Tactical question for LEOs - Page 5

Tactical question for LEOs

This is a discussion on Tactical question for LEOs within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; You don't need to hear my side as a LEO as many have said what I would. Just remember one thing. Action is quicker than ...

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  1. #61
    Member Array ShenandoahValley's Avatar
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    You don't need to hear my side as a LEO as many have said what I would. Just remember one thing. Action is quicker than Reaction and this is so easily proven. You may have your weapon on them first but their Action and your slow reaction can be deadly for you.
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  2. #62
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    Somebody attempting to break into your house through a locked door or window attempting to gain unlawful entrance.
    I know in NC you didn't have to wait until they were inside if you were in fear.
    Sorry I wasn't clear.

  3. #63
    VIP Member Array SouthernBoyVA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Bob View Post
    In my state if someone forces into your house the assumption is that they are there to do violence.
    And I agree with that assumption. I am not a fan of our definition of someone breaking in during the day being called a trespasser.
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  5. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Instymp View Post
    Somebody attempting to break into your house through a locked door or window attempting to gain unlawful entrance.
    I know in NC you didn't have to wait until they were inside if you were in fear.
    Sorry I wasn't clear.
    Legality aside, I will be verbally encouraging them to stop what they are doing until such time as wood starts splintering or glass is breaking. Attempting to gain unlawful entrance covers a lot of ground, not all of it nefarious. Drunk people sometimes wind up at a mistaken door, and family members aren't always where we think they should be.

  6. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    Drunk people sometimes wind up at a mistaken door, and family members aren't always where we think they should be.
    Both these circumstances happen more often than most people realize.
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  7. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Bob View Post
    In my state if someone forces into your house the assumption is that they are there to do violence.
    I sure would not assume they were there to eat my porridge, sit in my chair, or sleep in my warm bed. Definitely not.
    Bad Bob, G-man*, Instymp and 4 others like this.
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  8. #67
    Senior Member Array Frodebro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Bob View Post
    In my state if someone forces into your house the assumption is that they are there to do violence.
    Same here. The verbiage in the law is "implied intent."

  9. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    There's another reason I left NC and don't see coming back. Not so in FL. You'd have to prove I wasn't in fear for my life when the law presumes me to be so.

    "A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using or threatening to use defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:
    (a) The person against whom the defensive force was used or threatened was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against that personís will from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle;..."
    Iím not happy about that Law, either. I am simply LOATHE to to fire without positively identifying my target and what may be directly behind them.
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  10. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frodebro View Post
    Obviously much depends on the laws in your area, but where Iím at, if someone breaks into my house theyíre fair game for responding with deadly force.
    Really? Drunk neighborhood teen stumbles in... BOOOM!!! JUSTICE SERVED!!! YEEHAA!!!

    Oh, wait...

    No getting their attention is necessary. Playing fairly with criminals only puts you at a dangerous disadvantage.
    Except he wasn't a criminal. He was a drunk neighbors kid.

    Seriously, man, you're Identification Friend or Foe needs a LOT of work...

    Yes, you're balancing another's actions with protecting your family. I get it. I just hope you get the other side of the equation.
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  11. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by ugh762x39 View Post
    Iím not happy about that Law, either. I am simply LOATHE to to fire without positively identifying my target and what may be directly behind them.
    Me, too. I owe it to humanity at least accept some risk to make certain I'm doing less harm than good.
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  12. #71
    Senior Member Array Frodebro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post
    Really? Drunk neighborhood teen stumbles in... BOOOM!!! JUSTICE SERVED!!! YEEHAA!!!

    Oh, wait...



    Except he wasn't a criminal. He was a drunk neighbors kid.

    Seriously, man, you're Identification Friend or Foe needs a LOT of work...

    Yes, you're balancing another's actions with protecting your family. I get it. I just hope you get the other side of the equation.
    I didn't say whether or not I would use deadly force, only that it is legal to do so in the case of a home invasion in my state. Point being knowing the laws in your area.

  13. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frodebro View Post
    I didn't say whether or not I would use deadly force, only that it is legal to do so in the case of a home invasion in my state. Point being knowing the laws in your area.
    I know full well the laws in my area. They fully allow me to blow anyone who steps across my threshold uninvited the hell away.

    Thankfully, I though twice in 2009 when a neighbor right SMACK across the hall decided to step foot in my place because I'd met him on the stairs the previous day while hauling boxes to my third floor apartment.

    The Iraqi Veteran had more or less of a fetish for various steel weapons, but also a serious distrust of non-veterans.

    I can't say we hit it off, but we certainly had a meeting of the minds, and I assured him i had his back if he had mine.

    I found him to be a really good human being. Skittish, yes. Totally human, however, once one helped talk him through some of the horrors he'd experiences.

    He was never injured himself. Dodged that bullet. Suffered a hell of a lot from having done so while his friends didn't.

