How do you become comfortable with a striker for a CCW? - Page 5

How do you become comfortable with a striker for a CCW?

This is a discussion on How do you become comfortable with a striker for a CCW? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Over the more recent years there has been a lot of confusion about action types and the terminologies associated with them. I must reiterate that ...

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Thread: How do you become comfortable with a striker for a CCW?

  1. #61
    VIP Member Array SouthernBoyVA's Avatar
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    Over the more recent years there has been a lot of confusion about action types and the terminologies associated with them. I must reiterate that the action designation of a handgun is solely dependent upon the tasks performed by the trigger. As a case in point, I will use two pistols; the Glock 19 and the Kel-Tec P11.

    The Glock design is defined as a DAO by both Glock and the ATF, according to Glock. And yes, it is a true DAO design which does not have second strike capability. When one inserts a loaded magazine and releases it to ride home, the gun is in a half-cocked condition. In order to fire it, the shooter must depress the trigger which performs two tasks*. It completes the cocking of the striker and then releases that striker to ignite a cartridge.

    In the Kel-Tec P11, we have a hammer fired pistol and should a cartridge fail to fire, you can pull the trigger again in an attempt to fire the round.

    In both cases, two distinct actions were performed by the trigger assembly to fire a cartridge. With DA (Double Action) pistols, sometimes erroneously referred to as DA/SA pistols, the trigger can perform two distinct tasks under two distinct conditions. For the first shot, the trigger both cocks the hammer and releases it to fire a cartridge with subsequent rounds fired for a fully cocked hammer which was made that way by the action of the gun's slide. So it goes from DA to SA on its own, unless the shooter chooses to cock the hammer for the first shot.

    I have seen so much confusion with these terms over the past couple of decades where there really shouldn't be any confusion at all. It's really quite simple. What does the trigger do to fire the gun? If it is a DAO pistol, it does the same thing every time, from the first shot to the last.



    * The disabling of the striker block safety and the sear safety is not considered in this description.
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  2. #62
    Member Array Melvin's Avatar
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    I didn't read all of the responses; but I "Increase" the trigger pull on all my striker fired pistols that I CCW. If it's a Glock, I will replace the trigger spring to the NY 1 spring and add the 3.5 Lb connector. Recently I replaced the trigger return springs in my M&P's (sometimes the trigger bars as well). The "updates" I do have resulted in a 7.5 lb to 8.2 lb trigger pull, which I feel comfortable with CCW'ing. Being an old school senior, I grew up with revolvers, 1911's or Browning HP's that were always carried hammer down, never cocked and locked!
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  3. #63
    Senior Member Array pskys2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chemcal View Post
    Hi All

    Most strikers I can shoot more accurately than TDA, DAO, or LEM. However, in over 15 years of CC, I've never carried one. The reason is fear of A/N discharge. I practice, but tight groups come much easier with aforementioned guns I don't carry. Any one been there and have good advise?
    I picked the S&W M&P 2.0 with thumb safety, mine is a .45 acp, for that very reason. I carry it always and have never had the safety swipe off on my person. I'm used to a thumb safety from decades of 1911 use. It just makes me feel better, kind of like having my cake and eating it too!
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  5. #64
    Senior Member Array DZUS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spclopr8tr View Post
    ... I've practiced, practiced, practiced with every firearm such that I was always safe and confident in my carry. Each person must assess their own comfort level and go with works for them. There is no one size fits all answer to the OP's question.
    Precisely, my friend.

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  6. #65
    Senior Member Array lee n. field's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernBoyVA View Post
    Over the more recent years there has been a lot of confusion about action types and the terminologies associated with them. I must reiterate that the action designation of a handgun is solely dependent upon the tasks performed by the trigger. As a case in point, I will use two pistols; the Glock 19 and the Kel-Tec P11.

    The Glock design is defined as a DAO by both Glock and the ATF, according to Glock. And yes, it is a true DAO design which does not have second strike capability. When one inserts a loaded magazine and releases it to ride home, the gun is in a half-cocked condition. In order to fire it, the shooter must depress the trigger which performs two tasks*. It completes the cocking of the striker and then releases that striker to ignite a cartridge.

    In the Kel-Tec P11, we have a hammer fired pistol and should a cartridge fail to fire, you can pull the trigger again in an attempt to fire the round.

