Sub compact in shooting class

Sub compact in shooting class

This is a discussion on Sub compact in shooting class within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I'm starting to look at pistol shooting self defense classes. I know the basics, but would like something more advanced. Most classes say to bring ...

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Thread: Sub compact in shooting class

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array cal44's Avatar
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    Sub compact in shooting class

    I'm starting to look at pistol shooting self defense classes.

    I know the basics, but would like something more advanced.

    Most classes say to bring a full sized or compact semi auto.

    But would it be reasonable to bring a smaller gun like my P238 HD 380 auto?

    Would the small gun slow me down so much to render the class useless?

    Another choice would be my 3913ls, but I'm a lot more likely to carry my P238.

    Obviously I'd call the training firm and ask them if the P238 would work so 25 posts telling me that are unneeded.

    But just looking for general comments from people who have taken these classes.

  2. #2
    VIP Member Array ColoradoDiablo's Avatar
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    I would recommend starting on a larger sized pistol for the class and then transition from it to a smaller framed pistol for a concealed carry focused class.
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  3. #3
    flh is offline
    VIP Member Array flh's Avatar
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    I've run my j-frame and Mrs Flh has run her G-43 in scenario shoot style training ...

    If you carry it , you need to train with it ...

    If it is ever your misfortune to be attacked, alertness will have given you a little warning, decisiveness will have given you a proper course to pursue, and if that course is to counterattack, carry it out with everything you've got! Be indignant. Be angry. Be aggressive.

    Jeff Cooper

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    Practice with what you carry. I’ve read tacticool instructors who go through twisting logic out of recognition to assert something different but never seen a convincing argument for doing anything else.
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  6. #5
    VIP Member Array G26Raven's Avatar
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    Cal44, the only downside to using a smaller pistol like the P238 is that you will have to reload much more frequently. This could slow the class down for others if you don't have enough magazines to keep up with the rest of the class on some of the exercises. In addition, some instructors might not want you to use a pistol that requires a pocket holster, or for a woman to shoot from a purse.
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  7. #6
    Senior Member Array Risasi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flh View Post
    I've run my j-frame and Mrs Flh has run her G-43 in scenario shoot style training ...

    If you carry it , you need to train with it ...
    Same here. I've run my Glock 43 in three classes this past year or so. Only one other guy has out scored me so far and he was running a Legion IIRC.

    I ran my GP100 in one two years ago (the only guy w/ a revolver), and prior to that I'd used my SP101, which was my main carry piece for about ten years. I pretty much run what I carry.

    The only time I didn't use one of my carry guns was a force on force class and they used some sort of semi-auto Glock 17 Airsoft kits.

    If running a low capacity pistol I just say bring extra mags.
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  8. #7
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    Array 1942bull's Avatar
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    I am a firm believer that we should train with the gun(s) we will use for self defense. A class is the first step of training. S SD training class ought to be geared to training the student in using the primary self defense weapon since that would likely be the weapon used in a real life confrontation.

    I am not saying that using a larger pistol for the class is wrong. Skills are transferable from one gun size to another. I am questioning the thinking behind training a person for self defense with gun that they are not going to use for SD. If the size of the gun is so important to having training success then the training is inadequate. However, I suspect the trainer will tell you to bring the gun you prefer.
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  9. #8
    Member Array Nosler Guy's Avatar
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    As others have said, the only downside I see is more frequent magazine loads. They normally recommend at least three magazines for a full size pistol. If you double that you should be fine. The experience I have learned from the classes I have taken is if you aren't shooting or eating you should be toping off your mags. Many students don't know to do this and it causes the class to get behind. Always bring more ammo than what is recommended. If you are in a more advanced class you may have the option to do some extracurricular drills. Good luck and have fun!
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  10. #9
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    Array high pockets's Avatar
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    As several others have said, the limited capacity of the P238 would require so many mag changes, you would probably disrupt the flow of the class. In addition, I think it would be difficult to find a suitable OWB holster for the P238, and drawing from a pocket would probably not be allowed.
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  11. #10
    Senior Member Array entertainment72's Avatar
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    I wouldn't pay good hard earned money in a class that doesn't allow me to use my daily carry gun, a Ruger LCR.

    Why train with a gun you don't carry? Sure you can learn still, but not to the same degree as shooting your EDC.
    Risasi and dennis40x like this.

  12. #11
    Distinguished Member Array TSKnight's Avatar
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    I carried a S&W 3914 9mm for a while. Qualified with it as a secondary duty weapon and also took my first advanced CC class with it.
    My idea is to train with what I carry. Which is why I took a BUG class this summer with my Ruger LCP.
    Two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for dinner.
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  13. #12
    VIP Member Array Chuck R.'s Avatar
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    I've taken multiple classes, everything from CCW oriented low volume to multi-day high volume type classes.

    Talk to the instructor, get a copy of the syllabus, listen to what he/she recommends.

    A lot of what I've learned in defensive classes easily transfers between handguns and even between handguns and long guns. Most of what I come away with are new techniques I want to practice and new drills that will get me there. For the most part they're not weapon specific.

    Personally I wouldn't want to go into a high volume class with a sub-compact, when I can apply what I learned later. You will end up stuffing magazines or only partially completing drills while your fellow students are shooting.
    homo homini lupus est

  14. #13
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    I've taken a few defensive pistol courses. I've used my Shield 9mm in every one of them. I also have Maguts in 2 of the magazines, so it carries 8+1 and 9+1 in the spare mag. Other mags are standard capacity.

    Train with what you carry.
    I know little on the subject so I'll speak at length.

    If you have an excuse for failure, you will.

  15. #14
    VIP Member Array jmf552's Avatar
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    If it is a defensive shooting class, I don't think you are getting full value if you are not using the gun you will actually carry. Yes, you will learn some things with a different gun, but "training like you plan to fight, with the equipment you are going to fight with" is a basic principle.

    I was in a class where a lady showed up with one of the small Sig "micro 1911's." It was the only gun she had. She did fine. I will bet she left better prepared to defend herself with that gun than if she had rented a bigger gun. I guess the question is, what is your purpose in taking the class? To do well in the class, or be better prepared to defend yourself after you leave the class? Also, taking a class with a small gun may well convince someone they need a bigger one.
    Attack Squadron 65 "Tigers", USS Eisenhower '80 - '83, peackeeping w/Iran, Libya, Lebanon and E. Europe

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array G-man*'s Avatar
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    Find a class that deals with reality and you will probably just fine.

    I would not take a course that required other than something I actually carried.
    " Blessed is that man, who when facing death, thinks only of his front sight.”
    -Jeff Cooper

    “ Looking around doesn’t cost you anything; and it’s a healthy habit”
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