Should I Open Carry? - Page 3

12Rounds · October 10th, 2009, 05:56 PM

I highly doubt that having a gun on you makes you more vulnerable...think about it, would a criminal go after a guy carrying a baseball bat ? A machete ? A hatchet ? A spear..etc ? Of course not. Being armed makes you dangerous prey, instead of an easy meal. I'd be very surprised if there are any cases where a criminal went after a harder target versus an easier one, it just flies in the face of logic . There are much easier ways for criminals to get guns than taking them off of armed citizens, it's easier to steal from a home, car, buy one off the street or have some one do a straw purchase. I believe that the "it'll make you a target " argument is debunked easily by the absence of evidence to the contrary. If it was true, we'd hear about it a lot.
Carry however YOU want, but always carry.

jofrdo · October 10th, 2009, 11:55 PM

The argument about criminals targeting a guy with an openly displayed gun doesn't mean that bad guys will be more likely to target him for robbery. The thinking is that if criminals come into a place (bank, convenience store, etc.) with the intent to rob the place and notice an armed customer, they may just shoot him first, before they even announce the robbery, and before the armed customer is aware enough to draw, whereas a customer in the same place carrying concealed would have the element of surprise going for him, and might have a better chance of defending himself and others.

I personally pick and choose where I open carry. When I go to the bank, I choose a branch with a walk-up ATM. I don't like drive-up machines because it's hard to draw and defend myself from a seated postition. This is a different situation from the above. If a bad guy is lurking to rob an ATM customer, he's likely to stay in hiding if an obviously armed customer approaches, whereas he might make his move on a concealed carrying customer.

You can debate it with you father until you both die of old age. But if open carry is your only option due to your age, it becomes a no-brainer; open carry. Also, remember that one of the biggest reasons to open carry is the ability to desensitize the pubic to seeing other citizens carry guns.

Miggy · October 11th, 2009, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spec

I don't care about others 2 cent comments

You should... she votes. Whether OC or CC you are an ambassador of the 2A at all times. Make preparations to be polite and calmly explain why you carry.

Glock30Owner · October 11th, 2009, 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spec

I DON'T carry concealed im 18 my only option is OC so i just want some thoughts

This actually changes things.

OC every waking moment that you are legally able. Due to the law stating that you are not mature enough to conceal a firearm, but mature enough to carry one (gotta love legal logic), you should carry the only way you are "allowed".

If your dad gives you a hard time for this, you have few choices... move out and live by your rules or obey your father...

Spec · October 11th, 2009, 02:11 AM

[QUOTE=jofrdo;1330420]The argument about criminals targeting a guy with an openly displayed gun doesn't mean that bad guys will be more likely to target him for robbery. The thinking is that if criminals come into a place (bank, convenience store, etc.) with the intent to rob the place and notice an armed customer, they may just shoot him first, before they even announce the robbery, and before the armed customer is aware enough to draw, whereas a customer in the same place carrying concealed would have the element of surprise going for him, and might have a better chance of defending himself and others.

my dad has his cpl he is not against it he just doesn't like the whole thing about this example above...^^^

chiefjason · October 11th, 2009, 02:37 AM

For me, I took about 2 months to really look into the laws of my state, cities, and counties. I wanted to KNOW that I KNOW I can do it and why I can do it. Get some pat answers for the standard questions you might get.

Is that legal?
Why do you carry a gun?
Are you a cop? etc etc

At 18 you will most likely get a different reaction than maybe an older guy that OC's. It's just life. Be ready for it. Once you know the law for yourself, don't take folks word. Look it up yourself. Then you can make an informed decision. Check out opencarry and look up your state forum. YOu can ask state specific questions in there and get good answers. Ask here too. There seems to be a different tone between the two boards so you'll get a well rounded response.

OpenCarry.org - Discussion Forum

Good luck.

12Rounds · October 11th, 2009, 03:47 AM

[QUOTE=Spec;1330561]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jofrdo

The argument about criminals targeting a guy with an openly displayed gun doesn't mean that bad guys will be more likely to target him for robbery. The thinking is that if criminals come into a place (bank, convenience store, etc.) with the intent to rob the place and notice an armed customer, they may just shoot him first, before they even announce the robbery, and before the armed customer is aware enough to draw, whereas a customer in the same place carrying concealed would have the element of surprise going for him, and might have a better chance of defending himself and others.

my dad has his cpl he is not against it he just doesn't like the whole thing about this example above...^^^

Ever hear of it happening ? Anywhere ? It's probably more likely that they'd just wait until you leave to rob the bank. What are the odds anyway of something like that happening ? Seriously, so small that it's not even worth thinking about. You could also be hit by lightning or have a building collapse on your head, at least you actually hear of cases where those things happen.
If we want things to be afraid of we'll never run out of imagined bogey-men.

Good luck.

automatic slim · October 11th, 2009, 08:18 AM

OC might not necessarily make you a target, but you certainly lose the element of surprise.

