Is Former Washington Redskin, Ray Schoenke in 2A denial? (Merged)

762 · September 22nd, 2008, 12:36 PM

Campaign gun issue hits local firing range | chillicothegazette.com | Chillicothe Gazette

Quote:

Former Washington Redskin and president of the American Hunters and Shooters Association Ray Schoenke stopped in Clarksburg Wednesday to shoot a couple clay pigeons and talk about how the Second Amendment comes into play in the presidential campaign.
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"As a gun rights organization, we believe gun rights should be protected, and it's a right we feel strongly about," Schoenke said, adding he doesn't believe an administration under Barack Obama would decrease gun ownership rights.

"The Supreme Court has ruled the government can't take your guns away," he said. "Neither party is going to take your guns away."

There are differences of opinion on whether Obama's stance on gun ownership actually supports gun owners.

Schoenke said he believes Obama supports Second Amendment rights, including the right to bear arms, in the same manner as his opponent, John McCain. As a hunter, however, he thinks Obama would do a better job preserving land.

"His conservation stance and protection of the land is strong," Schoenke said. "As a hunter, what good is a gun if you have no land to hunt on."

Logan resident Mike Budzik, co-chair of the Ohio Sportsmen for McCain campaign, disagrees.

"Obama is an enemy of the Second Amendment," said Budzik. "He's opposed to concealed-carry laws, which we care about here in Ohio."

Obama has said on the record he would favor legislation tracking guns and gun owners who trade and sell guns illegally.

"His track record shows he is anti-gun, and Biden is also the same," said Budzik, pointing out the National Rifle Association has given him an "F" rating.

"It's America. I have the freedom to hunt and trap and fish, and it's locked up in our heritage," Budzik said. "If it weren't for the gun, we wouldn't be a free nation."

Accompanying Schoenke in Clarksburg was former Ohio lawmaker and Republican Rocky Saxbe, who said he also believes there are issues beyond the Second Amendment that should be more important to voters.

"They should not feel a threat to hunting rights or gun ownership with Obama," said Saxbe, a lifelong hunter and gun owner. "It's not the threat our guns will be taken away; it's the economy and economic challenges."

Schoenke agreed and said he believed McCain would bring poor leadership, just like his Republican predecessor, George W. Bush, if elected to the White House in November.

"We need sound leadership," he said. "Where I come from, if a coach has eight losing seasons, you don't hire the assistant the next year."

That approach has been reflected in the latest blitz of Obama campaign advertising that has begun to air in the broadcast media across the state in the past week.

i've started hearing this ads in Vegas and i am amazed at how ignorant this man can be. what credibility does the AHSA have? I have never heard of them until they endorsed the gun hater.

OPFOR · September 22nd, 2008, 12:46 PM

He's just a hunter (no disrespect to hunters, obviously), and like many hunters doesn't really see a connection with the 2A outside of hunting. It's the very old, very sad story of "well, they aren't after my (whatever), so I don't care if they take the (whatevers) away from those other folks. I don't think the schism between folks who only use guns to hunt and those of us who use them for defensive purposes will ever really be resolved...

Janq · September 22nd, 2008, 06:14 PM

I ran into this exact same thinking with another traditional background hunter that I know personally on Friday.
He stated to me in so many words to my face that people who conceal carry are "sketchy" and that he'd feel more comfortable with open carry though he saw no good need for citizens to be carrying at all. We had been discussing MA firearm laws and it's FID to LTC maze in regard to his ability to hunt in state.
He has no clue that I carry concealed, andat the moment I choose to not bring it up...as I was carrying right then concealed and being 'sketchy'.

Sadly many people and hunters in specific have the same view as the AHSA and Schoenke.
I'm working on my guy IRL although he's young, just turned 21, and likely won't hear what I'm saying for some time later when it comes back as a recollection. Which sadly may be too late for us all.

- Janq

obxned · September 22nd, 2008, 07:50 PM

He must have played a lot with no helmet.

press1280 · September 22nd, 2008, 09:14 PM

ASHA is NOT a gun rights organization. This is a ruse, kind of like a nation calling themselves People's Democratic Republic.

Army22rpr · September 22nd, 2008, 10:11 PM

Looks like another Obama coolaid drinker

rljohns · September 22nd, 2008, 10:43 PM

I beleive that the ASHA is actually associated with the Brady Bunch as a "Moderate" gun rights group. They use it to promote "gun owners fed up with the NRA".
Check out the link below.Gun Law News - American Hunters and Shooters Association

automatic slim · September 22nd, 2008, 10:50 PM

American Hunters and Shooters is a front organization for the anti-gun movement. Their ranks are primarily made up of individuals with deep roots in the anti-gun movement like Schoenke. They are as rediculous as John Kerry was, when he tried to portray himself as a hunter. In fact, they endorsed him.
Their goal is to trick people into voting for the wrong candidate and they consistantly endorse candidates with anti-gun, anti-hunting records like Obama.
AHSA has been unanamously denounced by the NRA, The Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms and the Second Amendment Foundation.

mlr1m · September 22nd, 2008, 11:04 PM

Alot of hunters that I have spoke with have bought into the media and governments view that a person doesn't need certain firearms.
I have heard many times that you don't need a 30 round magazine to hunt deer or rabbits with.

