No plans to visit Baltimore in the near future - Page 3

No plans to visit Baltimore in the near future

This is a discussion on No plans to visit Baltimore in the near future within the Home (And Away From Home) Defense Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by Swedishsteel I have traveled to Baltimore more times than I can count for business meetings and, quite often, to use BWI Airport ...

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  1. #31
    Distinguished Member Array Militant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swedishsteel View Post
    I have traveled to Baltimore more times than I can count for business meetings and, quite often, to use BWI Airport and the connector train to improve my Washington DC access and egress. The Baltimore Inner Harbor is every bit as vibrant, safe, and attractive as similar convention center destinations around the world. BWI Airport is clean, efficient, and convenient. Things deteriorate quickly, however, once one leaves the Inner Harbor area. I have rented cars in Baltimore and driven to Washington when my travel needs required multiple stops. Neighborhoods in both Washington and Baltimore, just outside of the business districts, are jarring. Throughout the 90's and until I retired a few years ago, street prostitution in both cities was conducted in unfettered, open view. Hand to hand drug deals were commonly observed. Row houses often consisting of 5 to 20 connected units with several of the units boarded up while others were still occupied. Trash, graffiti, abandoned cars, broken windows, overgrown weeds were rampant. It is particularly depressing when one enters Washington DC from Baltimore on Route 1 (Rhode Island Ave.) or Route 50 (New York Ave.) From both routes, being slightly more elevated than the heart of the city, it is possible to see the beautifully illuminated dome of the capitol and the Washington monument rising above deteriorated, boarded-up hovels, street level drug traffickers, pimps and their property. I have traveled extensively around the world and I cannot name any more stomach churning display of the chasm between the wealthy and powerful of Washington and the desperate milieu of thousands of residents residing only blocks away.
    Now that's the truth! Great post and I agree 100%

    I travel to Baltimore 1-2 times every year because I am a BALTIMORE RAVENS fan and my wife and I drive up from VA to attend a few of their home games every year. I'll be there in week #2 when the Ravens play the Cardinals. Now, as you (and others) have mentioned, The Inner Harbor area is very nice and clean but interestingly enough, just a few blocks away you run into "THE HOOD". The simple question becomes; "How is that?" Being from New York myself, I'm always amazed by travelling to cities like mine and Baltimore as such and clearly seeing that disparity. Surely, the same economical plan used to beautify one commercial area (The Inner Harbor in Baltimore-for financial profit and gain no doubt) could be used to raise the standard of living of those living around or nearby The Inner Harbor as well. Or, shall I say; "THE HOOD." Surely, the citizens in those areas could also use nice parks, courts, YMCA's, and other community outlets to aid them in giving their kids hope and keeping them involved with various community activities to keep them off the streets, away from selling drugs and out of gangs etc. Right? Of course!

    Just like many here aren't a fan of former President Barack Obama, I'm definitely not a fan of President Trump whatsoever! He and the media can verbally "paint" any type of narrative that they choose to paint about a given place, country, state, city, community or "nationality" of people but you have to dig way down or (way back into our history as a nation) to the ugly truth and not-so-pleasant grassroots as to why cities like Baltimore are in the condition that they are in. They didn't get that way overnight! It's been a very long systemic and calculated process. Things like: "block-busting," "gentrification," and "redlining" (targeting minorities and other people of color) have perpetually stunted various areas in Baltimore and other major cities for generations. Then we wonder why they are in the conditions that they are in and why the people in those communities feel a sense of hopelessness and despair? When those two things kick in (hopelessness and despair); the people get desperate and oftentimes resort to a life of crime to attempt to better their situations. Not saying it's right but I see how it happens. We got to do better as a nation!

    Defining the terms:

    https://legal-dictionary.thefreedict...m/Blockbusting
    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dict...gentrification
    https://www.dictionary.com/browse/redlining
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  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by KevinRohrer View Post
    Baltimore has the top homicide rate per capita in the nation, and may exceed most 3rd world countries: 50 per 100,00.
    This morning Fox News showed Baltimore at #2 behind St. Louis using 2017 data. Per the below link, Baltimore is #4 dangerous city in 2019. They just need to try harder to get that #1 spot.

    https://www.trendrr.net/22497/most-d...murders-worst/

    This link has been updated to reflect 2018 data, but it is consistent with the 2017 data Fox used. https://www.thetrace.org/2018/04/hig...s-cities-list/

    In any case, before I left MD last year, it was probably 3-4 years before that I last visited Baltimore vowing to never go back.
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  3. #33
    Member Array Swedishsteel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Militant View Post
    ... Things like: "block-busting," "gentrification," and "redlining" (targeting minorities and other people of color) have perpetually stunted various areas in Baltimore and other major cities for generations. Then we wonder why they are in the conditions that they are in and why the people in those communities feel a sense of hopelessness and despair? ...

