If You Are Like This Guy, You Are Not Helping... - Page 14

If You Are Like This Guy, You Are Not Helping...

This is a discussion on If You Are Like This Guy, You Are Not Helping... within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by graydude Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post Yes. Do you have a problem with guns in church? I've never seen a gun ...

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  1. #196
    Senior Member Array Bikenut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by graydude View Post
    Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    Yes. Do you have a problem with guns in church?
    I've never seen a gun openly carried in a church outside a war zone.

    If I saw a OC'd pistol in a holster in my church I'd assess the carrier. Is it a regular, someone I know, or a complete stranger to me? Is the person calm, excited, aloof, engaged, happy, angry? Are they familiar with the flow of entry, and events? What kind of presence and attitude are they displaying? How are people around them reacting?

    If I saw a long gun of any kind in church my first reaction would be to usher my family away, without gaining the carrier's attention if possible.

    Do you carry a long gun to church? If yes, what's the reaction? If no, why not?
    My point was taking the totality of the situation into account before deciding whether the person carrying a rifle was a danger or not... whether in public or even in church. And that the same holds true for any open carrier rifle or pistol.

    I have not carried a long gun at church but I do know of folks who carried shotguns during the bi weekly trap shoots at church.
    Character is doing the right thing when nobody's looking. There are too many people who think that the only thing that's right is to get by, and the only thing that's wrong is to get caught. ~J.C. Watts

  2. #197
    Senior Member Array Bikenut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    Well I guess the point I've been trying to make about gun owners ridiculing those they don't agree with .........
    Pot, kettle...
    Incorrect. There isn't any method of carry that I disagree with.
    Character is doing the right thing when nobody's looking. There are too many people who think that the only thing that's right is to get by, and the only thing that's wrong is to get caught. ~J.C. Watts

  3. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    Incorrect. There isn't any method of carry that I disagree with.
    I was talking about the ridiculing part. There are several methods of carry that I refuse to support, and believe to be counterproductive to the overall promotion to Second Amendment rights.
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  5. #199
    Senior Member Array Bikenut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    Incorrect. There isn't any method of carry that I disagree with.
    I was talking about the ridiculing part. There are several methods of carry that I refuse to support, and believe to be counterproductive to the overall promotion to Second Amendment rights.
    You, and everyone else including me, are entitled to our opinions and our decisions as to what we will do in our own personal lives yet when we do not support the freedom of others to exercise their right to bear arms, even if done in ways we don't like, the entire right to bear arms suffers.
    OldChap likes this.
    Character is doing the right thing when nobody's looking. There are too many people who think that the only thing that's right is to get by, and the only thing that's wrong is to get caught. ~J.C. Watts

  6. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    Well I guess the point I've been trying to make about gun owners ridiculing those they don't agree with .........
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  7. #201
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    You, and everyone else including me, are entitled to our opinions and our decisions as to what we will do in our own personal lives yet when we do not support the freedom of others to exercise their right to bear arms, even if done in ways we don't like, the entire right to bear arms suffers.
    I think we've covered it. Let's shut this one down and move on.
    PhaedrusIV likes this.
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  8. #202
    Senior Member Array Bikenut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    You, and everyone else including me, are entitled to our opinions and our decisions as to what we will do in our own personal lives yet when we do not support the freedom of others to exercise their right to bear arms, even if done in ways we don't like, the entire right to bear arms suffers.
    I think we've covered it. Let's shut this one down and move on.
    Up to you. You started the thread.
    Mike1956 likes this.
    Character is doing the right thing when nobody's looking. There are too many people who think that the only thing that's right is to get by, and the only thing that's wrong is to get caught. ~J.C. Watts

  9. #203
    VIP Member Array G-man*'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    Yep, it isn't just the anti gunners who are willing to insist guns are only carried in ways they personally consider acceptable.
    If you are going to continue to defend some practice such as OCing a rifle in public, then, please be concise in your facts.

    Some things should be self evident and common sense. An example; it is widely accepted that keeping your finger off the trigger and not pointed at anything you do not wish to destroy a rule of proper and safe gun handling practice.

    Yet, it is not written in any local or state law that I am aware of.

    Likewise, I am not against open carry. However I believe that using good judgement in the How and where I carry are good rules to live by.

    For those that day they are educating the public, I say BS.

    If you really wanted to educate the public, you would have a display table set up, with a fact sheet, some dummy rounds, and a demonstration of how quick it is to reload a 10 round mag vs 15 round mag, a comparison of the 30-06 vs 5.56, and a demonstration of how a revolver is also a modern repeating firearm with lever guns also.

    This would be truly more educational than strutting around with a weapon designed for offensive use, rather than the convenience of defensive carry.
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  10. #204
    Senior Member Array Bikenut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    If you are going to continue to defend some practice such as OCing a rifle in public, then, please be concise in your facts.

    Some things should be self evident and common sense. An example; it is widely accepted that keeping your finger off the trigger and not pointed at anything you do not wish to destroy a rule of proper and safe gun handling practice.

