Granular leavin's in the barrel and chamber using Accurate #5&7

Sticks · December 30th, 2008, 08:50 AM

For those of you that have been keeping up on my "Newbie Reloading Saga", I made it my shooting area yesterday to test fire another batch of .44 mag, and 2 batches of .40S&W.

First off, my primer issue with my .40 has been solved, I was not seating them deep enough. I made up a batch of 50 rounds using the same old Remington primers, seating them right to the point that I was getting a very slight dent in the primer, and Hodgden Universal. Every one went "BANG" just like they were supposed to on the first trigger pull.

Since the last time that I shot, I finally managed to get some Accurate powder (#5 for my .40 and #7 for my .44mag - I have factory load data to match my Ranier Bullets). That was the second batch. For my .40 I started out at the bottom of the load range, and felt recoil was equal to my factory reloads with the tight crimp, so I will stick with that.

My .44mag were at the midpoint on the load range was enough to cycle the slide on my Desert Eagle (first run with Hodgden Universal did not), felt recoil was just a little lower than my factory rounds so I will probably stick with that as it will be a PITA to juggle disks around to pick up the .4 grains that will put me at the top of the load range.

OK. Now I come to it. When I was done and putting my SD rounds back in the guns, I dropped a .44 round down the pipe and it "lodged" about half way in. I removed the round and looked in the chamber and I observed what appeared to be sand in the chamber. I thought that since I had been climbing in and out of the back of my truck that I might have gotten a little bit in there, blew it out, dropped the round back in, it seated. Good to go.

I then proceeded to load up my 40 from the mag, no problems, finished policing my brass, packed up the rest of my crap and headed home.

Last night I loaded up the rest of my paltry 100 cases of .44 including the 8 that I shot. The ones that I shot had itty bitty dents in the case, I now presume was from this granular leavin's. I decided to brake down my .44 and I noticed some granular leavings in the barrel and still in the chamber. I then broke down my .40 and observed the same thing (no chance of getting sand there, it was either in my hand or in my holster). I have not looked over the .40 brass from yesterday yet.

The only thing that I can figure is that this is leavin's from the powder. The size of the granules appeared to be the same size as the powder granules, except instead of being black, they were a light golden tan (like beach sand).

Is this normal for Accurate Powders? I have never noticed any other ammo shot from any of my guns leaving anything other than smoke silt behind.

If not, what am I doing wrong?

NOTE - the powder is certainly new since It was by sheer luck that I managed to get some at Sportsman's Warehouse as they are usually sold out within 3 days of restock. Storage has been in the factory bottle, with the factory foam seal placed back on top before I secure the lid. Kept in my heated garage. Colorado is not known for it's high humidity levels.

Anyone?

HotGuns · December 30th, 2008, 09:14 AM

Yes it is normal and nothing to worry about.

I use AA 5# for all of my midrange pistol loads, including the .44 with cast bullets.

You'll need close to a full charge to cycle a Desert Eagle .44. You might be better served with AA#9.It burns a bit hotter and you'd probably see less powder residue.

Sticks · December 30th, 2008, 09:26 AM

Thanks Hot Guns.

The only thing that concerns me is that it dented (lots of tiny dents) my .44 brass, which indicates that it was in the chamber when the next round entered, and upon firing, the case expanded and subsequently smashed upon the leavin's.

I have new slide springs, but when the slide returns to battery, it does not take much to keep it from going all the way, thus she will not fire. I am actually more concerned that he leavin's will damage the chamber than anything.

After I run through this batch, I will try to up the powder. Accurate has load info for the DE, but using JHP not plated FP. My load data for the Ranier FP maxes at 16.8gr and I am at 16.4gr.

coffeecup · December 30th, 2008, 09:46 AM

MIght want to drop he powder charge a bit and try mag primers. Sounds like you arent getting proper ignition----or---- just INCREASE the powder charge a little to raise chamber pressure and get a better/cleaner burn.

Sticks · December 30th, 2008, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coffeecup

MIght want to drop he powder charge a bit and try mag primers. Sounds like you arent getting proper ignition----or---- just INCREASE the powder charge a little to raise chamber pressure and get a better/cleaner burn.

