1911's - Page 2

1911's

This is a discussion on 1911's within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Donít go into debt for a pistol. You can pay it off in three months? So pay it off FIRST. Open a separate account and ...

Page 2 of 7 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 ... LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 100
Like Tree440Likes

Thread: 1911's

  1. #16
    Member Array rotorhead1026's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    The Far Side
    Posts
    345
    Donít go into debt for a pistol. You can pay it off in three months? So pay it off FIRST. Open a separate account and put money in over time. Then make the purchase. If you can make this a habit you can save an astounding amount of money. If you have the discipline to handle a firearm properly then you can do this. :)
    OD*, BigJon10125, airslot and 7 others like this.
    *********************************

    Never let anything mechanical know that you're in a hurry.

  2. #17
    Member Array simonp67's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    Kalifornia
    Posts
    47
    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Bob View Post
    What is wrong with MIM?
    There are literally hundreds if not thousands of pages on MIM quality vs tool steel - which I wonít summarize here. Suffice it to say MIM was adopted by manufacturers as a cost saving move not to improve quality. There is well made MIM and poor MIM, Springfield uses both and which you get depends on your luck.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    OD*, airslot and Struckat like this.

  3. #18
    VIP Member Array Cuda66's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    minnesota
    Posts
    3,532
    Quote Originally Posted by oldIthink View Post
    Since I've started reading here I've been noticing 1911's are pretty well liked arms. For me one would be a very expensive investment, but I generally get what I want, sooner rather than later. I'd have to buy it on layaway or Credova financial, but that's doable for the right gun. I can usually pay those loans off in a month or two but they give me the luxury of knowing I have 12 months total. I would never think of going that long with those loan sharks though and paying twice what the purchase was originally. FWIW- I work for tips and get a fairly decent wage for where I live. I work three or four days a week and with normal tips make about 3k a month. It's ok with me since I'm nearly retired due to inability to walk very far or stand for any length of time. And it's better than total disability.

    Anyway, back to 1911's. Is there one that's better than the others for $1200 or LESS?

    I was perusing Grab-a-Gun and fell on looking at the 1911's. My preference in semi-autos has always been blued. I like shiny bright revolvers but pistols seem to look better blued in my eyes. Shiny blued is good too. My other preference is it be 9mm.

    If it boiled down to finish color (bright and shiny or blued) it's not that important, the bright and shiny does look good, I'm just not a believer of- if it looks great, it's got to be great. I have a bright and shiny S&W air-weight .38sp. I bet it doesn't work any better than a blued one does.

    Any 1911 brand will do, a smaller version will also do, it just needs to be of good, acceptable quality and all steel with fairly interchangeable (or easily sourced) parts.

    Out of these: Sig, RI, Remy, Colt, PO, SA, ATI, EAA, Taurus, Walther, Llama, Browning, or MR, which is the go-to? I know some of these are not offered in 9mm.

    I'm not trying to start a brand bashing contest, I really would like real personal likes and dislikes.
    At that price point, Iíd look for a used Dan Wesson.

    The Springfield RO Elites are pretty nice, as well...you might be able to find a used TRP in that price range, come to think of it.

    I wouldnít look askance at a Kimber TLE...Kimber is putting out some really nice guns for a very good price right now.
    simonp67, OD*, Struckat and 3 others like this.
    There are no dangerous weapons; there are only dangerous men.--RAH

    ...man fights with his mind; the weapons are incidental.--Jeff Cooper


    There is a reason they try and make small bullets act like big bullets--Glockmann10mm

  4. Remove Advertisements
    DefensiveCarry.com
    Advertisements
     

  5. #19
    VIP Member Array BigJon10125's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    California
    Posts
    4,467
    Quote Originally Posted by OD* View Post
    BINGO!

    Otherwise, it's just the Ford-Chevy-Dodge argument.
    Dodge!

    OP I would defer to the professionals and apparently they like the Springfield offerings. You will still have money for ammo to practice.
    OD*, airslot, Old Man and 1 others like this.
    BigJon


    "Better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt" ~ Mark Twain

  6. #20
    VIP Member Array maxwell97's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    10,150
    Quote Originally Posted by simonp67 View Post
    There are literally hundreds if not thousands of pages on MIM quality vs tool steel - which I wonít summarize here. Suffice it to say MIM was adopted by manufacturers as a cost saving move not to improve quality. There is well made MIM and poor MIM, Springfield uses both and which you get depends on your luck.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    Most parts on a handgun would see no benefit from tool-steel properties. If you know of particular issues with the brands people have suggested, that would be helpful.
    G-man* and Bad Bob like this.
    "Lots of ways to help people. Sometimes heal patients; sometimes shoot dangerous people. Either way helps."
    - Dr. Mordin Solus

  7. #21
    VIP Member Array G-man*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Central Kentucky
    Posts
    18,243
    Quote Originally Posted by simonp67 View Post
    There are literally hundreds if not thousands of pages on MIM quality vs tool steel - which I wonít summarize here. Suffice it to say MIM was adopted by manufacturers as a cost saving move not to improve quality. There is well made MIM and poor MIM, Springfield uses both and which you get depends on your luck.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    The use of MIMS parts in low impact areas of a firearm are not an issue.