Pikachu711 · October 11th, 2009, 08:45 AM

I OC to & from work whenever I work. Keep in mind that I'm a security guard. I can only assume that the majority of the people I encounter assume that carrying a firearm is part of my job. No one has ever questioned why I OC to & from work. I prefer to open carry when it's convenient & most practical. I've only had a few negative experiences while OC'ing. One was a LE encounter when I was detained. This encounter taught me a great deal about LE encounters. As a result of this encounter I'm now better prepared with good information on my next LE encounter. This first negative experience, with the advice of some the members here, will NOT be repeated. Thanks everyone who replied to my posting!

Several other encounters involved Wal Mart employees. The WM encounters I managed to resolve with the assistance of supervisory personnel at the local level. This was quite an education for me on many levels.

On days I don't work I prefer to CC. The element of surprise has a great deal to do with why I prefer to CC on days I don't work.

There are pros & cons when you OC. There is no way of knowing what will happen any given day. Keep in mind that if you OC you may experience a great variety of attitudes from the public as well as LE personnel. You should be ready for both of these responses.

Automatic slim does raise a valid point. You will lose the element of surprise if you OC. As I've read in an article posted in this forum in the past, "you can't outdraw a drawn gun." That's the benefit of CC.

Hopefully my comments here will help you decide if OC is something you want to try. There are pros & cons to be considered in this type carry.

Rugergirl · October 11th, 2009, 11:21 AM

18 and OC in the Metro Detroit Area?
Get ready to be the center of a lot of attention, 99% of it not positive.
I live in the Metro Detroit area and I don't OC in "public areas". In the middle of Lake St. Clair on the boat, sure, at the sportsmans club sure. Anywhere else, no.
Local law enforcement varies by city as far as the response you will get. I was just discussing open carry with the owner of a local gun shop and his thoughts on it. He told me that Ferndale will taze you on the spot. Many other suburbs don't like the idea either and the response might not be much better.
Public perception is another thing to consider. Many of the anti's will come completely unglued if they see it. MWAG calls will follow, bringing local law enforcement in "hot" depending on how that caller reports the "incident".
At 18, I have no problem with you wanting to carry, around here I encourage it, but OC is something that brings a lot of attention, and that is something you need to be prepared for.
As much as I hate to say it that attention will be a lot more negative than positive. Many people aren't aware of the firearms laws of Michigan, including law enforcement.
Remember as well, the minute you get into any vehicle, by MI law your firearm is now considered concealed. You are required without a CPL in MI to disarm before you get in, and follow the laws for transporting a firearm without a CPL, unloaded, in a case, with the ammo stored separately and not accessible to the occupants of the vehicle.
There is a lot to consider, I would suggest checking the MSP website and downloading the Michigan Firearms Law, here is the link:
http://www.legislature.mi.gov/docume...s/firearms.pdf

There is a lot to think about, and only you can make the decision, but consider it very carefully.

BTW, check your private messages.

October 11th, 2009, 02:11 AM	#25
Spec Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Metro Detroit Area Posts: 71	[QUOTE=jofrdo;1330420]The argument about criminals targeting a guy with an openly displayed gun doesn't mean that bad guys will be more likely to target him for robbery. The thinking is that if criminals come into a place (bank, convenience store, etc.) with the intent to rob the place and notice an armed customer, they may just shoot him first, before they even announce the robbery, and before the armed customer is aware enough to draw, whereas a customer in the same place carrying concealed would have the element of surprise going for him, and might have a better chance of defending himself and others. my dad has his cpl he is not against it he just doesn't like the whole thing about this example above...^^^ __________________ "A well regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained in arms, is the best most natural defense of a free country." ~James Madison Land of the Free BECAUSE of the Brave. 911 Oper:Hello what is the problem? Homeowner: Send an Ambulance someone broke into my house..BANG!!

October 11th, 2009, 08:18 AM	#28
automatic slim Distinguished Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: The western edge of The Confederacy Posts: 1,222	OC might not necessarily make you a target, but you certainly lose the element of surprise. __________________ "First gallant South Carolina nobly made the stand." Edge of Darkness

October 11th, 2009, 08:45 AM	#29
Pikachu711 VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 2,094	I OC to & from work whenever I work. Keep in mind that I'm a security guard. I can only assume that the majority of the people I encounter assume that carrying a firearm is part of my job. No one has ever questioned why I OC to & from work. I prefer to open carry when it's convenient & most practical. I've only had a few negative experiences while OC'ing. One was a LE encounter when I was detained. This encounter taught me a great deal about LE encounters. As a result of this encounter I'm now better prepared with good information on my next LE encounter. This first negative experience, with the advice of some the members here, will NOT be repeated. Thanks everyone who replied to my posting! Several other encounters involved Wal Mart employees. The WM encounters I managed to resolve with the assistance of supervisory personnel at the local level. This was quite an education for me on many levels. On days I don't work I prefer to CC. The element of surprise has a great deal to do with why I prefer to CC on days I don't work. There are pros & cons when you OC. There is no way of knowing what will happen any given day. Keep in mind that if you OC you may experience a great variety of attitudes from the public as well as LE personnel. You should be ready for both of these responses. Automatic slim does raise a valid point. You will lose the element of surprise if you OC. As I've read in an article posted in this forum in the past, "you can't outdraw a drawn gun." That's the benefit of CC. Hopefully my comments here will help you decide if OC is something you want to try. There are pros & cons to be considered in this type carry. __________________ "80 Million gun owners can't be wrong!" Glock 26 (9mm) Nevada CFP Holder NRA Member

