(Utah Valley University student newspaper) Concealed weapons pose a threat to campus

cyberdogg · October 15th, 2009, 06:12 PM

How naive can they be? I'm a former student at UVU. I once wrote a letter to the editor complaining about negative imagery of a handgun for sensational graphic in "Police Blotter" section.

Editorial: Concealed weapons pose a threat to campus

BaserRonin · October 15th, 2009, 06:14 PM

Posted below so we don't give this site a lot of unwarranted hits. No reason to make them think it is a popular opinion.

Quote:

Editorial: Concealed weapons pose a threat to campus
By Editorial Board on 05 October 2009
Tags: Concealed Weapons, Guns

The College Republicans are hosting fundraisers Oct. 7-8 in which club members and guests will pay to be guided through the process of gaining a concealed weapons permit. Trainers certified by the NRA will take those who sign up through the entire process, save only licking the stamp and mailing off the papers.

The UVU Review editorial board wishes to question this fundraiser and address what we consider to be some serious issues with its taking place on this campus.
First, any attempt to put more weapons into people’s hands can only make the risk of violent crime worse. Our school is no safer for having 30 more concealed weapons on it at any given time. Precisely the opposite is true.

The more guns, the more opportunity for accidents, for misuse, for intentional crime in our halls and for the unimaginable catastrophes which have unfortunately befallen too many schools in the recent past.

Further, the College Republicans are raising money by putting more guns into this school. Given the problems, are you comfortable with this? We certainly are not.
While we cannot deny the legal right to those who wish to get concealed carry permits, we can question using the resources of the university to do so. There is something perverse in using our own campus’ resources, for which all students pay, to put those same students at risk. Regardless of the legality of concealed carry permits, there is an ethical contradiction here and another venue should have been found.

We must acknowledge that those who will attend this fundraiser are likely to be those who are responsible in the use of firearms, as they are clearly seeking to obtain permits through the appropriate legal means and with the right training. However, we do not feel this diminishes the problems we point out.

Here are some Center for Disease Control statistics on gun deaths from the year 2001:

* Suicide 16,869
* Homicide 11,348
* Accident 802
* Legal Intervention 323
* Undetermined 231
* Total 29,573

Guns, far more than making us safer, make it easier to kill either ourselves or kill others.

We also wish to ask this question: For what reason would someone wish to carry a firearm? Of course, it is only too obvious to respond, “Because it is my right.” That is entirely true, but it is at best a partial answer.

We feel that beyond the simple right to bear arms, there exists a tendency toward mistrust and fear in their use and ownership – the use of firearms to create a sense of safety based not on their capacity to protect, but rather the capacity to cause terror in others. If others are afraid, perhaps they will leave you alone.

This is simply too easy, and does nothing to engage other people in the real forum where safety is created – civil society and community. Provo and Orem are not safe because there are more guns, they are safe because by and large we understand, relate, and communicate with each other better than other places do. Getting to know your neighbors does more than any weapon will ever do to prevent the need for having to brandish a weapon.

Given all of the above, we can only condemn this fundraiser taking place on our campus.

chrise2004 · October 15th, 2009, 07:52 PM

classic b.s. argument i love the stats from the "Center for Disease Control statistics on gun deaths from the year 2001" how about we pull up the ones involving car accidents and then ban cars from campus?

When i was in college I didn't worry about a CHL holder accidentally shooting me... I worried about walking/riding my bike across campus and some idiot hitting me with his car. Some people just don't get it.

retsupt99 · October 15th, 2009, 08:21 PM

Simply put...

torgo1968 · October 15th, 2009, 11:27 PM

Quote:

We feel that beyond the simple right to bear arms, there exists a tendency toward mistrust and fear in their use and ownership – the use of firearms to create a sense of safety based not on their capacity to protect, but rather the capacity to cause terror in others. If others are afraid, perhaps they will leave you alone.

Of all their arguments, this one is the most bizarre. They are seeking concealed permits. Those who carry concealed take great pains to, oh, I don't know, CONCEAL the fact that they have a gun. Causing terror in others doesn't enter the equation. Good lord, what a stupid argument.

grady · October 16th, 2009, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by torgo1968

Of all their arguments, this one is the most bizarre. They are seeking concealed permits. Those who carry concealed take great pains to, oh, I don't know, CONCEAL the fact that they have a gun. Causing terror in others doesn't enter the equation. Good lord, what a stupid argument.

Agreed. I was going to quote the exact paragraph.

I don't carry a firearm to cause terror in others so they will leave me alone, I carry to have a chance at surviving an armed attack.