    In both cases, two distinct actions were performed by the trigger assembly to fire a cartridge. With DA (Double Action) pistols, sometimes erroneously referred to as DA/SA pistols, the trigger can perform two distinct tasks under two distinct conditions. For the first shot, the trigger both cocks the hammer and releases it to fire a cartridge with subsequent rounds fired for a fully cocked hammer which was made that way by the action of the gun's slide. So it goes from DA to SA on its own, unless the shooter chooses to cock the hammer for the first shot.

    I have seen so much confusion with these terms over the past couple of decades where there really shouldn't be any confusion at all. It's really quite simple. What does the trigger do to fire the gun? If it is a DAO pistol, it does the same thing every time, from the first shot to the last.
    Very much this.

    The firing pin needs to strike the primer in the cartridge base with a certain amount of force. You can power that firing pin with a spring in line with or integral with it ("stryker fired!") or the spring powering it can be at an angle, transferring the force through a hammer that pivots through an arc. Not a whole lot of difference when you look at it that way.

    Safety and reliability are paramount. "Hammer vs. striker" is arguing over minutae.

  7. #66
    VIP Member Array Bigsteve113's Avatar
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    Train with it and carry it. You'll get used to it. It took me a while because I cut my teeth on DA revolvers as a young deputy in the early 80's. But after many years of carrying GLOCKs at work, I realized "hey, this thing ain't going off by itself". Now almost all my carry guns are strikers. They're still not my favorites, but they work well !
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  8. #67
    Senior Member Array CDRGlock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chemcal View Post
    Hi All

    Most strikers I can shoot more accurately than TDA, DAO, or LEM. However, in over 15 years of CC, I've never carried one. The reason is fear of A/N discharge. I practice, but tight groups come much easier with aforementioned guns I don't carry. Any one been there and have good advise?
    I’ve only conceal carried for 10 years. I’ve shoot my Glock pistols extensively.

    It’s tight out to 15 yards with concentration.

    It’s pretty consistent in an 8” circle at 25 yards.

    I take up the Pre travel on any gun i shoot.

    Nothing comes close to accuracy from a revolver, 1911 or a CZ Shadow 2.

    One of the most important things is to determine is how a gun fits your hand. Maybe a Glock is not the one. Maybe try a S&W M&P, polymer CZ or a Springfield XD/M.



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  9. #68
    Member Array Mjolnir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chemcal View Post
    Hi All

    Most strikers I can shoot more accurately than TDA, DAO, or LEM. However, in over 15 years of CC, I've never carried one. The reason is fear of A/N discharge. I practice, but tight groups come much easier with aforementioned guns I don't carry. Any one been there and have good advise?
    Purchase a Gen 5 Glock and a Tau Development Group “Gadget”.

    Problem solved.

    The “fear” of the striker pistol firing on its own is ludicrous.

    The TRUE CONCERN of the trigger getting “entangled” with a draw string or tail end of your shirt as you’re REHOLSTERING is *VERY* REAL.


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  10. #69
    Member Array audiophile's Avatar
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    By putting it in the holster and going about my day.

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  11. #70
    Distinguished Member Array RedSafety's Avatar
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    Why would a striker fire be any different than any other action? It all boils down to a good holster and finger/trigger control. That's pretty universal.
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  12. #71
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    I carry a striker fired pistol with a manual safety. TBH, I don't trust the trigger blade s on guns like Glocks. The manual safety gives me an added layer of safety when handling my gun. Both my dad, and the military taught me the same thing: if you are handling a gun, make sure the safety is on first. You don't take the safety off unless you are intending to pull the trigger. As is was, I was nervous at first, about carrying. I hadn't carried a weapon on my belt in a long time. First it was getting used to having it on my hip, and without a round in the chamber, safety on, around the house only. Then I started to carry out in town that way. Within a day or two I realized what a handicap not having a round in the chamber was. So then, round in chamber, safety on. (The safety on my gun works just like on the 1911, up for on, down for bang bang bang) then I got used to carrying with the safety off. The safety is on any time I am handling the gun, if I'm not aiming and pulling the trigger. That includes putting it in the holster, loading, etc. The holster I use, has a strap to assist in retention. It also provides for a way to make sure the safety is not accidentally flipped on/off without manually unsnapping the retention strap. All it takes, is a mindset of being willing to try to get comfortable with a different firing system. If you are willing to try, the comfort level will come. With the concerns you are bringing up, I'd recommend, if you decide to get a striker fired gun, to get one with a manual safety, to help with your comfort level.
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  13. #72
    Distinguished Member Array Militant's Avatar
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    Carry what you're comfortable with. If it is a striker.....carry that! If it is a DA/SA w/safety etc., then carry that! We're all different and think differently when it comes to our personal comfort zone of safety. I carry strikers and DA/SA pieces w/a round in the chamber. I have no issue with either, but that's me!
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  14. #73
    VIP Member Array graydude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedSafety View Post
    Why would a striker fire be any different than any other action? It all boils down to a good holster and finger/trigger control. That's pretty universal.
    Because they are different.