    Do you get my drift now, Frodebro? How much further must I go into detail before you stop?

    Back to the question at hand:

    If you're going to use legal deadly force against a home intruder, you'd better well DAMN ensure they're actually intruding. That holds true for all 50 states, and truth be told, it's the least you can do for those who simply wander into your home needing help.

    I think I'd have felt P***** F****** Bad had I blown away my nextdoor neighbor and comrade in arms because of some mindblowingly STUPID technicality... GAH!!!

    You know what? That's how the liberals would like us to think. No, that's not us. Not I, anyway. I check three times. Follow your own protocol.

    As for me, I had a good friendship with my neighbor. I can't exactly say we bonded, but he "settled" before he moved. That's all I can ask.

    So, again, what the HELL does this have to do with "Tactical question for LEO's"

    Here's a thought:

    1. Our entire society rests firmly on the law.

    2. Our law is fully and ultimately derived from Constitutional and State law.

    3. The Law absolutely minimizes conflict while minimizing productivity. It always has, it always will. Everyone who works it to their heart out.
    Rock and Glock likes this.
    Governor Northam: YOU ARE NOT AUTHORIZED.

  14. #73
    Senior Member Array Frodebro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post
    I know full well the laws in my area. They fully allow me to blow anyone who steps across my threshold uninvited the hell away.

    Thankfully, I though twice in 2009 when a neighbor right SMACK across the hall decided to step foot in my place because I'd met him on the stairs the previous day while hauling boxes to my third floor apartment.

    The Iraqi Veteran had more or less of a fetish for various steel weapons, but also a serious distrust of non-veterans.

    I can't say we hit it off, but we certainly had a meeting of the minds, and I assured him i had his back if he had mine.

    I found him to be a really good human being. Skittish, yes. Totally human, however, once one helped talk him through some of the horrors he'd experiences.

    He was never injured himself. Dodged that bullet. Suffered a hell of a lot from having done so while his friends didn't.

    Do you get my drift now, Frodebro? How much further must I go into detail before you stop?

    Back to the question at hand:

    If you're going to use legal deadly force against a home intruder, you'd better well DAMN ensure they're actually intruding. That holds true for all 50 states, and truth be told, it's the least you can do for those who simply wander into your home needing help.

    I think I'd have felt P***** F****** Bad had I blown away my nextdoor neighbor and comrade in arms because of some mindblowingly STUPID technicality... GAH!!!

    You know what? That's how the liberals would like us to think. No, that's not us. Not I, anyway. I check three times. Follow your own protocol.

    As for me, I had a good friendship with my neighbor. I can't exactly say we bonded, but he "settled" before he moved. That's all I can ask.

    So, again, what the HELL does this have to do with "Tactical question for LEO's"

    Here's a thought:

    1. Our entire society rests firmly on the law.

    2. Our law is fully and ultimately derived from Constitutional and State law.

    3. The Law absolutely minimizes conflict while minimizing productivity. It always has, it always will. Everyone who works it to their heart out.
    There's no hallway outside my front door, just my driveway. On top of that, most of my neighbors are older and don't come home drunk late at night, so the odds of a neighbor mistakenly kicking in my door (thinking that it was their own door they were kicking in) are significantly lower than that of somebody entering my house with criminal intent.

    Therefore, in my particular situation, it is pretty fair to say that if somebody breaks into my house there is a very high probability that hesitating to ascertain their intent could be a big mistake on my part.
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  15. #74
    Senior Member Array M1911A1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post
    ...3. The Law absolutely minimizes conflict while minimizing productivity...[emphasis added]
    Isn't it supposed to be "minimizes conflict while maximizing productivity"?

    Someone (I don't remember who) once said something like, "The purpose of government is to make smooth the intercourse among its people."
    It may have been Jefferson, but I'm not sure.
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  16. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frodebro View Post
    There's no hallway outside my front door, just my driveway. On top of that, most of my neighbors are older and don't come home drunk late at night, so the odds of a neighbor mistakenly kicking in my door (thinking that it was their own door they were kicking in) are significantly lower than that of somebody entering my house with criminal intent.

    Therefore, in my particular situation, it is pretty fair to say that if somebody breaks into my house there is a very high probability that hesitating to ascertain their intent could be a big mistake on my part.
    Have you installed a steel door with case-hardened deadbolt, hinges, and deep wood screws?

    I did that on the first house I owned, and low and behold in 1994 I was resting on the couch in the middle of the day after an overnight flight when someone began trying to kick in my door, the most common form of illegal entry in that area at the time.

    They got three good kicks in before I shouted, "HEY!" at which point they beat feet.

    Good for them. I was resting with my .44 magnum on my lap.
    Rock and Glock and M1911A1 like this.
    Governor Northam: YOU ARE NOT AUTHORIZED.

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