Plus, like you said, torgo, it's usually concealed, so I can't "cause terror in others" unless that person is an active threat to me. In that case, it's reasonable for me to "cause terror" among other things.

And the quotes from 2001...
Suicides: so if no gun was available, those people couldn't have found another way??? Yeh, right.

Homicides: proves the point of concealed carry to me. If those 11,348 murder victims had been armed, there wouldn't have been 11,348 of them.

What a waste of time to try and reason with someone like the author of that piece.

12Rounds · October 16th, 2009, 02:04 AM

Incredibly naive.
The only effective communication that a little old lady can have with the monster that plans to rape and kill her is "click, boom" .

PatrioticRick · October 16th, 2009, 06:37 AM

10 to 1 this person is an Out of Stater and see what happends when you let Out of Staters go to your schools, they write BS. If you don't like how they do it in Utah, don't got there, keep your a$$ in California. JMHO

Plop · October 16th, 2009, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BaserRonin

Posted below so we don't give this site a lot of unwarranted hits. No reason to make them think it is a popular opinion.

Excellent idea, thanks!

Quote:

This is simply too easy, and does nothing to engage other people in the real forum where safety is created – civil society and community. Provo and Orem are not safe because there are more guns, they are safe because by and large we understand, relate, and communicate with each other better than other places do. Getting to know your neighbors does more than any weapon will ever do to prevent the need for having to brandish a weapon.

Provo and Orem are safe because there are "more guns". Utah County is the most conservative county in the nation, with the city of Provo taking the title for the most conservative city in the US.
Another source.

An armed society is a polite society!

press1280 · October 16th, 2009, 10:14 PM

"The more guns, the more opportunity for accidents, for misuse, for intentional crime in our halls and for the unimaginable catastrophes which have unfortunately befallen too many schools in the recent past."

So someone with a legal CCW will all of a sudden decide, hey, I'm going to commit a crime today? They don't point out the "catastrophes" in schools were not comitted by CCW holders, and were able to kill at will until people with guns(police) showed up.

October 15th, 2009, 06:12 PM	#1
cyberdogg Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Salt Lake City, UT Posts: 52	(Utah Valley University student newspaper) Concealed weapons pose a threat to campus How naive can they be? I'm a former student at UVU. I once wrote a letter to the editor complaining about negative imagery of a handgun for sensational graphic in "Police Blotter" section. Editorial: Concealed weapons pose a threat to campus

October 15th, 2009, 07:52 PM	#3
chrise2004 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Southern IL Posts: 606	classic b.s. argument i love the stats from the "Center for Disease Control statistics on gun deaths from the year 2001" how about we pull up the ones involving car accidents and then ban cars from campus? When i was in college I didn't worry about a CHL holder accidentally shooting me... I worried about walking/riding my bike across campus and some idiot hitting me with his car. Some people just don't get it. __________________ Glock 27,Hi-Point .380, S&W 3913 NRA Member/Supporter "Government is not the solution to our problems; government is the problem." - President Ronald Reagan

October 15th, 2009, 08:21 PM	#4
retsupt99 VIP Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Central Florida Posts: 22,822	Simply put... __________________ "That I cannot do." "Give this to, uh, Clemenza. I want reliable people, people who aren't going to be carried away. After all we're not murderers in spite of what this undertaker thinks." *********************************** NRA Life Member

October 16th, 2009, 06:37 AM	#8
PatrioticRick VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Rigby, Idaho Posts: 4,691	10 to 1 this person is an Out of Stater and see what happends when you let Out of Staters go to your schools, they write BS. If you don't like how they do it in Utah, don't got there, keep your a$$ in California. JMHO __________________ Μολὼν λαβέ USN/USAF Retired/Desert Shield/Desert Storm DAV Life Member NRA Life Member

October 16th, 2009, 10:14 PM	#10
press1280 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: WV Posts: 591	"The more guns, the more opportunity for accidents, for misuse, for intentional crime in our halls and for the unimaginable catastrophes which have unfortunately befallen too many schools in the recent past." So someone with a legal CCW will all of a sudden decide, hey, I'm going to commit a crime today? They don't point out the "catastrophes" in schools were not comitted by CCW holders, and were able to kill at will until people with guns(police) showed up. __________________ And if the cabin door of the freedman is broken open and the intruder enters for purposes as vile as were known to slavery, then should a well-loaded musket be in the hand of the occupant to send the polluted wretch to another world, where his wretchedness will forever remain complete

October 16th, 2009, 02:04 AM	#7
12Rounds Ex Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: This Planet Rocks ! Posts: 160	Incredibly naive. The only effective communication that a little old lady can have with the monster that plans to rape and kill her is "click, boom" .

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