Brazil - anti gun reforendum - fails!!!

P95Carry · October 24th, 2005, 11:24 AM

Interesting news - equally interesting is some of the ''leftist'' slant in the reporting. In fact several classic statements which I am sure you'll see all too clearly reading thru.

Overall a victory it'd seem for common sense - most of that being that the BG's would never relinquish their guns - as is the case anywhere on the planet in principle.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9797322/

Quote:

RIO DE JANEIRO, Brazil - Brazilians soundly rejected a proposal to ban the sale of guns in a national referendum Sunday, striking down the bid to stem one of the world's highest firearm murder rates following a campaign that drew parallels to the U.S. gun control debate.

Brazil has 100 million fewer citizens than the United States, but a staggering 25 percent more gun deaths at nearly 40,000 a year. While supporters argued that gun control was the best way to staunch the violence, opponents played on Brazilians? fears that the police can?t protect them.

''I don't like people walking around armed on the street. But since all the bandits have guns, you need to have a gun at home,'' said taxi driver Mohammed Osei, who voted against the ban.

With more than 92 percent of the votes counted, 64 percent of Brazilians were opposed to the ban, while 36 percent backed it, said election officials, giving the ''no'' position an insurmountable lead.

The proposal would have prohibited the sale of firearms and ammunition except for police, the military, some security guards, gun collectors and sports shooters. It would complement a 2003 disarmament law that sharply restricts who can legally purchase firearms and carry guns in the street.

That law, coupled with a government-sponsored gun buyback program, has reduced deaths from firearms by about 8 percent this year, the Health Ministry said.

Support for ban waned as vote neared
But the referendum backfired for proponents. Earlier this year, support for the ban was running as high as 80 percent. But in the weeks before the referendum, both sides were granted free time to present their cases on prime-time TV, and the pro-gun lobby began to grow.

Analysts said the pro-gun lobby benefited from equal time on television in the final weeks of the campaign and that they cannily cashed in on Brazilian skepticism of the police.

They ask the question: ''Do you feel protected and do you think the government is protecting you'' and the answer is a violent ''no'', said political scientist David Fleischer of the University of Brasilia.

The combination of Brazil's high gun-death rate and the nature of the debate over the right to gun ownership has drawn parallels to the gun debate in the United States.

The whole campaign (against the ban) was imported from the United States. They just translated a lot of material from the NRA, said Jessica Galeria, a Californian who researches gun violence with the Viva Rio think tank, referring to the National Rifle Association. Now, a lot of Brazilians are insisting on their right to bear arms, they don't even have a pseudo right to bear arms. It's not in their Constitution.

NRA hails vote as a ''victory for freedom''
NRA public affairs director Andrew Arulanandam called the proposal's defeat a victory for freedom.

''It's a stunning defeat for the global gun control movement. They poured millions of dollars and millions more man hours trying to enact this gun ban and they failed. The aim of this gun ban movement was to use Brazil as the rallying point to enact gun bans in the United States. We're happy they were defeated,'' he said.

Some Brazilians said they resented the referendum because they feel the government is ducking its responsibility to keep the peace.

''It's immoral for the government to have this vote'' said Pedro Ricardo, an army officer in Sao Paulo. ''They're putting the responsibility on us, but ... the way to cut down on violence is to combat the drug trade and patrol our borders.''

Supporters maintain the referendum is the only way to make Brazil safer.

''We have to change the violence in this country,'' said Paulo Leite, an engineer from the upscale Ipanema beach district.

About 39,000 people in Brazil are killed by guns each year, compared to about 30,000 people in the United States, although the U.S. population is about 100 million more than Brazil's, according to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

According to UNESCO, Brazil ranks second in deaths by guns, with 21.72 per 100,000 people a year. Venezuela has 34.3 gun deaths per 100,000.

But in shantytowns like Vila do Joao, the rate rises to around 150 per 100,000. And for males between 17 and 24, the death rate is closer to 250 per 100,000.

Bud White · October 24th, 2005, 11:29 AM

Good for them

RSSZ · October 24th, 2005, 01:31 PM

Interesting >>> 64% want guns /// 36% dont want guns. Wonder what a Nat'l vote in the US would tally. I would venture to guess,that it would be about the same. This would be sad. There are allot of people out there that don't have a clue what a gun even does but would vote"No Guns". I feel that the major reason behind a "NO GUN" vote in the US would be: "we have the police to protect us,why do ordenary civilians need to have all those gun's ??? What do you think that a Nat'l vote would yield?? The wording would make a huge difference I'm sure.---------

rstickle · October 24th, 2005, 01:39 PM

Chris, Thanks for posting that! I meant to check the vote and forgot. I'm happy the law was voted down.

Tangle · October 24th, 2005, 03:24 PM

Thanks for posting that! And, +1 on the leftist slant.

Scott · October 24th, 2005, 03:37 PM

Thanks for posting this info. Having just been there and talking to a few of the people about guns and the upcoming vote, the folks I talked to were mostly on the no side. They fear the drug gangs and there are areas the police just won't go. I did guess that the "protected" urbanites would be enough to pass this, but I'm glad to see they didn't.

