubt she lied about the second.

However, I've run into quite a few people over the years who honestly believe that it's a federal offense to carry in any bank.

I'm not trying to defend her actions in any way, but she was probably just grossly ignorant on that particular claim.

J Bowen · August 19th, 2009, 06:19 AM

In NC the law states that a permit is
not valid in any financial institutions
although not federal law could be the
same law in some other states as well.

Random · August 19th, 2009, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Defensive Arms

No doubt she lied about the second.

Lying about calling the police is par for the course in retail institutions of any sort. It is often used simply to intimidate someone to leave. I don't know how many times I've been in a situation where one employee says "we're calling the police" while another employee picks up the phone and dials - but they actually don't call, or they call a friend or something.

It works. It gets the person to leave, and you don't actually have to involve the police.

OldLincoln · August 20th, 2009, 07:23 PM

As a first timer here, the issue of right to OC vs: right to prevent OC for specific locations. Although not a personal issue, I visited the opencarry dot org site and saw that Nevada has a "gold" rating and defines that as:

"Fully preempted open carry permitted on foot and in vehicles without a license; localities fully preempted." Does that mean no location in the state can block you from OC?

I'm just beginning my education but this struck me as a bit odd.

Faitmaker · August 21st, 2009, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldLincoln

As a first timer here, the issue of right to OC vs: right to prevent OC for specific locations. Although not a personal issue, I visited the opencarry dot org site and saw that Nevada has a "gold" rating and defines that as:

"Fully preempted open carry permitted on foot and in vehicles without a license; localities fully preempted." Does that mean no location in the state can block you from OC?

I'm just beginning my education but this struck me as a bit odd.

You should go to Handgunlaw.us but here is what I found in just 30 seconds of looking at it.

Quote:

State Preemption
13-3108. Firearms regulated by state; state preemption; violation; classification
A. Except as provided in subsection C of this section, a political subdivision of this state shall not enact any
ordinance, rule or tax relating to the transportation, possession, carrying, sale, transfer or use of firearms or
ammunition or any firearm or ammunition components in this state.
B. A political subdivision of this state shall not require the licensing or registration of firearms or
ammunition or any firearm or ammunition components or prohibit the ownership, purchase, sale or transfer
of firearms or ammunition or any firearm or ammunition components.
C. This section does not prohibit a political subdivision of this state from enacting and enforcing any
ordinance or rule pursuant to state law, to implement or enforce state law or relating to any of the following
1. Imposing any privilege or use tax on the retail sale, lease or rental of, or the gross proceeds or gross
income from the sale, lease or rental of, firearms or ammunition or any firearm or ammunition components
a rate that applies generally to other items of tangible personal property.
2. Prohibiting a minor who is unaccompanied by a parent, grandparent or guardian or a certified hunter
safety instructor or certified firearms safety instructor acting with the consent of the minor's parent,
grandparent or guardian from knowingly possessing or carrying on the minor's person, within the minor's
immediate control or in or on a means of transportation a firearm in any place that is open to the public or o
any street or highway or on any private property except private property that is owned or leased by the mino
or the minor's parent, grandparent or guardian. Any ordinance or rule that is adopted pursuant to this
paragraph shall not apply to a minor who is fourteen, fifteen, sixteen or seventeen years of age and who is
engaged in any of the following:
(a) Lawful hunting or shooting events or marksmanship practice at established ranges or other areas where
the discharge of a firearm is not prohibited.
(b) Lawful transportation of an unloaded firearm for the purpose of lawful hunting.
(c) Lawful transportation of an unloaded firearm between the hours of 5:00 a.m. and 10:00 p.m. for the
purpose of shooting events or marksmanship practice at established ranges or other areas where the discharge
of a firearm is not prohibited.
(d) Any activity that is related to the production of crops, livestock, poultry, livestock products, poultry
products or ratites or storage of agricultural commodities.
3. The use of land and structures, including a business relating to firearms or ammunition or their
components or a shooting range in the same manner as other commercial businesses. Notwithstanding any
other law, this paragraph does not authorize a political subdivision to regulate the sale or transfer of firearms
on property it owns, leases, operates or controls in a manner that is different than or inconsistent with state
law. For the purposes of this paragraph, a use permit or other contract that provides for the use of property
owned, leased, operated or controlled by a political subdivision shall not be considered a sale, conveyance or
disposition of property.
4. Regulating employees or independent contractors of the political subdivision who are acting within the
course and scope of their employment or contract.
5. Limiting firearms possession in parks or preserves of one square mile or less in area to persons who
possess a concealed weapons permit issued pursuant to section 13-3112. The political subdivision shall post
reasonable notice at each park or preserve. The notice shall state the following: "Carrying a firearm in this
park is limited to persons who possess a permit issued pursuant to section 13-3112." In parks or preserves
that are more than one square mile in area, a political subdivision may designate developed or improved
areas in which the political subdivision may limit firearms possession to persons who possess a concealed
weapons permit issued pursuant to section 13-3112. The political subdivision shall post reasonable notice at
each designated developed or improved area. The notice shall state the following: "Carrying a firearm in this
developed or improved area is limited to persons with a permit issued pursuant to section 13-3112." For the
purposes of this paragraph, "developed or improved area" means an area of property developed for public
recreation or family activity, including picnic areas, concessions, playgrounds, amphitheaters, racquet courts,
swimming areas, golf courses, zoos, horseback riding facilities and boat landing and docking facilities.
Developed or improved area does not include campgrounds, trails, paths or roadways except trails, paths and
roadways directly associated with and adjacent to designated developed or improved areas. Any notice that is
required by this paragraph shall be conspicuously posted at all public entrances and at intervals of one-fourth
mile or less where the park, preserve or developed or improved area has an open perimeter. Any limitation
imposed by a political subdivision pursuant to this paragraph shall not apply to a person:
(a) Engaged in a permitted firearms or hunter safety course conducted in a park by a certified hunter safety
instructor or certified firearms safety instructor.
(b) At a properly supervised range, as defined in section 13-3107, at a permitted shooting event, at a
permitted firearms show or in a permitted hunting area.
(c) Legally transporting, carrying, storing or possessing a firearm in a vehicle.
(d) Going directly to or from an area where the person is lawfully engaged in hunting, marksmanship
practice or recreational shooting.
(e) Traversing a trailhead area in order to gain access to areas where the possession of firearms is not limited. (f) Using trails, paths or roadways to go directly to or from an area where the possession of firearms is not
limited and where no reasonable alternate means of access is available.

