UNR Police Chief and his officers prefer executions to defensive shootings.

TacticalCompact · May 21st, 2008, 10:04 PM

The Nevada Sagebrush - » States consider guns on campuses

Quote:

UNR Police Chief Adam Garcia said the police department would also be against any proposals to allow permit carriers to carry guns on campus, though they would enforce the policy if it did become law.

“Most police officers would rather respond to a shooting, not a shootout,” Garcia said.

So in other words, Chief Garcia is opposed to the idea of students being allowed to defend themselves because of an officers preference to the type of call they may find themselves responding to?

He doesn't want to have to go to a site where an intended victim stopped a threat in it's tracks. He would prefer to respond to the site of a slaughter where nobody had a chance.

What a (insert descriptive expletive here) guy.

MitchellCT · May 21st, 2008, 10:08 PM

Taking the concept of "officer safety" a little too far, are we?

SIXTO · May 21st, 2008, 10:19 PM

I think any sane person would rather respond to a shooting vs. a shootout... I dont see the big deal about that statement.

SelfDefense · May 21st, 2008, 10:32 PM

From the Nevada Sagebrush:

(Excuse the goofy characters...)

Quote:

Police vote against chief
BY BRIAN DUGGAN AND NICK COLTRAIN
TUESDAY, FEB. 26, 2008 @ 3:23 AM
Ten out of 16 officers and four sergeants in the University of Nevada, Reno Police Department said they have no confidence in police chief Adam Garcia, according to an undated three-page memo.The officers and sergeants who signed the document about two weeks ago say that the department â€œis not prepared for a major incident like Columbine or Virginia Techâ€ because of low staffing levels, poor equipment and little training.
The officers also accuse Garcia of neglecting their safety and being out of touch with the departmentâ€™s needs.
Ron Zurek, Garciaâ€™s immediate boss at the university, and Jannet Vreeland, the interim provost, met with the police sergeants Monday about their complaints. Vreeland said they are â€œgathering information.â€
They said it would be premature to comment further.
UNR President Milton Glick said the same, though he was disappointed that the complaint went public.
â€œI am very disappointed that the officers would have gone to the press with this, without going to Ron Zurek or me, especially in a time like this,â€ Glick said.
Garcia and Ron Cuzze, president of the Nevada State Law Enforcement Officersâ€™ Association, gave different twists on the same story. UNR police officers are not permitted to comment to the media.
Garcia calls the three-page complaint a â€œlaundry listâ€ of grievances meant to discredit the department.
â€œThis document is obviously so ambiguous (that) it says very little,â€ Garcia said. â€œThe way it was presented and produced, it was obviously presented for a reason; it wasnâ€™t meant to change things. It was meant to embarrass the department and the university.â€
Garcia questioned the motives behind releasing the memo to the media last week before he saw it. He called the act â€œcharacter assassination.â€
Cuzze said the officers, not the union released the information to the media. He said it was the only way for them to get leverage in working with the university administrators. In the memo, officers said the vote of no confidence made its first rounds in August. But Garcia held a meeting and promised to fix the problems, they said.
â€œThe last one (vote of no confidence) didnâ€™t work and the only way they (the officers) can get their voice heard is with the media,â€ Cuzze said.
He said Garcia has tried to retaliate and discredit the officers in press reports. Garcia told the Associated Press that he might change the work schedule to five 8-hour days instead of the four 10-hour days worked now.
Cuzze said that is Garcia sending veiled threats to his officers.
â€œPolice departments are run by intimidation and Garcia is one of the best intimidators and thatâ€™s ********,â€ Cuzze said. â€œThey (the officers) are tired of his intimidation and theyâ€™re fighting back and they wonâ€™t quit until he (Garcia) is gone.â€
When asked for a response to Cuzzeâ€™s comment, Garcia said, â€œI donâ€™t know what he means by (intimidation). Does he mean expecting people to do their job?â€
Garcia also raised questions of officers who are concerned about patrolling alone at night.
â€œI think itâ€™s ironic, whatâ€™s going on in our community that we have officers saying they donâ€™t want to do this (patrol alone),â€ Garcia said. â€œShame on them.â€
Garcia said â€œnone of these officers are being worked to deathâ€ and UNRPD doesnâ€™t need to hire more officers.
But officers want to do their jobs safely so they can keep the public safer, Cuzze said.
â€œThatâ€™s what the officers are really saying: stop telling these people (the public) lies, stop giving these people a false sense of security, give us the proper training and give us the proper equipment and let us do our job,â€ Cuzze said.

falcon1 · May 21st, 2008, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIXTO

I think any sane person would rather respond to a shooting vs. a shootout... I dont see the big deal about that statement.