OK, I'll try to raise the powder on the .44, and since I inadvertently picked up some Magnum primers for my .40, I will leave that powder where it is at, since I am at the bottom of the load range.

cvhoss · December 30th, 2008, 01:02 PM

Just a couple of things that I haven't seen mentioned.

Try to flare the case neck as little as possible. Just enough to allow the bullet to start in the case without damaging the case. This will provide the greatest neck tension.

Check your crimp and make sure it is very firm, especially on the 44. Magnum cartridges need a firm crimp to retard the bullet separation long enough for complete ignition.

Also, I haven't noticed it but I assume you are using 240 gr. bullets in the 44. The Accurate on-line data does give a specific charge weight using #7 and 240 gr. Rainier FP bullets which confirms what you listed as your maximum charge weight:

No.7 240 RAN FP 15.0 1,264 16.8 1,437 37,300 1.575

All in all, the powder residue you are seeing is not uncommon. I have found the Accurate line of powders to be some of the cleanest burning that I've used. It does sometimes take a bit of trial and error to find the best one for a particular gun/cartridge combination.

Hoss

HotGuns · December 30th, 2008, 01:05 PM

Quote:

I have found the Accurate line of powders to be some of the cleanest burning that I've used

Ditto that.

DMan · December 30th, 2008, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sticks

OK, I'll try to raise the powder on the .44, and since I inadvertently picked up some Magnum primers for my .40, I will leave that powder where it is at, since I am at the bottom of the load range.

You anwered your own question - you are at the bottom of your range load. If you have a minimum charge, the powder is not as dense as it could be, allowing for more powder to not be fully ignited. I found this out when I was shooting some .357 with loads to match a .38 Special. The powder would fall away from the primer and not be get fully ignited allowing for very poor performance.

Definatly bring your charge up! Don't over do it however.

Jeff F · December 30th, 2008, 10:54 PM

44 mag requires a magnum primer and a good heavy crimp for a good burn with about any powder. I prefer 2400 in my 44 and 357. Wish I still had my Desert Eagle that I sold many years back. Great gun except for that trigger

December 30th, 2008, 08:50 AM	#1
Sticks Distinguished Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,543	Granular leavin's in the barrel and chamber using Accurate #5&7 For those of you that have been keeping up on my "Newbie Reloading Saga", I made it my shooting area yesterday to test fire another batch of .44 mag, and 2 batches of .40S&W. First off, my primer issue with my .40 has been solved, I was not seating them deep enough. I made up a batch of 50 rounds using the same old Remington primers, seating them right to the point that I was getting a very slight dent in the primer, and Hodgden Universal. Every one went "BANG" just like they were supposed to on the first trigger pull. Since the last time that I shot, I finally managed to get some Accurate powder (#5 for my .40 and #7 for my .44mag - I have factory load data to match my Ranier Bullets). That was the second batch. For my .40 I started out at the bottom of the load range, and felt recoil was equal to my factory reloads with the tight crimp, so I will stick with that. My .44mag were at the midpoint on the load range was enough to cycle the slide on my Desert Eagle (first run with Hodgden Universal did not), felt recoil was just a little lower than my factory rounds so I will probably stick with that as it will be a PITA to juggle disks around to pick up the .4 grains that will put me at the top of the load range. OK. Now I come to it. When I was done and putting my SD rounds back in the guns, I dropped a .44 round down the pipe and it "lodged" about half way in. I removed the round and looked in the chamber and I observed what appeared to be sand in the chamber. I thought that since I had been climbing in and out of the back of my truck that I might have gotten a little bit in there, blew it out, dropped the round back in, it seated. Good to go. I then proceeded to load up my 40 from the mag, no problems, finished policing my brass, packed up the rest of my crap and headed home. Last night I loaded up the rest of my paltry 100 cases of .44 including the 8 that I shot. The ones that I shot had itty bitty dents in the case, I now presume was from this granular leavin's. I decided to brake down my .44 and I noticed some granular leavings in the barrel and still in the chamber. I then broke down my .40 and observed the same thing (no chance of getting sand there, it was either in my hand or in my holster). I have not looked over the .40 brass from yesterday yet. The only thing that I can figure is that this is leavin's from the powder. The size of the granules appeared to be the same size as the powder granules, except instead of being black, they were a light golden tan (like beach sand). Is this normal for Accurate Powders? I have never noticed any other ammo shot from any of my guns leaving anything other than smoke silt behind. If not, what am I doing wrong? NOTE - the powder is certainly new since It was by sheer luck that I managed to get some at Sportsman's Warehouse as they are usually sold out within 3 days of restock. Storage has been in the factory bottle, with the factory foam seal placed back on top before I secure the lid. Kept in my heated garage. Colorado is not known for it's high humidity levels. Anyone? __________________ Sticks Curiosity was framed, poor judgment killed the cat A Government is comprised of a body of people notably ungoverned Three can keep a secret if two are dead

