LEO asked to leave an AZ Starbucks - Page 5

LEO asked to leave an AZ Starbucks

This is a discussion on LEO asked to leave an AZ Starbucks within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by craze As far as I'm concerned McDonalds is McDonalds of coffee. Politics aside, I don't get coffee from starbucks because I don't ...

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Thread: LEO asked to leave an AZ Starbucks

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by craze View Post
    As far as I'm concerned McDonalds is McDonalds of coffee. Politics aside, I don't get coffee from starbucks because I don't understand the words they use to describe coffee.
    I prefer establishments where I can get coffee flavored coffee.
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    VIP Member Array graydude's Avatar
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    Personal preferences on coffee and emotion about the companies aside, McDonalds was first to saturate the chain hamburger fast food market, and Starbucks was first to saturate the chain coffee shop market. These are simple facts.

    As Starbucks reaped huge profits other companies decided to siphon off that market too. Starbucksí declining quality gave Mcdonalds, Dunkin Donuts, 7-11, etc, the opportunity to convince customers their coffees were as good or better value than Starbucks. In many cases thatís true.

    But Starbucks is unquestionably the king of the chain coffee shops, and they are the McDonalds of coffee... they replicated McDonaldsí explosive success in a different market segment.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernBoyVA View Post
    FWIW, I would not have left but rather would have suggested to the employee(s) who asked me to leave to have the complaining customer to leave.

    Several years ago, a Buffalo Wind Wings in Manassas refused service to armed police unless they "secured" their sidearms. In another incident, a Denny's refused service to armed police (not in Virginia). This sort of thing is outrageous, whether you are a policeman or a private citizen who is armed. I have never seen a restaurant here in Virginia with a "No Guns" sign but I am sure there are probably a few around somewhere. And back in the day when I openly carried on a regular basis, I never had a problem when dining out with my sidearm in full view. Got to wonder who and what they're hiring.
    Read the previous page. I addressed this BWW incident. It was my former agency who had officers in this restaurant. There are restaurants in VA with No Weapons signs on the doors but I'll wager it's more in NOVA than the ROVA. I've moved to the Shenandoah Valley 4 years ago and I'm certain I've seen none of these signs.
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  5. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Do you really think "Do you hate cops?" is a question on the job application or even asked at an interview? That's pretty profound to even think a company would do that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Skolnick View Post
    I made no suggestion that there was anything specific or formal in hiring practices; I only suggested that policies attract and retain certain kinds of people. In the example above, the employment application at both coffee shops do not include the question "Do you hate cops?" That being established, does OldVet really think that the mentality of the clientele and the staff at the East Side Shoppe will be identical when it comes to cops as the clientele and the staff of the West Side Shoppe?
    https://bearingarms.com/tom-k/2019/0...g-police-sort/

    From Bearing Arms:

    It was just last year that two black men were kicked out of a Starbucks for what was perceived as loitering. In response to the outrage, Starbucks said that they would close down their locations in order to train their employees on racial sensitivity and eliminate their ďunconscious bias.Ē ...

    Iím not ready to vilify an entire company over the actions of a single employee, especially a large one like Starbucks.

    Their reactions, however, illustrates to me that they feel removing police officers with no cause at all is a much lesser offense than asking two perceived loiterers to leave. As Morse notes, the perception that race played a factor somehow made Starbucks trip over themselves to signal that they werenít any such thing, but anti-police bias doesnít enjoy that degree of stigma.

  6. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skolnick View Post
    Their reactions, however, illustrates to me that they feel removing police officers with no cause at all is a much lesser offense than asking two perceived loiterers to leave. As Morse notes, the perception that race played a factor somehow made Starbucks trip over themselves to signal that they werenít any such thing, but anti-police bias doesnít enjoy that degree of stigma.
    Yet you continue to toss around they, them, their as if the company itself made that decision to ask the LEOs to leave. If you were in their shoes, I'm sure you would see the incident with the LEOs every bit as significant as the previous incident.

    But believe what you will, you're on the outside looking in.
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  7. #66
    VIP Member Array graydude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Yet you continue to toss around they, them, their as if the company itself made that decision to ask the LEOs to leave. If you were in their shoes, I'm sure you would see the incident with the LEOs every bit as significant as the previous incident.
    I doubt the corporate masters care much about anything other than the bottom line.

    With the number of employees and managers in Starbucks thereís bound to be a continual HR churn dealing with noise level dumbassery.

    Some of those blips can potentially become PR disasters. Large businesses tend to have PR experts on speed dial to tamp these fires out as quickly as possible, whether they align ideologically or not, and each situation is different so the solutions arenít a cookie cutter approach. Itís just business.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShenandoahValley View Post
    Read the previous page. I addressed this BWW incident. It was my former agency who had officers in this restaurant. There are restaurants in VA with No Weapons signs on the doors but I'll wager it's more in NOVA than the ROVA. I've moved to the Shenandoah Valley 4 years ago and I'm certain I've seen none of these signs.
    While I technically live just outside of NOVA, in reality I am part of that piece of Virginia. I honestly cannot recall seeing a NO GUNS sign in any restaurant in NOVA where I have dined.