October 11th, 2009, 11:21 AM	#30
Rugergirl Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,193	18 and OC in the Metro Detroit Area? Get ready to be the center of a lot of attention, 99% of it not positive. I live in the Metro Detroit area and I don't OC in "public areas". In the middle of Lake St. Clair on the boat, sure, at the sportsmans club sure. Anywhere else, no. Local law enforcement varies by city as far as the response you will get. I was just discussing open carry with the owner of a local gun shop and his thoughts on it. He told me that Ferndale will taze you on the spot. Many other suburbs don't like the idea either and the response might not be much better. Public perception is another thing to consider. Many of the anti's will come completely unglued if they see it. MWAG calls will follow, bringing local law enforcement in "hot" depending on how that caller reports the "incident". At 18, I have no problem with you wanting to carry, around here I encourage it, but OC is something that brings a lot of attention, and that is something you need to be prepared for. As much as I hate to say it that attention will be a lot more negative than positive. Many people aren't aware of the firearms laws of Michigan, including law enforcement. Remember as well, the minute you get into any vehicle, by MI law your firearm is now considered concealed. You are required without a CPL in MI to disarm before you get in, and follow the laws for transporting a firearm without a CPL, unloaded, in a case, with the ammo stored separately and not accessible to the occupants of the vehicle. There is a lot to consider, I would suggest checking the MSP website and downloading the Michigan Firearms Law, here is the link: http://www.legislature.mi.gov/docume...s/firearms.pdf There is a lot to think about, and only you can make the decision, but consider it very carefully. BTW, check your private messages. __________________ Disclaimer: The posts made by this member are only the members opinion, not a reflection on anyone else, nor the group, and should not be cause for anyone to get their undergarments wedged in an uncomfortable position. Last edited by Rugergirl; October 11th, 2009 at 10:52 PM..

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October 10th, 2009, 05:56 PM	#21
12Rounds Ex Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: This Planet Rocks ! Posts: 160	I highly doubt that having a gun on you makes you more vulnerable...think about it, would a criminal go after a guy carrying a baseball bat ? A machete ? A hatchet ? A spear..etc ? Of course not. Being armed makes you dangerous prey, instead of an easy meal. I'd be very surprised if there are any cases where a criminal went after a harder target versus an easier one, it just flies in the face of logic . There are much easier ways for criminals to get guns than taking them off of armed citizens, it's easier to steal from a home, car, buy one off the street or have some one do a straw purchase. I believe that the "it'll make you a target " argument is debunked easily by the absence of evidence to the contrary. If it was true, we'd hear about it a lot. Carry however YOU want, but always carry.

October 10th, 2009, 11:55 PM	#22
jofrdo Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Chesapeake, Virginia Posts: 646	The argument about criminals targeting a guy with an openly displayed gun doesn't mean that bad guys will be more likely to target him for robbery. The thinking is that if criminals come into a place (bank, convenience store, etc.) with the intent to rob the place and notice an armed customer, they may just shoot him first, before they even announce the robbery, and before the armed customer is aware enough to draw, whereas a customer in the same place carrying concealed would have the element of surprise going for him, and might have a better chance of defending himself and others. I personally pick and choose where I open carry. When I go to the bank, I choose a branch with a walk-up ATM. I don't like drive-up machines because it's hard to draw and defend myself from a seated postition. This is a different situation from the above. If a bad guy is lurking to rob an ATM customer, he's likely to stay in hiding if an obviously armed customer approaches, whereas he might make his move on a concealed carrying customer. You can debate it with you father until you both die of old age. But if open carry is your only option due to your age, it becomes a no-brainer; open carry. Also, remember that one of the biggest reasons to open carry is the ability to desensitize the pubic to seeing other citizens carry guns.

October 11th, 2009, 02:37 AM	#26
chiefjason Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Hickory, NC Posts: 230	For me, I took about 2 months to really look into the laws of my state, cities, and counties. I wanted to KNOW that I KNOW I can do it and why I can do it. Get some pat answers for the standard questions you might get. Is that legal? Why do you carry a gun? Are you a cop? etc etc At 18 you will most likely get a different reaction than maybe an older guy that OC's. It's just life. Be ready for it. Once you know the law for yourself, don't take folks word. Look it up yourself. Then you can make an informed decision. Check out opencarry and look up your state forum. YOu can ask state specific questions in there and get good answers. Ask here too. There seems to be a different tone between the two boards so you'll get a well rounded response. OpenCarry.org - Discussion Forum Good luck.