December 30th, 2008, 09:14 AM	#2
HotGuns Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Arkansas Posts: 7,599	Yes it is normal and nothing to worry about. I use AA 5# for all of my midrange pistol loads, including the .44 with cast bullets. You'll need close to a full charge to cycle a Desert Eagle .44. You might be better served with AA#9.It burns a bit hotter and you'd probably see less powder residue. __________________ AR. CHL Instr. To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical. Thomas Jefferson

December 30th, 2008, 09:26 AM	#3
Sticks Distinguished Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,543	Thanks Hot Guns. The only thing that concerns me is that it dented (lots of tiny dents) my .44 brass, which indicates that it was in the chamber when the next round entered, and upon firing, the case expanded and subsequently smashed upon the leavin's. I have new slide springs, but when the slide returns to battery, it does not take much to keep it from going all the way, thus she will not fire. I am actually more concerned that he leavin's will damage the chamber than anything. After I run through this batch, I will try to up the powder. Accurate has load info for the DE, but using JHP not plated FP. My load data for the Ranier FP maxes at 16.8gr and I am at 16.4gr. __________________ Sticks Curiosity was framed, poor judgment killed the cat A Government is comprised of a body of people notably ungoverned Three can keep a secret if two are dead

December 30th, 2008, 01:02 PM	#6
cvhoss Distinguished Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Kansas Posts: 1,789	Just a couple of things that I haven't seen mentioned. Try to flare the case neck as little as possible. Just enough to allow the bullet to start in the case without damaging the case. This will provide the greatest neck tension. Check your crimp and make sure it is very firm, especially on the 44. Magnum cartridges need a firm crimp to retard the bullet separation long enough for complete ignition. Also, I haven't noticed it but I assume you are using 240 gr. bullets in the 44. The Accurate on-line data does give a specific charge weight using #7 and 240 gr. Rainier FP bullets which confirms what you listed as your maximum charge weight: No.7 240 RAN FP 15.0 1,264 16.8 1,437 37,300 1.575 All in all, the powder residue you are seeing is not uncommon. I have found the Accurate line of powders to be some of the cleanest burning that I've used. It does sometimes take a bit of trial and error to find the best one for a particular gun/cartridge combination. Hoss __________________ I ain't as good as I once was, but I'm as good once as I always was Sig 239 SAS 40 S&W / Sig 239 9mm / Kahr PM-9 / Walther PPS .40 / Sig P-245 / Ruger LCP Beretta Tomcat / Walther PPK / BDA 380 / Taurus 85 / Kel-Tec PF-9 / Am. Derringer 357 NRA Life Member My Web Site

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December 30th, 2008, 09:46 AM	#4
coffeecup Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Cadiz,Ky Posts: 780	MIght want to drop he powder charge a bit and try mag primers. Sounds like you arent getting proper ignition----or---- just INCREASE the powder charge a little to raise chamber pressure and get a better/cleaner burn.

December 30th, 2008, 10:54 PM	#9
Jeff F Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: South Central Wyoming Posts: 292	44 mag requires a magnum primer and a good heavy crimp for a good burn with about any powder. I prefer 2400 in my 44 and 357. Wish I still had my Desert Eagle that I sold many years back. Great gun except for that trigger __________________ "Those who would give up essential liberties for a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty or safety" -Benjamin Franklin- __________________________________ NRA Endowment Life Member