    There's one way the Prince William police department could very quickly get the attention of BWW. Since BWW doesn't seem to want armed police in their restaurants, just don't answer any calls for them. After all, police would have to enter one of their restaurants armed when called for some sort of emergency and since they would be armed, they could just stand around outside while whatever happens inside, happens. Sounds like poetic justice to me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Yet you continue to toss around they, them, their as if the company itself made that decision to ask the LEOs to leave ...
    Yes!

    In April of 2018, high level executives of Starbucks, not some wayward bottom tier employee, made the decision to shut down its stores for the afternoon of May 29th over the failure of a wayward bottom tier employee to accommodate two freeloaders who wanted to freeload their facilities.

    In July of 2019, high level executives of Starbucks, not some wayward bottom tier employee, made the decision to just apologize to six paying customers over the failure of a wayward bottom tier employee to treat them like paying customers. No store closure, no free coffee for first responders for the rest of the month, no anti-bias training, just a press release.

    According to their actions, which speak louder than their words, in the executive offices of Starbucks 2 freeloaders > 6 paying cops.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Skolnick View Post
    Yes!

    In April of 2018, high level executives of Starbucks, not some wayward bottom tier employee, made the decision to shut down its stores for the afternoon of May 29th over the failure of a wayward bottom tier employee to accommodate two freeloaders who wanted to freeload their facilities.

    In July of 2019, high level executives of Starbucks, not some wayward bottom tier employee, made the decision to just apologize to six paying customers over the failure of a wayward bottom tier employee to treat them like paying customers. No store closure, no free coffee for first responders for the rest of the month, no anti-bias training, just a press release.

    According to their actions, which speak louder than their words, in the executive offices of Starbucks 2 freeloaders > 6 paying cops.
    All you know is what has been reported on the media, who will push this for all the attention it can get. Do you have an inside source that will confirm that nothing other than what you've heard of the media is happening? No corporate phone calls to the store manager, no employees written up. No nothing, as you claim, other than a public apology?

    Your comments on this event sound very much like all the hoopla the media reports as fact after any shooting, most of which is shown to be inaccurate if not flat-out false in following days. I think any large business is capable of taking care of its PR affairs without flashing it on national media.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernBoyVA View Post
    While I technically live just outside of NOVA, in reality I am part of that piece of Virginia. I honestly cannot recall seeing a NO GUNS sign in any restaurant in NOVA where I have dined.

    There's one way the Prince William police department could very quickly get the attention of BWW. Since BWW doesn't seem to want armed police in their restaurants, just don't answer any calls for them. After all, police would have to enter one of their restaurants armed when called for some sort of emergency and since they would be armed, they could just stand around outside while whatever happens inside, happens. Sounds like poetic justice to me.

    It does sound like poetic justice but unfortunately PWCPD, or any agency for that matter, will not refuse to respond to a call for service. And just an FYI. BWW is in The City of Manassas but it did involved PWCPD officers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skolnick View Post
    Yes!

    In April of 2018, high level executives of Starbucks, not some wayward bottom tier employee, made the decision to shut down its stores for the afternoon of May 29th over the failure of a wayward bottom tier employee to accommodate two freeloaders who wanted to freeload their facilities.

    In July of 2019, high level executives of Starbucks, not some wayward bottom tier employee, made the decision to just apologize to six paying customers over the failure of a wayward bottom tier employee to treat them like paying customers. No store closure, no free coffee for first responders for the rest of the month, no anti-bias training, just a press release.

    According to their actions, which speak louder than their words, in the executive offices of Starbucks 2 freeloaders > 6 paying cops.
    First off, I donít agree with the way the employees in the stores handled either situation. Second, you are wrong about what happened in the first situation. Third, the two situations were very different.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok View Post
    Second, you are wrong about what happened in the first situation.
    How so?

    Quote Originally Posted by Havok View Post
    Third, the two situations were very different.
    How so?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Skolnick View Post
    How so?



    How so?
    In the first case, they weren't freeloading anything, but were two black guys waiting for a friend, one who confirmed their story. And if the corporate policy is so liberal leaning as you claim, why would they choose two black guys instead of two white conservatives? Apparently the manager of that particular Starbucks was a far-right white supremist who slipped by the Starbucks liberal screening process. But because they were black, of course it's a racial incident, not a case of two people who refused to leaved when asked.

    Now the second incident is the rejection of service to LEOs, clearly the result of that liberal screening process mentioned. That would fit the image. Libs hate LE, you know.

    So we have white racist employees on one hand, LE-hating Lib employees on the other. Clearly Starbucks employee interviewing process is defective. Maybe the question on the application should read: Do you want to stir crap up and make national headlines? If yes, continue to the next question. If no, apply to someone else.

    You don't suppose it might just have been stupid decisions by employees and customers alike, do you?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShenandoahValley View Post
    It does sound like poetic justice but unfortunately PWCPD, or any agency for that matter, will not refuse to respond to a call for service. And just an FYI. BWW is in The City of Manassas but it did involved PWCPD officers.
    I know that and was being facetious. However, it would be a nice payback for their arrogance.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    You don't suppose it might just have been stupid decisions by employees and customers alike, do you?
    Absolutely, positively, 100%, no.

    First, I was commenting about responses by high ranking executives hours and days after the fact, not to decisions made by low-level employees in the heat of the moment.

    Second, the 6 customers did nothing stupid (other than frequent a Starbucks); all of the other people involved were low-level employees, their managers, and non-customers.

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