Did you know we are all suicidal?

jonesy_26 · July 17th, 2008, 10:08 AM

Apparently, we gun owners are all high risk for offing ourselves.....just because we own guns, so says a flaming liberal Haahhvaad professor. The author of this article though gets kudos for really torching that concept in the light of logic.

Washington Times - CHAPMAN: Suicidal to buy a gun?

Quote:

COMMENTARY:

Americans often buy guns for self-defense, a purpose that now has Supreme Court validation. But according to advocates of gun control, those purchasers overlook the people who pose the greatest threat: themselves. Anyone who acquires a firearm, we are told, is inviting a bloody death by suicide.

So says Matthew Miller, a professor at the Harvard School of Public Health. "If you bought a gun today, I could tell you the risk of suicide to you and your family members is going to be two- to tenfold higher over the next 20 years," he told The Washington Post.

Since the chance of a gun being used for suicide is so much higher than the chance of it being used to prevent a murder, we would all be better off with fewer firearms around.

It's a rich irony - as though smoke alarms were increasing fire fatalities. But the argument raises two questions: Is it true? And, when it comes to gun control policy, does it matter?

As it turns out, the claims about guns and suicide don't stand up well to scrutiny. A 2004 report by the National Academy of Sciences was doubtful, noting that the alleged association is small and may be illusory.

Florida State University criminologist Gary Kleck says there are at least 13 published studies finding no meaningful connection between the rate of firearms and the rate of suicides. The consensus of experts, he says, is that an increase in gun ownership doesn't raise the number of people who kill themselves - only the number who do it with a gun.

That makes obvious sense. Someone who really wants to commit suicide doesn't need a .38, because alternative methods abound. Gun opponents, however, respond that guns inevitably raise the rate because they're uniquely lethal. Take away the gun, and you greatly increase the chance of survival.

But in his 1997 book, "Targeting Guns: Firearms and Their Control," Mr. Kleck points out that "suicide attempts with guns are only slightly more likely to end in death than those involving hanging, carbon monoxide poisoning, or drowning." It's not hard to think of some other pretty foolproof means of self-destruction - such as jumping off a tall (or even not so tall) building, stepping in front of a train or driving at 80 miles per hour into a telephone pole.

People who use guns are generally hell-bent on ending their lives. So deprived of a sidearm, they will no doubt find another reliable method - rather than swallow a dozen aspirin and wake up in the emergency room. Banning guns is no more likely to reduce suicides than banning ice cream is to curb obesity.

A few decades ago, various European countries changed the type of natural gas used for home heating and cooking - replacing a toxic form with a harmless variety. That step eliminated one time-tested way of killing oneself. Alas, while the number of gas suicides declined, in most of these countries, the death toll didn't.

The same pattern holds for guns. The National Academy of Sciences report noted that any link between firearms and suicides "is not found in comparisons across countries." The number of guns in a nation tells you nothing about its suicide rate.

But let's suppose science could establish that people who obtain firearms do indeed increase their death rate (or the death rate of their family members) from suicide. So what?

Buying a car may shorten your lifespan, since traffic accidents are a major killer. Building a backyard swimming pool creates a potential fatal hazard to you and your loved ones. But nobody says the government should interfere with such decisions.

Personal safety is a far more central matter of individual autonomy than those choices. A mentally stable person living in a crime-ridden neighborhood should be free to judge whether she is more at risk from street criminals than from a spell of intense depression.

Presumptuous paternalists argue that Americans should be deprived of guns because gun owners are their own worst enemies. A lot of Americans would reply: We can't trust ourselves, but we can trust you?

Steve Chapman is a nationally syndicated columnist.

I need to write a note to remind myself to throw away the spare tire for my truck, I might be prone to get a flat tire. And get rid of the matches, I might suddleny get the urge to burn my house down. I hope all americans see this the way it should be understood. At least one guy at Harvard doesn't...and where there's one there are more....kind of like roaches....

4my son · July 17th, 2008, 10:53 AM

The voices in my head are telling me to go home and clean my guns. They have no patients for egg head libs with to much education and no common sense.

I guess I enjoy living life unburdened by all those smarts.

AEA · July 17th, 2008, 10:59 AM

Unfortunately, the way things are going, that Guy from Harvard could end up as a Supreme Court Justice one day.........

Cupcake · July 17th, 2008, 11:04 AM

Sorry, I just don't view suicide as always a terrible, tragic thing. Often it is premature, the easy way out, or just plain selfish, but sometimes life really is more terrible than death.

4my son · July 17th, 2008, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AEA

Unfortunately, the way things are going, that Guy from Harvard could end up as a Supreme Court Justice one day.........

Now that will give me nightmares.

Thanks AEA

retsupt99 · July 17th, 2008, 11:35 AM

I wonder what he thinks about 'rope' owners? Or 'sleeping pill' owners?

Paco · July 17th, 2008, 11:36 AM

As Glenn Beck would say, I need to warp duct tape around my head to keep it from exploding.

HOLY CRAP, these are the stupidest smart people I have ever seen in my life!

sniper58 · July 17th, 2008, 11:38 AM

I can't believe (well, maybe I can) anyone let this clown submit his dissertation without any form of statistical evidence to support his claims.

July 17th, 2008, 10:53 AM	#2
4my son Distinguished Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Out side of Richmond, VA Posts: 1,453	The voices in my head are telling me to go home and clean my guns. They have no patients for egg head libs with to much education and no common sense. I guess I enjoy living life unburdened by all those smarts. __________________ "fundamental principle of American law that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any individual citizen." [Warren v. District of Columbia,(D.C. Ct. of Ap., 1981)] If I have to explain it, you wouldn't understand

July 17th, 2008, 11:04 AM	#4
Cupcake VIP Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Michigan Posts: 2,532	Sorry, I just don't view suicide as always a terrible, tragic thing. Often it is premature, the easy way out, or just plain selfish, but sometimes life really is more terrible than death. __________________ Pain is temporary, quitting is forever. www.zerotoathlete.blogspot.com My journey to fitness.

July 17th, 2008, 11:35 AM	#6
retsupt99 VIP Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Central Florida Posts: 13,202	I wonder what he thinks about 'rope' owners? Or 'sleeping pill' owners? __________________ "That I cannot do." "Give this to, uh, Clemenza. I want reliable people, people who aren't going to be carried away. After all we're not murderers in spite of what this undertaker thinks." *********************************** McCain/Palin 2008 NRA Life Member

July 17th, 2008, 11:36 AM	#7
Paco Distinguished Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: McKinney, TX Posts: 1,316	As Glenn Beck would say, I need to warp duct tape around my head to keep it from exploding. HOLY CRAP, these are the stupidest smart people I have ever seen in my life! __________________ "Don't hit at all if you can help it; don't hit a man if you can possibly avoid it; but if you do hit him, put him to sleep." - Theodore Roosevelt If you are not willing to stand behind our Troops, feel free to stand in front of them! -Paco

July 17th, 2008, 11:38 AM	#8
sniper58 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Colorado Posts: 966	I can't believe (well, maybe I can) anyone let this clown submit his dissertation without any form of statistical evidence to support his claims. __________________ Tim BE PREPARED - Noah didn't build the Ark when it was raining! The price of freedom is eternal vigilance. Thomas Jefferson ________ NRA Life Member

July 17th, 2008, 10:59 AM	#3
AEA Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: North Texas Posts: 80	Unfortunately, the way things are going, that Guy from Harvard could end up as a Supreme Court Justice one day.........

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