Many times I see pro 2nd amendment folks getting sucked into trying to counter this argument. The antis try to make it look like a hunting or sports shooting thing. We cant let this happen quietly.

The 2nd amendment has nothing to do with hunting or target practice so why try to argue the point with them?

Michael

kimberland · September 23rd, 2008, 12:39 AM

They are clear supporters of the Brady Campaign. Ray himself has contributed THOUSANDS of dollars to them.

NRA supports gun owners' rights, not radicals | greatfallstribune.com | Great Falls Tribune

September 22nd, 2008, 12:46 PM	#2
OPFOR VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Baghdad Posts: 2,418	He's just a hunter (no disrespect to hunters, obviously), and like many hunters doesn't really see a connection with the 2A outside of hunting. It's the very old, very sad story of "well, they aren't after my (whatever), so I don't care if they take the (whatevers) away from those other folks. I don't think the schism between folks who only use guns to hunt and those of us who use them for defensive purposes will ever really be resolved... __________________ "It makes no difference what men think of war, said the judge. War endures. As well ask men what they think of stone. War was always here. Before man was, war waited for him. The ultimate trade awaiting its ultimate practitioner. That is the way it was and will be. That way and not some other way."

September 22nd, 2008, 06:14 PM	#3
Janq VIP Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 2,882	I ran into this exact same thinking with another traditional background hunter that I know personally on Friday. He stated to me in so many words to my face that people who conceal carry are "sketchy" and that he'd feel more comfortable with open carry though he saw no good need for citizens to be carrying at all. We had been discussing MA firearm laws and it's FID to LTC maze in regard to his ability to hunt in state. He has no clue that I carry concealed, andat the moment I choose to not bring it up...as I was carrying right then concealed and being 'sketchy'. Sadly many people and hunters in specific have the same view as the AHSA and Schoenke. I'm working on my guy IRL although he's young, just turned 21, and likely won't hear what I'm saying for some time later when it comes back as a recollection. Which sadly may be too late for us all. - Janq __________________ "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy Monday, March 12, 2007 -- Op Ed -- The Washington Post

September 22nd, 2008, 07:50 PM	#4
obxned Distinguished Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: OBX, NC Posts: 1,736	He must have played a lot with no helmet. __________________ http://www.obxammo.com/ There is only one gun law in this country, the 2nd Amendment. All else is bureaucratic nonsense that I choose to comply with or not at my discretion. When governments make laws, they must consider the unintended consequences.

September 22nd, 2008, 09:14 PM	#5
press1280 Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: WV Posts: 369	ASHA is NOT a gun rights organization. This is a ruse, kind of like a nation calling themselves People's Democratic Republic. __________________ And if the cabin door of the freedman is broken open and the intruder enters for purposes as vile as were known to slavery, then should a well-loaded musket be in the hand of the occupant to send the polluted wretch to another world, where his wretchedness will forever remain complete

September 22nd, 2008, 10:11 PM	#6
Army22rpr Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Palmdale, CA Posts: 357	Looks like another Obama coolaid drinker __________________ Associate with men of good quality if you esteem your own reputation; for it is better to be alone than in bad company.- George Washington Serving Since 1985- "Airborne"

September 22nd, 2008, 10:43 PM	#7
rljohns Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Colorado Posts: 529	I beleive that the ASHA is actually associated with the Brady Bunch as a "Moderate" gun rights group. They use it to promote "gun owners fed up with the NRA". Check out the link below.Gun Law News - American Hunters and Shooters Association

September 22nd, 2008, 10:50 PM	#8
automatic slim Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: The Land of Enchantment Posts: 235	American Hunters and Shooters is a front organization for the anti-gun movement. Their ranks are primarily made up of individuals with deep roots in the anti-gun movement like Schoenke. They are as rediculous as John Kerry was, when he tried to portray himself as a hunter. In fact, they endorsed him. Their goal is to trick people into voting for the wrong candidate and they consistantly endorse candidates with anti-gun, anti-hunting records like Obama. AHSA has been unanamously denounced by the NRA, The Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms and the Second Amendment Foundation. __________________ "You lookin' for me Major?"

September 22nd, 2008, 11:04 PM	#9
mlr1m Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: okla Posts: 184	Alot of hunters that I have spoke with have bought into the media and governments view that a person doesn't need certain firearms. I have heard many times that you don't need a 30 round magazine to hunt deer or rabbits with. Many times I see pro 2nd amendment folks getting sucked into trying to counter this argument. The antis try to make it look like a hunting or sports shooting thing. We cant let this happen quietly. The 2nd amendment has nothing to do with hunting or target practice so why try to argue the point with them? Michael

September 23rd, 2008, 12:39 AM	#10
kimberland Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Cincinnati Posts: 133	They are clear supporters of the Brady Campaign. Ray himself has contributed THOUSANDS of dollars to them. NRA supports gun owners' rights, not radicals \| greatfallstribune.com \| Great Falls Tribune

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