Also

Quote:

Places Off-Limits Even With A Permit/License

Prohibitions on carrying firearms in these venues apply to both open and concealed carry.
• Any establishment licensed to serve alcohol for on-premises consumption (e.g., a bar or restaurant,
but not a liquor store or supermarket that sells alcoholic beverages in sealed containers).
• Any establishment or event open to the public where the operator makes a reasonable request for you
to give them custody or remove the weapon from the premises. A sign would qualify for such
request. By law, cities and counties are required to offer on-site storage if they ban weapons but not
all are in compliance.
• The grounds of any public school, other than the parking lot. In order to be legal in the parking lot the
weapon must be unloaded, and, if left in an unattended vehicle, such vehicle must be locked and the
weapon out of sight.
• Commercial nuclear or hydroelectric generating stations.
• Polling places on Election Day.
• Correctional facilities (this includes the parking lot of such facilities).
• Game refuges (except during an authorized hunt).
• You can take a firearm onto school property if you follow the procedure below.
You are an adult in a vehicle and the firearm is unloaded before entering school grounds. Furthermore, if you
must exit your vehicle, the firearm must remain unloaded and be secured (locked) within the vehicle, out of
plain view (ARS 13-3102.I.1) Use caution and common sense if you must exit the vehicle with a firearm to
secure it in the trunk (avoid causing a potentially serious disturbance)
"If an operator of a public establishment or a sponsor of a public event requests that a person carrying a
deadly weapon remove the weapon, the operator or sponsor shall provide temporary and secure storage. The
storage shall be readily accessible on entry into the establishment or event and allow for the immediate
retrieval of the weapon on exit from the establishment or event." Some agencies and jurisdictions are
choosing to not comply with the new laws - there are no penalties for non-compliance.
Parking Lots: SB 1168 signed by the Governor will prohibit property and business owners from banning
guns from parking areas, so long as the weapons are kept locked in privately owned vehicles. The law
exempts parking lots that are fenced or guarded, as well as those that provide secure gun storage.
Display of Firearm: SB 1243 signed by the Governor allows any individual who feels threatened to indicate
that they're carrying a weapon without violating intimidation statutes. The law only applies for instances of self-defense.
Note: Carry in State/County/City parks is legal if it is not posted with a No Firearms sign. If it is posted
you cannot carry there legally even with a permit.

sirfarmer · August 22nd, 2009, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by V65magnafan

Some day, sirfarmer, I hope you have a moment to chat with Miss Manager to see what motivated her. Is she Canadian? What's her problem? Was she dropped into N.H. from New Jersey? I'd love to know.

As I suspected, a Massachusetts transplant.

Sigh.

V65magnafan · August 22nd, 2009, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sirfarmer

As I suspected, a Massachusetts transplant.

Sigh.

Ewww.

smity · August 25th, 2009, 08:53 AM

I sent the following email. Hope it helps.

Dear Cecile,
I recently heard about the incident in your bank where a local citizen was openly carrying a handgun while making a deposit and that you had asked him to leave.