Leftist slant in the media? No way. Don't you all know the vast right wing conspiracy controls the media?

-Scott-

P95Carry · October 24th, 2005, 04:53 PM

I am actually almost amazed, as well as pleased/relieved.

So much anti gun rhetoric gets thrown around, with so many sheep always assuming, because of accepting about anything they hear without thinking, ''guns gone, end of problem".

I maybe get most hot under the collar when told that ''people don't need guns'' - such a sweeping statement based for most part on gut emotion - again little real thought, or come to that, consideration for the law abiding folks.

So many ''solutions'' seem so easy don't they - with the right ''spin'' applied.

HollowpointHank · October 24th, 2005, 06:02 PM

I saw this article yesterday and couldn,t identify the link. Glad you found it and posted it. There was an article from a young lady in Concealed Carry Magazine that the reason she got into guns was because she was mugged in Brazil. She is now in the States and is heavy into gun rights. Way to go Brazil!!!

scbair · October 28th, 2005, 04:48 PM

I may be overly optimistic, but I believe this is one gungrab attempt that leftists the world over will come to regret! If they'd won, they'd use it as a reason to spread the concept. By losing (and pretty badly), it's obvious to all who look (although you gotta look; the mainstream media won't publicize it!) that we "common folk" are not as stupid as the gun-grabbers would like us to be!

Sheldon J · October 28th, 2005, 08:51 PM

Did it mention that of the 36% that voted aganst 34% were criminals? :)

October 24th, 2005, 01:39 PM	#4
rstickle Senior Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Laurel, MD Posts: 10,023	Chris, Thanks for posting that! I meant to check the vote and forgot. I'm happy the law was voted down. __________________ Rick EOD - Initial success or total failure

October 24th, 2005, 04:53 PM	#7
P95Carry Assistant Administrator Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: South West PA Posts: 25,366	I am actually almost amazed, as well as pleased/relieved. So much anti gun rhetoric gets thrown around, with so many sheep always assuming, because of accepting about anything they hear without thinking, ''guns gone, end of problem". I maybe get most hot under the collar when told that ''people don't need guns'' - such a sweeping statement based for most part on gut emotion - again little real thought, or come to that, consideration for the law abiding folks. So many ''solutions'' seem so easy don't they - with the right ''spin'' applied. __________________ Chris - P95 NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member. "To own a gun and assume that you are armed is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!." If a BG dies as the result of pointing a gun at me, then he has merely succumbed to an occupational hazard of being a thug

October 24th, 2005, 06:02 PM	#8
HollowpointHank Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: South Carolina Posts: 205	I saw this article yesterday and couldn,t identify the link. Glad you found it and posted it. There was an article from a young lady in Concealed Carry Magazine that the reason she got into guns was because she was mugged in Brazil. She is now in the States and is heavy into gun rights. Way to go Brazil!!! __________________ They'll get my gun when they pry it from my cold dead fingers!

October 28th, 2005, 08:51 PM	#10
Sheldon J Distinguished Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Battle Creek, Mi. Posts: 1,686	Did it mention that of the 36% that voted aganst 34% were criminals? :) __________________ "The sword dose not cause the murder, and the maker of the sword dose not bear sin" Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac 11th century

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October 24th, 2005, 11:29 AM	#2
Bud White VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Elsewhere Posts: 17,476	Good for them

October 24th, 2005, 01:31 PM	#3
RSSZ Distinguished Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: USA Posts: 1,847	Interesting >>> 64% want guns /// 36% dont want guns. Wonder what a Nat'l vote in the US would tally. I would venture to guess,that it would be about the same. This would be sad. There are allot of people out there that don't have a clue what a gun even does but would vote"No Guns". I feel that the major reason behind a "NO GUN" vote in the US would be: "we have the police to protect us,why do ordenary civilians need to have all those gun's ??? What do you think that a Nat'l vote would yield?? The wording would make a huge difference I'm sure.---------

October 24th, 2005, 03:24 PM	#5
Tangle Senior Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Chattanooga Posts: 5,793	Thanks for posting that! And, +1 on the leftist slant.

October 24th, 2005, 03:37 PM	#6
Scott Senior Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Old Dominion Posts: 4,469	Thanks for posting this info. Having just been there and talking to a few of the people about guns and the upcoming vote, the folks I talked to were mostly on the no side. They fear the drug gangs and there are areas the police just won't go. I did guess that the "protected" urbanites would be enough to pass this, but I'm glad to see they didn't. Leftist slant in the media? No way. Don't you all know the vast right wing conspiracy controls the media? -Scott-

October 28th, 2005, 04:48 PM	#9
scbair Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 76	I may be overly optimistic, but I believe this is one gungrab attempt that leftists the world over will come to regret! If they'd won, they'd use it as a reason to spread the concept. By losing (and pretty badly), it's obvious to all who look (although you gotta look; the mainstream media won't publicize it!) that we "common folk" are not as stupid as the gun-grabbers would like us to be!