    Yes, all manufacturing companies look to cut costs. Regardless of popular belief, the hand fitting of a gun, while definitely more expensive, does not mean better quality.
    Modern steel processes and CNC machinery make parts much more consistent and precise across the spectrum at a lower cost than hand-fitting could ever do at the rate that they need to turn them out for a price the buying public can reasonably afford.
    OD*, airslot, ETXhiker and 9 others like this.
    " Blessed is that man, who when facing death, thinks only of his front sight.Ē
    -Jeff Cooper

    ď Looking around doesnít cost you anything; and itís a healthy habitĒ
    -Joe Foss

  8. #22
    Ex Member Array oldIthink's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Posts
    232
    Nope, never shot one. All the advice/recommendations is/are great, even the part about renting. However, I'm not aware of any ranges within a reasonable driving distance to me that might even have a range officer, much less rental guns. There is a indoor range about an hour and a half south of me. I'll check.

    Most guns I have gotten in the past I never shot first. I fondle them at gun shows when possible, but never shot them first.

    sgb, Those fit the bill! I'm not thrilled with the big RO Elite on the slide, but otherwise that's the look.

    I'll shop for a while, do some more research, and ask the FFL holder I get my guns through if he might have one of his own stashed away I could look at. He closed his store front so he may not even own one.

    Nevertheless, from the answers here, it seems the Remington has seen a loyal following. And the price isn't bad either.

    Chevy/GMC for fuel economy
    Ford for interior comfort and ease of use
    Dodge for pure power and hauling ability
    All the others, I'm not familiar with

  9. #23
    Member Array simonp67's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    Kalifornia
    Posts
    47
    Quote Originally Posted by maxwell97 View Post
    Most parts on a handgun would see no benefit from tool-steel properties. If you know of particular issues with the brands people have suggested, that would be helpful.
    Personally & I know others whoíve had issues with Springfield sears & extractors, as well as issues with their breach face. If you search the 1911 forums youíll note an increase in issues with Springfield guns going back for repairs.

    They are generally good as base guns for a build but that isnít what the OP asked about.

    As for tool steel not offering a benefit Iíd disagree but rather than debate it Iíd just refer you to the hundreds of pages on the subject- clearly many folks agree with each of us.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    OD* likes this.

  10. #24
    OD*
    OD* is offline
    Senior Moderator
    Array OD*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Staff lounge
    Posts
    21,877
    Quote Originally Posted by maxwell97 View Post
    Most parts on a handgun would see no benefit from tool-steel properties. If you know of particular issues with the brands people have suggested, that would be helpful.
    They have gotten over the hump now, but Kimber had some real bad luck under Cohen's watch.

    1911's-kimber-mim.jpg
    Name:  KimberextractorclawMIM.jpg
Views: 69
Size:  6.6 KB
    Name:  KimbermagcatchMIM.jpg
Views: 64
Size:  4.8 KB
    1911's-mim-part-failure.jpg
    "The pistol, learn it well, carry it always ..." ~ Jeff Cooper

    "Terrorists: They hated you yesterday, they hate you today, and they will hate you tomorrow.
    End the cycle of hatred, donít give them a tomorrow."




    NRA Patron Member

  11. #25
    Ex Member Array oldIthink's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Posts
    232
    And I thought Kimber was a top-o-the-line firearm....my belief system has been shattered! Oh WOE is me!

    The reason I want it in 9mm is because I have more than my lifetime worth of ammo already stocked and plenty much more empty brass waiting in the wings. That's not saying much, I shoot less than 2000 rounds a year I'd guess. And that number is getting less each year.

  12. #26
    OD*
    OD* is offline
    Senior Moderator
    Array OD*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Staff lounge
    Posts
    21,877
    Quote Originally Posted by oldIthink View Post
    And I thought Kimber was a top-o-the-line firearm....my belief system has been shattered! Oh WOE is me!

    The reason I want it in 9mm is because I have more than my lifetime worth of ammo already stocked and plenty much more empty brass waiting in the wings. That's not saying much, I shoot less than 2000 rounds a year I'd guess. And that number is getting less each year.
    No, that's not what I said, I said they were over the hump. Ron Cohen hasn't been running Kimber into the ground for many years now.
    G-man*, Cuda66, simonp67 and 3 others like this.
    "The pistol, learn it well, carry it always ..." ~ Jeff Cooper

    "Terrorists: They hated you yesterday, they hate you today, and they will hate you tomorrow.
    End the cycle of hatred, donít give them a tomorrow."




