Concealed Carry Mistake! - Page 2

Concealed Carry Mistake!

This is a discussion on Concealed Carry Mistake! within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Like anti-gunners everywhere, go ahead and blame the inherently-dangerous gun......

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  1. #16
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    Like anti-gunners everywhere, go ahead and blame the inherently-dangerous gun...
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    "Stop being dangerous, and you become edible." William Aprill

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  2. #17
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    Negligent discharge with painful consequences. Luckily this jackhead only hurt himself. Definitely had his head up his fourth point of contact.
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  3. #18
    Ex Member Array AzQkr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SAXDM9 View Post
    Nothing in the news coverage so far seems to have identified the make of the gun. I hope the guy’s going to be okay.
    Agreed, everyone seems to be assuming it was a glock. No mention of the gun in the article.
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  5. #19
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    You can shoot yourself with an unloaded muzzle-loading rifle with a 30" barrel if you work hard enough.
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  6. #20
    VIP Member Array jmf552's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ETXhiker View Post
    Yeah, maybe it was a Glock. But if you try hard enough, you can shoot yourself with anything.
    True. But with a Glock, you don't have to try that hard.
    Attack Squadron 65 "Tigers", USS Eisenhower '80 - '83, peackeeping w/Iran, Libya, Lebanon and E. Europe

  7. #21
    VIP Member Array jmf552's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzQkr View Post
    Agreed, everyone seems to be assuming it was a glock. No mention of the gun in the article.
    It will be a striker...betcha.
    Attack Squadron 65 "Tigers", USS Eisenhower '80 - '83, peackeeping w/Iran, Libya, Lebanon and E. Europe

  8. #22
    VIP Member Array jmf552's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    Like anti-gunners everywhere, go ahead and blame the inherently-dangerous gun...
    That's not being anti-gun. That is understanding the science of systems safety, something very few gun owners understand. Most gun owners think "the four rules of safety" and "keep your booger hook off the bang switch" is all you need. Those are the dumbed-down versions.
    Attack Squadron 65 "Tigers", USS Eisenhower '80 - '83, peackeeping w/Iran, Libya, Lebanon and E. Europe

  9. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmf552 View Post
    That's not being anti-gun. That is understanding the science of systems safety, something very few gun owners understand. Most gun owners think "the four rules of safety" and "keep your booger hook off the bang switch" is all you need. Those are the dumbed-down versions.
    OK, what are the original, smarter versions?
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  10. #24
    VIP Member Array jmf552's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    OK, what are the original, smarter versions?
    Systems safety is a field of study that fills many books and courses, so any explanation I could give here is an oversimplification. But briefly, you could say systems safety looks at everything about a system from beginning to end, from design, though manufacture, through training and standards for use, through actual safety history in use. If there are persistent mishaps with a system, that whole chain is examined to find out what went wrong. If it is operator error, but multiple operators have made the same error, other parts of the safety chain have to be looked at.

    That is the approach the military, and aviation, takes with everything and I have professional experience with both. To put it very simply, it is applying Murphy's Law to every aspect of a system. With a gun, if people keep having similar NDs, yes, it is those gun carriers' faults, but blaming them does not increase safety. Looking at the design of the gun, training with that gun, accessories, etc. in relation to the NDs and making corrections improves safety.

    I will also say that the goal of systems safety is zero mishaps, or at least six sigma, which would be 99.99966% safe.
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  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebleyHunter View Post
    Luckily, here in CO "Codes of Conduct" are not laws themselves.

    Let me guess- a non-manual safety striker gun with a "great trigger"...
    Why do you ask? Are striker guns with great triggers going off by themselves while carried in a proper holster?

    I suggest that improper handling of a firearm is dangerous regardless of platform.
    Last edited by Struckat; October 21st, 2019 at 05:18 PM.
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  12. #26
    Ex Member Array AzQkr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmf552 View Post
    That's not being anti-gun. That is understanding the science of systems safety, something very few gun owners understand. Most gun owners think "the four rules of safety" and "keep your booger hook off the bang switch" is all you need. Those are the dumbed-down versions.
    By 1996, glock has sold 1 million pistols. If just 1 in 4 carries one, that's 250K being carried. Number of ND's with glocks are unlikely to be more than 3-4K in that time frame, making human errors with a striker around .004%. Make it 8K ND's, thats only .008%. IOW, statistically insignificant..

    It may be a striker fired firearm that was evidenced, but it's human error and not the "system" that's the culprit.
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  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzQkr View Post
    By 1996, glock has sold 1 million pistols. If just 1 in 4 carries one, that's 250K being carried. Number of ND's with glocks are unlikely to be more than 3-4K in that time frame, making human errors with a striker around .004%. Make it 8K ND's, thats only .008%. IOW, statistically insignificant..

    It may be a striker fired firearm that was evidenced, but it's human error and not the "system" that's the culprit.
    Striker-fired guns were used by fourteen of the seventeen students in the class I attended yesterday. Every student was a licensed carrier. I would guess the overall percentage among carriers is similar.
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  14. #28
    VIP Member Array jmf552's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzQkr View Post
    By 1996, glock has sold 1 million pistols. If just 1 in 4 carries one, that's 250K being carried. Number of ND's with glocks are unlikely to be more than 3-4K in that time frame, making human errors with a striker around .004%. Make it 8K ND's, thats only .008%. IOW, statistically insignificant..

    It may be a striker fired firearm that was evidenced, but it's human error and not the "system" that's the culprit.
    It may be statistically insignificant to you, but not to safety experts. They would need .0034% (six sigma), so less than half your number.
    Attack Squadron 65 "Tigers", USS Eisenhower '80 - '83, peackeeping w/Iran, Libya, Lebanon and E. Europe

  15. #29
    Ex Member Array AzQkr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmf552 View Post
    It may be statistically insignificant to you, but not to safety experts. They would need .0034% (six sigma), so less than half your number.
    And if the ND's actually only amount to 2K, then that's well within the .0034 you're speaking to at .002. As I only guessed, and guessed high, it may well be within safety experts criteria. Still an insignificant number.

    As very few carriers are likely to be safety experts, the numbers ARE insignificant to the vast majority of those who carry a Glock or any striker fired pistol.

  16. #30
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    My bet is a soft sided holster or one that didn’t properly cover the trigger.

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