Vaping - Page 3

Vaping

This is a discussion on Vaping within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by gnius That post makes no sense medically. I have patients who smoked 2 packs a day for 30 years and have no ...

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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by gnius View Post
    That post makes no sense medically. I have patients who smoked 2 packs a day for 30 years and have no semblance of emphysema, and people who smoked half a pack for 10 years who are approaching respiratory failure. Just because you appear to have tolerated one insult, doesn't mean you won't be on a ventilator after one vape session that doesn't agree with your lung physiology. Also, you'd be surprised how much actual long disease people have sometimes before they notice that anything is wrong.
    My question at the end was serious. I want to know.
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  2. #32
    Senior Member Array OneGunTX's Avatar
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    What about alcohol? Think of all the deaths associated with drink driving. How many lives would be saved?
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok View Post
    23 people have died in the US from vaping. Other than Ebola, what can you think of that has caused less deaths in the US? Iím not saying I think vaping is a good idea, but from what I understand, the big problem is the black market that is being created, where more unknown chemicals are being put in.

    I just think itís interesting that we will talk about how few people are murdered with rifles, but something that causes only a small fraction of the deaths is some major epidemic that needs to be addressed. Meanwhile, people will continue eating McDonaldís, and McDonaldís will continue to catch the attention of our kids to ensure they want to eat the unhealthy food.
    I gather you would just dismiss any deaths caused by various "things" - until the number rises to a sufficient level? I think equating criminal human activity with the desire of a corporation to make money is a bit far-fetched.

    We regulate all manner of things in this country. The intent of many of those regulations is to protect the public. I could list a whole array of such things, say...passenger aircraft with fatal design defects, bridge designs that are flawed, storage of nuclear materials, automobiles that kill the occupants in a crash, listeria in ice cream, kitchen workers washing hands, prescription medications, the list is long. I'm certainly not wise enough to know which ones need regulating, and I'm not sure anyone has a crystal ball and can tell which ones will eventually kill huge numbers of people.

    As for me, I've done quite enough funerals for people who were killed well before their years in my lifetime.
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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldChap View Post
    I gather you would just dismiss any deaths caused by various "things" - until the number rises to a sufficient level? I think equating criminal human activity with the desire of a corporation to make money is a bit far-fetched.

    We regulate all manner of things in this country. The intent of many of those regulations is to protect the public. I could list a whole array of such things, say...passenger aircraft with fatal design defects, bridge designs that are flawed, storage of nuclear materials, automobiles that kill the occupants in a crash, listeria in ice cream, kitchen workers washing hands, prescription medications, the list is long. I'm certainly not wise enough to know which ones need regulating, and I'm not sure anyone has a crystal ball and can tell which ones will eventually kill huge numbers of people.

    As for me, I've done quite enough funerals for people who were killed well before their years in my lifetime.
    Not so much dismissing the deaths, but showing that people donít really care about health/life. They just want to control others. If it were really about health, every alcohol and tobacco company would be out of business, and so would most restaurants. Yes the government regulates a lot of things. That doesnít mean we have to agree with them regulating vaping, or the size of your sada any more than we like the NFA.
    We get the government we deserve.

  5. #35
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    All I can say as the parent of a 16 year old son these things are the devil. The are impossible to catch, a Juul is literally the size of a jump drive, they emit no odor and leave no trace. They can literally be sucking on one five seconds before you walk into a room and once the vapor is no longer visible you'd never know. The kids don't even begin to understand what addiction is or what it will do to them... they just think it's cool and that they can walk away when and if they want to like it was candy.

    I'm an attentive parent... I pay attention... I toss my kid's room from time to time and I missed his Juul - twice. The first time I found it I confiscated it, talked to him and got his promise that he wouldn't do it again... Nine months later, through a different situation, I found out he had another Juul and didn't make it three days after I busted him the first time. I was lucky this was the end of summer before school went back. I locked him in the house for two weeks and took away every contact he had with the outside world to break the addition and learned about urine test for nicotine.

    I don't know if they'll kill you or not but I do know you're better off without them in your life and they are purpose designed to avoid detection. I hate those things... rant off.
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  6. #36
    Senior Member Array DaGunny's Avatar
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    A few years back there was a concerted push for the FDA to declare nicotine an addictive drug. There was a huge uproar when the FDA refused to do so. Why? The law and money. If the FDA were to officially declare nicotine as an addictive drug, then 29% (or so) of the American public would become official drug addicts.