I just wanted to weigh in and let you know that he was one of the good guys. We all have the natural right to self-defense and a handgun, despite claims to the contrary, is the best way for someone to do so safely. Most states require very strict background checks and training. I hope that you can reconsider your bank's no gun policy. Please take a look at the 2nd and 14th Amendments to the U.S. Constitution and you will find that he was merely refusing to be a victim, in the true colors of the American spirit of independence and responsibility.

We are all frustrated with the boldness of many of the criminals in our neighborhoods. They have become so because most people have been convinced over the last 50 years to give up their right to bear arms at the insistence of some well meaning, but misguided people. Historically, this is a very important right -- it is the one that protects all others.

In 1775, it was a group of militia that defeated 700 British soldiers as they attempted to disarm Massachusetts and the rest of the colonies in order to impose the will of the King. This was a rag tag group of everyday husbands and fathers that had taken the time and effort to be prepared for the unknown. As it turned out, the British were defeated and a nation was born. Now, instead of the British, we have organized crime, violent gangs and rogue criminals with no conscience. Benjamin Franklin once said "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote." I hope that you see your armed customers as the well armed lamb.

My sense is that one day you may be embarrassed at this event. Please don't be. Many have been bamboozled on this issue. I ask that you keep an open mind and keep your eyes open for stories in the media of honest, hard working men and women who have successfully defended themselves against their assailants. In the last 15 years, every massacre that has occurred happened in a "gun free zone." This is because those that would commit such horrible acts know that they have no opposition in such areas. It is only a matter of time before criminals figure out that there are no guns in your bank and, therefore, they will view it as an attractive target. My recommendation, is that you join the 2nd Amendment Foundation and place the sticker on your door. Criminals don't want to take the chance that someone inside may be armed. Your bank will be safer for doing so.

Sincerely,

xxxxxxxxxxxxx
CPT, US Army (hon dis)

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August 19th, 2009, 12:51 AM	#81
Eagleks Distinguished Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Kansas Posts: 1,740	All I have to say is... a bank I had been with for 46 yrs, lost my business. I didn't think I needed "attitude" while they are holding my money....

August 19th, 2009, 06:19 AM	#84
J Bowen Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Southern USA Posts: 371	In NC the law states that a permit is not valid in any financial institutions although not federal law could be the same law in some other states as well.

August 20th, 2009, 07:23 PM	#86
OldLincoln New Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: West Coast Posts: 7	As a first timer here, the issue of right to OC vs: right to prevent OC for specific locations. Although not a personal issue, I visited the opencarry dot org site and saw that Nevada has a "gold" rating and defines that as: "Fully preempted open carry permitted on foot and in vehicles without a license; localities fully preempted." Does that mean no location in the state can block you from OC? I'm just beginning my education but this struck me as a bit odd.

August 25th, 2009, 08:53 AM	#90
smity Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: NJ Posts: 35	I sent the following email. Hope it helps. Dear Cecile, I recently heard about the incident in your bank where a local citizen was openly carrying a handgun while making a deposit and that you had asked him to leave. I just wanted to weigh in and let you know that he was one of the good guys. We all have the natural right to self-defense and a handgun, despite claims to the contrary, is the best way for someone to do so safely. Most states require very strict background checks and training. I hope that you can reconsider your bank's no gun policy. Please take a look at the 2nd and 14th Amendments to the U.S. Constitution and you will find that he was merely refusing to be a victim, in the true colors of the American spirit of independence and responsibility. We are all frustrated with the boldness of many of the criminals in our neighborhoods. They have become so because most people have been convinced over the last 50 years to give up their right to bear arms at the insistence of some well meaning, but misguided people. Historically, this is a very important right -- it is the one that protects all others. In 1775, it was a group of militia that defeated 700 British soldiers as they attempted to disarm Massachusetts and the rest of the colonies in order to impose the will of the King. This was a rag tag group of everyday husbands and fathers that had taken the time and effort to be prepared for the unknown. As it turned out, the British were defeated and a nation was born. Now, instead of the British, we have organized crime, violent gangs and rogue criminals with no conscience. Benjamin Franklin once said "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote." I hope that you see your armed customers as the well armed lamb. My sense is that one day you may be embarrassed at this event. Please don't be. Many have been bamboozled on this issue. I ask that you keep an open mind and keep your eyes open for stories in the media of honest, hard working men and women who have successfully defended themselves against their assailants. In the last 15 years, every massacre that has occurred happened in a "gun free zone." This is because those that would commit such horrible acts know that they have no opposition in such areas. It is only a matter of time before criminals figure out that there are no guns in your bank and, therefore, they will view it as an attractive target. My recommendation, is that you join the 2nd Amendment Foundation and place the sticker on your door. Criminals don't want to take the chance that someone inside may be armed. Your bank will be safer for doing so. Sincerely, xxxxxxxxxxxxx CPT, US Army (hon dis)