    Defining the terms:

    https://legal-dictionary.thefreedict...m/Blockbusting
    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dict...gentrification
    https://www.dictionary.com/browse/redlining
    Mass incarceration, with a disproportionate ill effect on people without access to wealth and/or influence, has also devastated our nation's urban areas. We currently lock up over 700 of every 100,000 residents. The United States, with less than 5 per cent of the world's population, has more than 20 per cent of the world's prisoners. Even in a full employment environment, a criminal record and a stint in jail makes a successful return to the workplace an overwhelming challenge.

    A pitiful waste of tax payer treasure as the system is currently configured.
    Militant likes this.

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  5. #34
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    Mass incarceration, with a disproportionate ill effect on people without access to wealth and/or influence (could that possibly be because they commit a disproportionate number of crimes?), has also devastated our nation's urban areas. We currently lock up over 700 of every 100,000 residents. The United States, with less than 5 per cent of the world's population, has more than 20 per cent of the world's prisoners. Even in a full employment environment, a criminal record and a stint in jail makes a successful return to the workplace an overwhelming challenge. (YEAH, as the owner of a manufacturing company where we tried hiring parolees, only to have them steal from us, that is a fairly logical outcome to committing so many crimes that they finally lock you up)

    A pitiful waste of tax payer treasure as the system is currently configured. Easy to criticize. Would love to hear your solution.
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  6. #35
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    “Baltimore is a dangerous city and the utmost care and caution should be taken as you go about your daily tasks,” Sgt. Michael Mancuso said.

    Mancuso, the president of the city’s Fraternal Order of Police Lodge no. 3, responded Tuesday to the crime plan Police Commissioner Michael Harrison released last week saying there aren’t enough officers to respond to 911 calls.

    “The Baltimore Police Department is currently 500 Police Officers short of the number required for effectiveness, with 400 of those positions needed in the Patrol Division. The current deployment of Patrol Officers will not be able to, under any circumstances, implement the new crime plan as intended. As it stands now, there are not enough Officers to even respond to the number of calls to 911, not to mention the addition of micro-zones, community engagement, and proactive policing. The plan, as presented, is untenable,” Mancuso added.
    ouch, citizens are pretty much on their own. What's worse, Baltimore or Philly?

    when seconds count, police are minutes away.....or maybe never
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  7. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hatchee View Post
    Easy to criticize. Would love to hear your solution.
    I posted the following considerations in an earlier response on this subject. When I think of the application of the enhanced WAAS tools available I come back to a disturbing recent event in Indianapolis. On Mother's Day of this year, during broad daylight, three cars pulled up to a suburban home owned by an Indianapolis Colts Football coach. Eight individuals got out of the cars and unleashed a fusillade of bullets into the house from guns of at least 5 different calibers. After the shooting was over the gunmen calmly got back in their cars and drove away. As we get into the dog days of summer, no arrests have been made. (https://www.indystar.com/story/news/...es/1411818001/). With WAAS technology in place I am confident that all eight of the participants would have been identified by now. Instead of adopting WAAS, the Mayor and Police Chief of Indianapolis have vowed to put an additional 150 police officers on the street and boost the funding to inner city "watchdog" groups consisting of church pastors and youth leaders who have the primary responsibility of telling their neighbor that things are not as bad as they seem...they have zero impact on reduced criminality.