    As drug addicts they would become eligible for free (government funded) care to help them kick their addiction. Additionally, they could all qualify for SSI (Supplemental Security Income) from Social Security as do a large majority of diagnosed drug addicts (thank you San Francisco). Think about it. 90+ million Americans becoming instant criminals AND eligible for government assistance on the same day. Then compound that with the additional legal system costs associated with the "new" illegal drug epidemic.

    The FDA was basically forbidden from declaring nicotine a drug. Had they done so, the costs would be in the Trillions of dollars. Money talks.
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  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by deadguy View Post
    My question at the end was serious. I want to know.
    I worked in a film processing lab for several semesters as a chemist while I was in grad school for my Masters. We had a whole room full of stuff that would kill in a matter seconds without a full respirator. I interviewed once at a place called Pantex. (You can look up what they do there) Have you ever seen plutonium "rust" turn to vapor? From what I understand e-cigs have some pretty toxic materials mixed in the smoke.

    I have to tell you though. Anyone who would deliberately eat, drink, or smoke anything made in Communist China is, well, not too wise, IMHO.
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldChap View Post
    I worked in a film processing lab for several semesters as a chemist while I was in grad school for my Masters. We had a whole room full of stuff that would kill in a matter seconds without a full respirator. I interviewed once at a place called Pantex. (You can look up what they do there) Have you ever seen plutonium "rust" turn to vapor? From what I understand e-cigs have some pretty toxic materials mixed in the smoke.
    This is why i asked the question. I looked up the ingredients listed by one of the manufacturers and it consists of Glycerol, Propylene Glycol, Benzoic Acid, Nicotine, Natural Oils, Extracts, and Flavor.

    What is being hidden?
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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by deadguy View Post
    This is why i asked the question. I looked up the ingredients listed by one of the manufacturers and it consists of Glycerol, Propylene Glycol, Benzoic Acid, Nicotine, Natural Oils, Extracts, and Flavor.

    What is being hidden?
    That is one of the issues being investigated right now. Either the manufacturers have been fudging, or others are adding ingredients, or both. Most common I hear about illegally added is THC. The problem is, as in the example I'm familiar with, hospital blood work indicated nothing in the blood. @gnius would probably know, but Mrs OldChap tells me hospital labs don't normally test for exotic materials or heavy metals. He might know what they do test for. Him or our resident pathologist.
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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldChap View Post
    That is one of the issues being investigated right now. Either the manufacturers have been fudging, or others are adding ingredients, or both. Most common I hear about illegally added is THC. The problem is, as in the example I'm familiar with, hospital blood work indicated nothing in the blood. @gnius would probably know, but Mrs OldChap tells me hospital labs don't normally test for exotic materials or heavy metals. He might know what they do test for. Him or our resident pathologist.
    Everyday tox screens, as I hope the patho will weigh in on, don't test for everything, I have been told. For example, a Coroner informed me that certain designer drugs like carfentanil don't show up in routine screens. A more expensive test has to be done to detect it. Doc can correct me on this if not the case.

    I've read where the coils used in these devices burn out over time, and wonder if there is some sort of toxic emission when this process begins or hits a certain stage.

    Interesting to me that none of these health problems were reported until CBD oils became legal in most states.
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  11. #41
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    Cbd oils arenít meant to be vaped. Are they? Same with vitamin E, coconut oils and many other food grade products. Vaporized oils are just a really bad idea for introducing into the lungs. Of course, the cartels and neighborhood chemists donít really care what they put in their blends.
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  12. #42
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    Next up: CBD oil enemas.
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  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Next up: CBD oil enemas.
    Can't wait to get your Christmas card after you try this.
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  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by deadguy View Post
    This is why i asked the question. I looked up the ingredients listed by one of the manufacturers and it consists of Glycerol, Propylene Glycol, Benzoic Acid, Nicotine, Natural Oils, Extracts, and Flavor.

    What is being hidden?
    So just to be clear, unless it's on the toxin list or a regulated drug, the manufacturer is not required to reveal any ingredient that's <1% by weight or volume.
    Secondly, among what you listed, I'm going to rattle off some things...

    "natural oils" : read "nebulized lipid" = acute lipoid pneumonia
    benzoic acid = acute interstitial pneumonitis

    There's a website set up by a few researchers that talks about respiratory effects of ecig inhalation:
    https://eliquidinfo.org/

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