I know and understand what you're saying..but I hope you'll forgive me if I would personally prefer LEOs respond to draw the chalk outline around the bad guy's body rather than around mine.

ccw9mm · May 21st, 2008, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TacticalCompact

He doesn't want to have to go to a site where an intended victim stopped a threat in it's tracks. He would prefer to respond to the site of a slaughter where nobody had a chance.

That's essentially what the guy is saying, yes, unthinking though that seems.

stanislaskasava · May 22nd, 2008, 12:13 AM

Quote:

UNR Police Chief Adam Garcia said the police department would also be against any proposals to allow permit carriers to carry guns on campus, though they would enforce the policy if it did become law.

“Most police officers would rather respond to a shooting, not a shootout,” Garcia said.

He is implying that allowing students to carry will cause 'shootouts', i.e. mayhem in the streets. The comment is more about the subtle smearing of concealed carry in general than about a logical preference of what situation an officer would prefer to respond to.

falcon1 · May 22nd, 2008, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stanislaskasava

He is implying that allowing students to carry will cause 'shootouts', i.e. mayhem in the streets. The comment is more about the subtle smearing of concealed carry in general than about a logical preference of what situation an officer would prefer to respond to.

I think you are correct. But the logical "reduction-to-absurdity" of his argument is that he believes LEOs would rather respond to dead victims than active shootings. As Sixto said, that is logical, as no sane person wants to be placed in harm's way by the actions of another...and we carry to be able to respond to such a threat. The chief seems to be discounting or dismissing that desire on the part of the law-abiding as unworthy of consideration. OMO, of course.

ccw9mm · May 22nd, 2008, 12:43 AM

Quote:

He is implying that allowing students to carry will cause 'shootouts', i.e. mayhem in the streets.

Undoubtedly, there will be the odd criminal, here and there, that just hasn't been caught carrying yet. A few will certainly begin carrying once they deem themselves legal, and some of them will certainly go sideways and show their colors. It's to be hoped that each is quickly and effectively stopped by a citizen who knows the appropriate use of defensive weapons. A little thinning of the evil end of the pool isn't exactly a bad thing. It's the whole point of the exercise, actually (jail if possible, else morgue if they insist). There IS a distinction between good shootings and bad, in that sense.

But, as we all know, even with more criminals opting for suicide-by-citizen, it ends up being nowhere near the "blood in the streets," sky-is-falling type scenario the anti-gunners so dreadfully fear. Hasn't happened anywhere in the U.S. that MORE guns in the hands of citizens has occurred.

SIXTO · May 22nd, 2008, 01:14 AM

Well I see my pot stirring got nipped in the bud...

I know nothing about Garcia, but making my judgment from the article that SelfDefense posted I would have to say Garcia is a goof, and to consider the institution that hired him as Chief.
I'll go out on a limb and take an educated guess that he his an academic type with little or no real world experience, police related or otherwise. If he has had a full career in police work, its been behind a desk. Unfortunately for us, these types of chiefs are becoming more and more common.

May 21st, 2008, 10:19 PM	#3
SIXTO VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Here and There Posts: 10,071	I think any sane person would rather respond to a shooting vs. a shootout... I dont see the big deal about that statement. __________________ In a land of sheep, even a toothless wolf is king. Wake Up! The zombie invasion has begun years ago.

May 22nd, 2008, 01:14 AM	#10
SIXTO VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Here and There Posts: 10,071	Well I see my pot stirring got nipped in the bud... I know nothing about Garcia, but making my judgment from the article that SelfDefense posted I would have to say Garcia is a goof, and to consider the institution that hired him as Chief. I'll go out on a limb and take an educated guess that he his an academic type with little or no real world experience, police related or otherwise. If he has had a full career in police work, its been behind a desk. Unfortunately for us, these types of chiefs are becoming more and more common. __________________ In a land of sheep, even a toothless wolf is king. Wake Up! The zombie invasion has begun years ago.

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May 21st, 2008, 10:08 PM	#2
MitchellCT Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Connecticut Posts: 746	Taking the concept of "officer safety" a little too far, are we?