    I have traveled to Baltimore more times than I can count for business meetings and, quite often, to use BWI Airport and the connector train to improve my Washington DC access and egress. The Baltimore Inner Harbor is every bit as vibrant, safe, and attractive as similar convention center destinations around the world. BWI Airport is clean, efficient, and convenient. Things deteriorate quickly, however, once one leaves the Inner Harbor area. I have rented cars in Baltimore and driven to Washington when my travel needs required multiple stops. Neighborhoods in both Washington and Baltimore, just outside of the business districts, are jarring. Throughout the 90's and until I retired a few years ago, street prostitution in both cities was conducted in unfettered, open view. Hand to hand drug deals were commonly observed. Row houses often consisting of 5 to 20 connected units with several of the units boarded up while others were still occupied. Trash, graffiti, abandoned cars, broken windows, overgrown weeds were rampant. It is particularly depressing when one enters Washington DC from Baltimore on Route 1 (Rhode Island Ave.) or Route 50 (New York Ave.) From both routes, being slightly more elevated than the heart of the city, it is possible to see the beautifully illuminated dome of the capitol and the Washington monument rising above deteriorated, boarded-up hovels, street level drug traffickers, pimps and their property. I have traveled extensively around the world and I cannot name any more stomach churning display of the chasm between the wealthy and powerful of Washington and the desperate milieu of thousands of residents residing only blocks away.

    Baltimore had a chance to attack their crime problem and raise the standard of living for its residents but squandered it due to concerns over privacy rights. https://www.baltimoresun.com/opinion...426-story.html .

    If this article whets your appetite for ways in which Wide Area Aerial Surveillance (WAAS) could cure urban crime I heartily recommend the book "Eyes in the Sky" by Arthur Michel https://dronecenter.bard.edu/staff-b...es-in-the-sky/. The author provides a fairly well balanced report on the benefits of Wide Area Aerial Surveillance and associated systems including ground based cameras, license plate readers, and facial recognition software juxtaposed with rights and attitudes toward personal privacy. I can feel readers of this forum tensing up and fuming over anything that "infringes" on their personal rights and freedoms. Please have an open mind and learn about this subject. I already see that some readers do not stray far from home due to fears, I suppose, over unfamiliar territory in big cities or regions of the country outside their "comfort zone". To me, that's an intolerable diminishing infringement on the freedom to travel, enjoy life, and explore.

    A final thought on the subject of WAAS and its associated support tools. After a forty plus year in risk management, I am convinced that long prison sentences and the death penalty have almost no deterrence on crime. Yes, they separate the offenders from the rest of society but their departure only opens the way for their competitors in the murky underworld to expand their operations. Most criminals have the attitude that they will not be apprehended and, if they are, they will "beat the rap". It's not an unreasonable perspective. Indianapolis, a heartland city near my home, had 159 criminal homicides in 2018. The fourth record breaking year in a row! As of July, 2019 only about 50% of last year's murders have resulted in the arrest of a suspect. The conviction rate of suspects who do not accept a plea is less than 30%. Yep, people get away with murder every day, not to mention rapes, violent assaults, home burglary, car theft etc. What stops criminals is not the harshness of the consequences of being convicted, though that is the easy fix that politicians promote during election years; what stops criminals is the CERTAINTY that if they commit a crime they will be caught and will be punished. Swift, predictable escalating punishments such as short jail stints for first offenders followed by probation and re incarceration for longer periods upon ensuing convictions, would deter many criminals from getting on the treadmill...but the criminal has to know that they will be caught and convicted much more often than they can evade justice after a criminal act.
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  8. #37
    Member Array Swedishsteel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hatchee View Post
    (YEAH, as the owner of a manufacturing company where we tried hiring parolees, only to have them steal from us, that is a fairly logical outcome to committing so many crimes that they finally lock you up)[/B]
    I've had mixed results hiring former convicts but I have learned a few things over many years of trying. Early in my career I was an HR manager for a large integrated steel company, think coke plants, blast furnaces, ore mines, and rolling mills. We had an inviolable policy that all applicants received a background check and anyone with a misdemeanor conviction less than seven years old or a felony at any time in their life was passed over. In the latter part of my career I worked for a more modern (and enlightened) steel manufacture, think electric-arc-furnaces, slab casters, plate mills and pipe making. In both cases employees made excellent wages and had good benefits, although in the latter case, hourly employees were non-union and routinely made over $80,000 per year and as much as $100,000 with production bonuses and profit sharing. During the last 20 years of my career I had the latitude to form and reform policies and we often "took a chance" on applicants with criminal records. Sometimes they were the relative of an existing employee. They included such crimes as drunk driving/manslaughter, armed robbery, assault, fraud, and auto theft. What I learned was that both men and women were a far better risk if they had served at least 2 years in prison compared to someone who had spent six months in county jail. I think it may have had to do with hitting a personal rock bottom, and being self-reflective enough to realize that they needed to change, because the rest of the world was not likely to do so. With those employees, loyalty was off the charts. In conversations they expressed eternal gratitude to the company for giving them an opportunity. They did not all work out, at least not for the chance we offered...I hope they hit their personal rock bottom later, in time to achieve a personal redemption.