    It boils down to trigger pull weight and travel.

    Most people are comfortable with a revolver that has a long and heavy DA trigger and no additional manual safety. Most people are *not* comfortable holstering a 1911 type SA trigger that is very light and requires little travel, unless the pistol also has a functioning manual safety (or two).

    Striker triggers lie somewhere in the middle between heavy-long DA and light-short SA when it comes to pull weight and travel. Therefore at what point a manual safety becomes important to the person holding the gun is a very personal decision.

    Personally I have no issues with an aftermarket light trigger on a Glock or similar striker gun when I'm shooting on a sterile and controlled shooting range. But, I personally won't EDC such a gun and I prefer something with an additional manual safety such as the XD grip safety or a Glock with the striker control device to aid in holstering, simply because I know I can be a klutz in the real world off the range. No amount of people trying to tell me I'm wrong is going to change my opinion of my own human fallibility when it comes to handling guns in fast paced and stressful situations.
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  15. #74
    VIP Member Array forester58's Avatar
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    I really think most just gloss over the real issue here. Its not about just "keeping your finger off the trigger" at all. Its not "minutia" to compare a 5 pound trigger to a 10 pound trigger.
    Its about one trigger being more pron to a negative reaction to a screw up than another. That screw up could be a jacket tie, a holster thumb snap,etc. Yes it takes a momentary lapse in judgement for most of those things to happen but, you increase the likelihood of that gun going off with the lighter trigger.

    Which is easier to push off the table with your finger, a 5 pound book or a 10 pound book?
    I agree that both take a conscious effort to push them off but, one is still much easier to do. If your a perfect flawless human none of this matters but, some of us are not and we have met Murphy before.
    How many here have had their reactions to potentially deadly encounters tested? I have, so I know my fine motor skills really do go to hell. Adrenaline is not my friend when it comes to muscle control. Having pulled a gun on a charging bear and not firing in what turned out to be a bluff charge. I realized that the hammer on that revolver was about a 3rd of the way pulled back when I thought my finger was just resting on that trigger. As that bear got closer I was subconsciously already pulling that trigger. I don't tick the safety down on a 1911 until target identified and I know trigger pull is a go. Yes, it probably makes me a hair slower and maybe that is not the best gun for me to carry, I have to consider that as an honest possibility as well.

    I think that is why I carry a unaltered 642 appendix so often because I like that 12 pound trigger for a quick response defense and the fact its just more forgiving of my human screw ups. Especially pointed where it is.

    This is all my issues and may have nothing to do with others but, may help you understand the issue as more than just a psychological "comfort" issue for some of us. Others could be cool as heck and not be as affected by that adrenaline dump.

    "To thine own self be true". Matters not what others decide I must decide what works (or doesn't work) for me.

    Lets be honest in saying that gun manufacturers make lighter triggers so people shoot little small groups at the range easier. This makes people feel good and sells guns. It makes small guns easier to shoot groups with. There is a reason the snubby has fallen out of favor. It takes practice and dedication to shoot well. Heck, people talk about DA/SA today as if its some impossible hill to climb to learn to shoot well. 9mm is king of the hill because its easy to shoot well with at the training grounds with less practice and dedication. The only way to excel they say is a consistent and light trigger (and 9mm).
    When the gun community mantra is "shot placement, shot placement" most feel better if they can shoot those little groups, right?
    Its what I love about my 1911, its so easy to shoot those little groups with.
    Isn't self defense by definition a surprise that requires immediate and potentially deadly reaction? Fast and deadly, an adrenaline dump that requires a high level of discipline in your reaction. Lighter triggers require a higher level of discipline under those conditions, simple as that.
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  16. #75
    New Member Array chemcal's Avatar
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    Yesterday I sent my P229 to the Sig Armorer. If it comes back the way expected, it will become a CCW along with my HK P2000 LEM V1.5(Todd Green). The only striker I've warmed up to is a P99AS. Interesting, there is a thread on here about the VP9 and similar strikers. These are great guns and easy to shoot accurately. However, I don't expect to be carrying one or even my very accurate 1911. fact: "its just more forgiving of my human screw ups."(forester58)
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