    Yet, it is not written in any local or state law that I am aware of.

    Likewise, I am not against open carry. However I believe that using good judgement in the How and where I carry are good rules to live by.

    For those that day they are educating the public, I say BS.

    If you really wanted to educate the public, you would have a display table set up, with a fact sheet, some dummy rounds, and a demonstration of how quick it is to reload a 10 round mag vs 15 round mag, a comparison of the 30-06 vs 5.56, and a demonstration of how a revolver is also a modern repeating firearm with lever guns also.

    This would be truly more educational than strutting around with a weapon designed for offensive use, rather than the convenience of defensive carry.
    That is your opinion of what would be an effective educational process. Other people have other opinions and, like you have the freedom to engage in your educational process, they have the freedom to engage in theirs.

    What I keep seeing in these discussions is folks saying they are all for educating the public.... as long as it is done in a way they consider acceptable and a pox on those who do it any other way.

    "shall not be infringed" doesn't have any reference to "acceptable".
    Character is doing the right thing when nobody's looking. There are too many people who think that the only thing that's right is to get by, and the only thing that's wrong is to get caught. ~J.C. Watts

  11. #205
    VIP Member Array G-man*'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    That is your opinion of what would be an effective educational process. Other people have other opinions and, like you have the freedom to engage in your educational process, they have the freedom to engage in theirs.

    What I keep seeing in these discussions is folks saying they are all for educating the public.... as long as it is done in a way they consider acceptable and a pox on those who do it any other way.

    "shall not be infringed" doesn't have any reference to "acceptable".
    So then, what lesson is the man teaching those who really don’t know anything about firearms, but thinks an “assault weapons ban” sounds logical? They seem the guy strutting around with his black rifle, but what did he teach them?
    " Blessed is that man, who when facing death, thinks only of his front sight.”
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    “ Looking around doesn’t cost you anything; and it’s a healthy habit”
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  12. #206
    Senior Member Array Bikenut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    That is your opinion of what would be an effective educational process. Other people have other opinions and, like you have the freedom to engage in your educational process, they have the freedom to engage in theirs.

    What I keep seeing in these discussions is folks saying they are all for educating the public.... as long as it is done in a way they consider acceptable and a pox on those who do it any other way.

    "shall not be infringed" doesn't have any reference to "acceptable".
    So then, what lesson is the man teaching those who really don’t know anything about firearms, but thinks an “assault weapons ban” sounds logical? They seem the guy strutting around with his black rifle, but what did he teach them?
    He taught them that even though they were next to someone with one of those scary black rifles right there in their faces no one got shot.
    Character is doing the right thing when nobody's looking. There are too many people who think that the only thing that's right is to get by, and the only thing that's wrong is to get caught. ~J.C. Watts

  13. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    He taught them that even though they were next to someone with one of those scary black rifles right there in their faces no one got shot.
    You assume. And that makes an ass u me both.

    And just as likely they may be thinking “ yeah, I see why they want to get rid of private ownership of these weapons because these people are without filters”.

    This is not education.
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    " Blessed is that man, who when facing death, thinks only of his front sight.”
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  14. #208
    VIP Member Array OldChap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    This would be truly more educational than strutting around with a weapon designed for offensive use, rather than the convenience of defensive carry.
    Brother...I’m going to give you the benefit of the doubt here and just figure you had some kind of “senior moment.” Our SWAT team carried AR’s, shotguns, and pistols. I can’t remember a single moment when it wasn’t the team leader who determined if those weapons were going to be used offensively or defensively. I struggle to think of a single weapon system that was designed solely for offensive use.
    "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has limits."

  15. #209
    VIP Member Array graydude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    My point was taking the totality of the situation into account before deciding whether the person carrying a rifle was a danger or not... whether in public or even in church. And that the same holds true for any open carrier rifle or pistol.

    I have not carried a long gun at church but I do know of folks who carried shotguns during the bi weekly trap shoots at church.
    The totality of the situation is there is nothing so urgent at church that my family can't come back later. We don't need to wait to find out why someone is carrying a rifle or shotgun to church, we can simply find an expedient exit and find out from others how things unfolded. If I over react by leaving with my family, oh well, that's a very low cost especially compared to the risk of being shot.
    AzQkr likes this.
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  16. #210
    Senior Member Array Bikenut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    He taught them that even though they were next to someone with one of those scary black rifles right there in their faces no one got shot.
    You assume. And that makes an ass u me both.

    And just as likely they may be thinking “ yeah, I see why they want to get rid of private ownership of these weapons because these people are without filters”.

    This is not education.
    If I am assuming folks learned just because they were next to a guy with one of those scary black rifles doesn't mean they will surely be shot because they were not shot then...

    I'd say you are assuming they may be thinking “ yeah, I see why they want to get rid of private ownership of these weapons because these people are without filters”.
    Character is doing the right thing when nobody's looking. There are too many people who think that the only thing that's right is to get by, and the only thing that's wrong is to get caught. ~J.C. Watts

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