    NRA Patron Member

  13. #27
    VIP Member Array Havok's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    US
    Posts
    7,738
    Quote Originally Posted by simonp67 View Post
    There are literally hundreds if not thousands of pages on MIM quality vs tool steel - which I wonít summarize here. Suffice it to say MIM was adopted by manufacturers as a cost saving move not to improve quality. There is well made MIM and poor MIM, Springfield uses both and which you get depends on your luck.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    And most of those posts are made by people who are regurgitating what someone else who didnít know what they were talking about posted.

    Quote Originally Posted by OD* View Post
    They have gotten over the hump now, but Kimber had some real bad luck under Cohen's watch.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Kimber MIM.jpg 
Views:	45 
Size:	388.7 KB 
ID:	310650
    Name:  KimberextractorclawMIM.jpg
Views: 69
Size:  6.6 KB
    Name:  KimbermagcatchMIM.jpg
Views: 64
Size:  4.8 KB
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	MIM Part Failure.jpg 
Views:	36 
Size:	173.2 KB 
ID:	310656
    Iím not going to pretend that Cohen doesnít have a habit or ruining companies, but things break. Itís not just kimber. People just choose to ignore it when it happens to other manufacturers. I think itís interesting that the only thing they would have to do to give the illusion that there is a change in QC would be to reduce their production numbers to be on par with other manufacturers. If kimber sells 1000 guns and 10 of them come back, there is a 1% rate of guns being returned to fix, if another manufacturer sells 500 guns and there are 5 guns that come back, there is a 1% rate of guns being returned, but people will lose their mind over twice as many guns being returned for issues.

    ETA: I didnít notice that the bottom picture was a sig at first. So I see what you did there, but generally speaking I think my above statement is fairly accurate.

    Quote Originally Posted by oldIthink View Post
    And I thought Kimber was a top-o-the-line firearm....my belief system has been shattered! Oh WOE is me!

    The reason I want it in 9mm is because I have more than my lifetime worth of ammo already stocked and plenty much more empty brass waiting in the wings. That's not saying much, I shoot less than 2000 rounds a year I'd guess. And that number is getting less each year.
    Kimber makes a decent gun. Some of their higher priced guns I think there are better options for the money, but Iíve owned a couple, and if I were buying another 1911 under $1000, it would most likely be another kimber. Just got to see what you like though.
    a poor plan that is well executed will produce better results that a good plan that is poorly executed.

    This is America. I have the right to go places. You have the right to stay home. You have the right to be upset about me going places. I have the right to not care.

  14. #28
    VIP Member Array maxwell97's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    10,150
    Quote Originally Posted by OD* View Post
    No, that's not what I said, I said they were over the hump. Ron Cohen hasn't been running Kimber into the ground for many years now.
    Didn't even realize - is that the same Cohen who's trying to run Sig into the ground currently? I kinda wish the Germans had kept him in prison...

    Anyway, back on topic: I'd strongly suggest browsing used firearms. I probably wouldn't have a 1911 if I hadn't run across a Ruger SR1911 in great shape for $450. All I had to do to it was tighten the grip screws.
    "Lots of ways to help people. Sometimes heal patients; sometimes shoot dangerous people. Either way helps."
    - Dr. Mordin Solus

  15. #29
    OD*
    OD* is offline
    Senior Moderator
    Array OD*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Staff lounge
    Posts
    21,877
    One and the same.
    "The pistol, learn it well, carry it always ..." ~ Jeff Cooper

    "Terrorists: They hated you yesterday, they hate you today, and they will hate you tomorrow.
    End the cycle of hatred, donít give them a tomorrow."




    NRA Patron Member

  16. #30
    Member Array simonp67's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    Kalifornia
    Posts
    47
    Quote Originally Posted by Havok View Post
    And most of those posts are made by people who are regurgitating what someone else who didnít know what they were talking about posted.



    Iím not going to pretend that Cohen doesnít have a habit or ruining companies, but things break. Itís not just kimber. People just choose to ignore it when it happens to other manufacturers. I think itís interesting that the only thing they would have to do to give the illusion that there is a change in QC would be to reduce their production numbers to be on par with other manufacturers. If kimber sells 1000 guns and 10 of them come back, there is a 1% rate of guns being returned to fix, if another manufacturer sells 500 guns and there are 5 guns that come back, there is a 1% rate of guns being returned, but people will lose their mind over twice as many guns being returned for issues.

    ETA: I didnít notice that the bottom picture was a sig at first. So I see what you did there, but generally speaking I think my above statement is fairly accurate.



    Kimber makes a decent gun. Some of their higher priced guns I think there are better options for the money, but Iíve owned a couple, and if I were buying another 1911 under $1000, it would most likely be another kimber. Just got to see what you like though.
    Some folks regurgitate & some folks have both knowledge and experience.

    If youíre buying a range toy to shoot a couple thousand rounds a year MIM will likely last you & do you fine. If youíre shooting 40,000 plus rounds a year you may well form a different opinion & have different experiences. If you shoot it regularly because you want to train with your carry gun, implying youíre carrying this gun & your life may depend on it well then, if you want to save a few dollars for that manufacturer go right ahead.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Page 2 of 7 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 ... LastLast

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •