NYPD authorized XDs - Page 3

NYPD authorized XDs

This is a discussion on NYPD authorized XDs within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by firefighterguy What do you wear that makes it impossible to conceal a g19 over an xds? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ...

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  1. #31
    VIP Member Array Havok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by firefighterguy View Post
    What do you wear that makes it impossible to conceal a g19 over an xds?




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    Over an XDS? Probably nothing, I wasnt speaking specifically about the XDS though. I was referring to a department wanting to have ANY control over what you carry off duty. I doubt anyone on this forum owns a pocket gun because they prefer that to 15rds of 9mm.

  2. #32
    VIP Member Array Wasp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clarkston_cz View Post
    5-round mag with one in the chamber is one more round and a faster reload than a
    J-Frame, but I think they will be mandated to the 9mm with more capacity.

    A 7-round 9mm mag with a spare 8-round (or two spares) should work well for them.
    Or the spare 9 round if you are going 8?!
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  3. #33
    VIP Member Array jmf552's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by firefighterguy View Post
    What do you wear that makes it impossible to conceal a g19 over an xds?
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    Glocks clash with everything in my wardrobe, and for that matter, everything in my gun collection.
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  5. #34
    Member Array El_Viajero's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok View Post
    I get that, and I don't know what all options they have, but if I were limited to only being able to carry a glock 19, then the reality is I would end up being unarmed a lot of the time due to how I dress in the summer.
    They are actually given some latitude in what they may carry off duty. There is an approved list. I believe it is all 9mm, .380 ACP, and .38 Special calibered guns.
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  6. #35
    Ex Member Array bubbatime's Avatar
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    If their duty weapon is a Glock 19, their off duty weapon should be a Glock 26. Or Glock 43. The XDs has me scratching my head...

  7. #36
    Ex Member Array bubbatime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zonker1986 View Post
    Cops in my hood carry 15 round Glock 22's with a G27 for back up.
    If your hood is unincorporated Orange County, FL (surrounding Orlando), then the local Orange County Sheriff's Office deputies carry Glock 21 .45ACP handguns and are not issued a backup gun. Many officers carry a backup, many don't. They can choose whatever backup gun they want.

    Orlando PD carried the Sig P226 for decades. Makes sense for them to transition to a Sig P320 from the P226.

  8. #37
    Member Array PFranklin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeflonDon View Post
    I never understood how they can dictate what you're allowed to carry on your own person time off the clock.
    Because although "off the clock" a police officer is really always on-duty and expected to take action in the event of witnessing a forcible felony, or saving lives. Failure to do so and they learn you're a cop and were there could get your credentials lifted. On or off duty, a police officer is always bound to a certain code of ethics. Your point has been debated for years within police unions. For example, a cop cannot own or operate a bar in his personal life according to many state laws. Part of the gig when you sign on. So, yes they can tell you what to carry off-duty and only after qualifying with it. City insurance and liability requisites.
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  9. #38
    Ex Member Array TeflonDon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PFranklin View Post
    Because although "off the clock" a police officer is really always on-duty and expected to take action in the event of witnessing a forcible felony, or saving lives. Failure to do so and they learn you're a cop and were there could get your credentials lifted. On or off duty, a police officer is always bound to a certain code of ethics. Your point has been debated for years within police unions. For example, a cop cannot own or operate a bar in his personal life according to many state laws. Part of the gig when you sign on. So, yes they can tell you what to carry off-duty and only after qualifying with it. City insurance and liability requisites.
    How would the city be liable for what an off the clock officer does? From what you described, it doesn't seem like the ethics and actions that an off duty officer is suppose to take is any different than any other average citizens. It still makes no logical sense, and I wonder if anyone ever brought a case to fight it, if it would hold up in court.

  10. #39
    Senior Member Array firefighterguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeflonDon View Post
    How would the city be liable for what an off the clock officer does? From what you described, it doesn't seem like the ethics and actions that an off duty officer is suppose to take is any different than any other average citizens. It still makes no logical sense, and I wonder if anyone ever brought a case to fight it, if it would hold up in court.
    As a ccw we aren't required to respond to lethal force to ourselves or others. We are protected by the law in doing so. Police officers are mostly required to take action. Their responsibilities are different the citizens.

    http://www.llrmi.com/articles/legal_...off-duty.shtml


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  11. #40
    Member Array PFranklin's Avatar
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    Your question has and is constantly a source of debate with unions in negotiating the contract (collective bargaining agreement) between the city and its officers. I am unaware of any officer(s) actually taking that case to court. But, what I can tell you is that if an officer were to make an arrest while off-duty the city is automatically involved in his life and arrest and the conduct of that arrest. If an officer were to chase down a bank robber and gunfire ensues and an innocent passerby gets shot (by police or bad guy), because the officer was at that moment acting in his official capacity, the city will be held liable for the injuries (death?) of the wounded passerby. I get assigned these cases for I A investigation and administrative review all the time. The I A, BTW, is automatic in the case of an officer - on duty or off - discharges his weapon. Another scenario and one I just investigated with no nice outcome: an off-duty officer involved in a nasty divorce gets into a heated verbal argument. Wife calls 911 and accuses the off-duty officer of domestic violence. This, until settled in court, is an automatic surrender of his weapon and administrative leave with pay but cannot function as an officer. Brady law.

    Another thing: so the SCOTUS has also decided that police officers do not enjoy the same first amendments right to free speech as the rest of our citizens do. They must be cautious in what they say, on duty or off, or can be terminated. This has been upheld in court and agreed upon by the SCOTUS.
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  12. #41
    Ex Member Array TeflonDon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by firefighterguy View Post
    As a ccw we aren't required to respond to lethal force to ourselves or others. We are protected by the law in doing so. Police officers are mostly required to take action. Their responsibilities are different the citizens.

    Model Policy: Off-Duty Action


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    The article says they are required to take action which can be simplely reporting that a crime was committed. They still aren't on the clock or in uniform. I don't think thats a good excuse for severely restricting their 2A rights.
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  13. #42
    Ex Member Array TeflonDon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PFranklin View Post
    Your question has and is constantly a source of debate with unions in negotiating the contract (collective bargaining agreement) between the city and its officers. I am unaware of any officer(s) actually taking that case to court. But, what I can tell you is that if an officer were to make an arrest while off-duty the city is automatically involved in his life and arrest and the conduct of that arrest. If an officer were to chase down a bank robber and gunfire ensues and an innocent passerby gets shot (by police or bad guy), because the officer was at that moment acting in his official capacity, the city will be held liable for the injuries (death?) of the wounded passerby. I get assigned these cases for I A investigation and administrative review all the time. The I A, BTW, is automatic in the case of an officer - on duty or off - discharges his weapon. Another scenario and one I just investigated with no nice outcome: an off-duty officer involved in a nasty divorce gets into a heated verbal argument. Wife calls 911 and accuses the off-duty officer of domestic violence. This, until settled in court, is an automatic surrender of his weapon and administrative leave with pay but cannot function as an officer. Brady law.

    Another thing: so the SCOTUS has also decided that police officers do not enjoy the same first amendments right to free speech as the rest of our citizens do. They must be cautious in what they say, on duty or off, or can be terminated. This has been upheld in court and agreed upon by the SCOTUS.
    The domestic charge is understandably and so is saying something off duty, like racist rhetoric. Both of those scenario involve bad moral character whereas exercising ones 2A rights by carrying a state legal CCW doesn't.

    I understand that it's a hot topic that had been debated, but I still haven't heard a logical argument to support this practice especially since officers in other states who aren't restricted are just fine.

    Thanks for the information.

  14. #43
    Senior Member Array firefighterguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeflonDon View Post
    The article says they are required to take action which can be simplely reporting that a crime was committed. They still aren't on the clock or in uniform. I don't think thats a good excuse for severely restricting their 2A rights.
    They also get the backing of the Union and its attorneys.

    Is NY saying they can only carry an approved gun?


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  15. #44
    Distinguished Member Array AZ Desertrat's Avatar
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    Didn't NYPD use G20's at one time? Thought I read that somewhere....
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