  9. #38
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    Sister is visiting from Baltimore this week. Discussed the crime situation and makeup of the local gov't. Per her: like all major cities, there are areas that are in horrible condition within the city limits. The middle class have all moved to the burbs which is where she lives. Lots of nice areas. The locals love it there and have no desire to move. I'm guessing that is the same in Atlanta, Charlotte, Tampa, Houston, Denver, etc, etc.

    The issues lie with the inhabitants of the city. Blaming government is ignoring the real issues....no father in the home, drug use, gangs, pressure for youth by their friends not to succeed....
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  10. #39
    VIP Member Array graydude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hatchee View Post
    The issues lie with the inhabitants of the city. Blaming government is ignoring the real issues....no father in the home, drug use, gangs, pressure for youth by their friends not to succeed....
    Government policies have encouraged single motherhood, drug use, gangs, etc., so government is not off the hook when it comes to blamestorming the causes.
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  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by graydude View Post
    Government policies have encouraged single motherhood, drug use, gangs, etc., so government is not off the hook when it comes to blamestorming the causes.
    graydude is Correct!.

  12. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swedishsteel View Post
    Mass incarceration, with a disproportionate ill effect on people without access to wealth and/or influence, has also devastated our nation's urban areas. We currently lock up over 700 of every 100,000 residents. The United States, with less than 5 per cent of the world's population, has more than 20 per cent of the world's prisoners. Even in a full employment environment, a criminal record and a stint in jail makes a successful return to the workplace an overwhelming challenge.

    A pitiful waste of tax payer treasure as the system is currently configured.
    I couldn't agree more. We need to expand the Death Penalty and use it judiciously. Eventually, there will be no more "mass incarceration" (whatever that Leftist-Liberal makeup term means).
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  13. #42
    Senior Member Array viney266's Avatar
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    I had a motorcycle shop in Baltimore for 16 years. Friends who worked the inner harbour. It was an interesting period in my life. I am glad I am in PA. now. Completely different.

    We were lucky enough being business owners to actually obtain carry permits in MD. However, there were neighborhoods where everyone had a gun...you were just the only fool with a permit for yours. We left in 2004. It has gotten worse.
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  14. #43
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    Should we visit or vacation in _____ ? (Maryland)
    Lets check:
    https://www.gunstocarry.com/ccw-reciprocity-map/
    Nope.
    I'm not inclined to disarm for a concert, game, (entertainment) and I ain't going on a plane or cruise.
    "Wouldn't want to or Nobody volunteer to" get shot by _____ is not indicative of quickly incapacitating.

  15. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by G26Raven View Post
    There are places I avoid, especially if I cannot carry there. ]
    That's a 6 or 12 scenario
    No one will know you have a gun unless you have to use it.
    No way I'm going into a sheethole like that unarmed

  16. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Militant View Post

    Just like many here aren't a fan of former President Barack Obama, I'm definitely not a fan of President Trump whatsoever! He and the media can verbally "paint" any type of narrative that they choose to paint about a given place, country, state, city, community or "nationality" of people but you have to dig way down or (way back into our history as a nation) to the ugly truth and not-so-pleasant grassroots as to why cities like Baltimore are in the condition that they are in. They didn't get that way overnight! It's been a very long systemic and calculated process. Things like: "block-busting," "gentrification," and "redlining" (targeting minorities and other people of color) have perpetually stunted various areas in Baltimore and other major cities for generations. Then we wonder why they are in the conditions that they are in and why the people in those communities feel a sense of hopelessness and despair? When those two things kick in (hopelessness and despair); the people get desperate and oftentimes resort to a life of crime to attempt to better their situations. Not saying it's right but I see how it happens. We got to do better as a nation!
    ]
    Perhaps you would like to compare and contrast the Vietnamese refugees who came here after the war with only what they could carry, to a culture they weren't familiar with, and a language they didn't speak, facing huge racism, and THRIVED.
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