Red Flag - Nabs wrong person w/ same name - Page 2

Red Flag - Nabs wrong person w/ same name

This is a discussion on Red Flag - Nabs wrong person w/ same name within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; We don't have red flag laws in Nebraska yet but there is someone else with the same name as me within 15 miles but with ...

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Thread: Red Flag - Nabs wrong person w/ same name

  1. #16
    Distinguished Member Array NECCdude's Avatar
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    We don't have red flag laws in Nebraska yet but there is someone else with the same name as me within 15 miles but with JR on the end. We're not related. Turns out my name is fairly popular across the country. Anyway, it's obviously a bad law as written.
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  2. #17
    VIP Member Array CG11's Avatar
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    Names are actually a pretty unreliable way to identify someone. Many years ago, someone in Michigan with my same name defaulted on a home loan. This has followed my my whole life and I have never set foot in the state. It just won't die, and every time I purchase a home, etc, this comes up.
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by CG11 View Post
    Names are actually a pretty unreliable way to identify someone. Many years ago, someone in Michigan with my same name defaulted on a home loan. This has followed my my whole life and I have never set foot in the state. It just won't die, and every time I purchase a home, etc, this comes up.
    My wife has had that problem with a few disreputable women of the same name, even though the first names are spelled differently. It even went to the point that LE showed up to arrest her before figuring out the names are actually different.
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  5. #19
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    I think this case proves the fault in the RF laws. Here we see clear evidence that the victim of injustice is not the accused. What happens. The system breaks down because no one planned for mistaken identity. How hard would it have been to use a phone camera to snap a photo of the victim and present to the the accuser in minutes to hours or even a day to verify ID? Not hard at all. But the victim has to show up in court so the accuser can confirm he is not the perp. That is because the seizure is court order so only a court can nullify it. this case is an example of abject failure of due process. I hope the man sues the Florida. Maybe that would get some light shown on the abise of 4A.
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  6. #20
    VIP Member Array OldChap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by G26Raven View Post
    Law enforcement makes mistakes just like us ordinary people. About 20 years ago, I got a letter from the DA in Los Angeles telling me I owed $46K in back child support. Since I had never had any children, to the best of my knowledge, I was pretty shocked, as was my wife. When I examined the letter closely, I realized that the first name was spelled with a variation from the way I spell mine. I had to produce a copy of my driver's license, my passport, my social security number, etc. When they finally sent me a letter telling me I was not the person they were looking for, they admonished me to hold on to the letter they had sent me, just in case they decided to question my identity again.
    Sad story. And yes, I agree, law enforcement makes mistakes - race problem: HUMAN RACE. But, most law enforcement organizations understand that mistakes cost lives in their business. We ALWAYS double and triple checked our intelligence sources before taking any kind of action that could result in loss of life. Informant information always got extra scrutiny and periodically we reviewed such sources by a sort of "peer review" process.

    More accurately, the top brass was more worried about lawsuits than anything else since those mistakes proved costly to one's career. I spent a bit of time reminding them that there would always be lawsuits, but our legacy would be in how well we did our jobs and prevented tragedy. Fortunately, our Chief was a man of great integrity, so my little pep talks always went well. He insisted that his officers make as few mistakes as possible - always. I will always be thankful for his incredible leadership.
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  7. #21
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    This is a horrible story to read. Of course, they will bend over backward to prove people guilty but when someone is innocent.....oh well.




    Back in college, one evening my car was towed. It was pouring down raining and I parked in what I thought was the the last parallel space on a street to run into the library. Meter spaces were free after hours.

    When towed, the deal was you hitched or cabbed down to the tow lot, and paid the tow truck company x amount and they would give your car back. But in this case, somehow, somewhere, I got down there, it had showed up as stolen so they wouldn't give it to me. No cell phones back then either, so I had to go to the college police station. Turns out something with the DMV systems of my home state my car was registered in, and the state I was attending college didn't coincide. The officer on duty even asked me how could I prove it was my car. I was so pissed off I answered "I have the keys don't I?" and held them up. This wasn't acceptable proof though. Then I remembered I had my auto insurance card in my wallet and showed them that. That was enough proof. But by the time i was done with all that, the tow business' lot was closed and I had to wait until the next day to pick it up.

    The way it ended though, and the way the tow company explained it, is that it was never going to be towed to begin with. They told me I got ripped off cause I wasn't all the way in the space and the car in front of mine was actually taking up some of the space I was in. When the officer saw I wasn't completely inside the parallel parking spot, he/she went to write the ticket, but when they called in the plate or whatever, that's when it showed up or they interpreted it as "stolen". So they had it towed/impounded.

    The parking ticket was noting but the tow was $80, which was a lot of money for some college freshman to have back then. This was also my real first experience feeling like I had been screwed over. It wouldn't be the last but it's a terrible feeling.

  8. #22
    Member Array Nifty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok View Post
    It is, but it all takes time. They know that even if/when it gets struck down on the courts, there are no repercussions for violating people’s rights until then.
    Remember,

    "shall not be infringed"

    Yeah. Seems this has been forgotten.
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  9. #23
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    And what about identity theft.........
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  10. #24
    Distinguished Member Array NECCdude's Avatar
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    There's a cartoon at Townhall that shows a red flag with the hammer and sickle on it. Captioned "beware of red flag laws".

    https://townhall.com/political-carto...9/08/20/167681
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  11. #25
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    @Nifty The most difficult part of my experience with law enforcement was not the officers, but the career bureaucrats. To this day I believe the ONLY criteria for hiring people for such positions was that they be terminally incompetent. Oh...and it helped if they had a Napoleon complex.

    The majority of our department's civilian employees were excellent and generally on-board with the mission. Some of the agencies we worked with...not so much. These lazy incompetents unfortunately give law enforcement a bad name.
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  12. #26
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    I had a job for years that required a lot of air travel (60-80 a year). After 911, I was not allowed to use advanced check-in or curbside luggage check. I always had to stand in line and present 2 types of ID to get a boarding pass. For years nobody could tell me why. I finally found out that someone on the No-Fly List had (at some point) used my name as an alias. I couldn't get too upset because, after all, it was just an inconvenience.

    Red Flag Laws are rife with opportunities for abuse. Upset with your neighbor/boss/significant other? Red Flag them. That will teach them a lesson!
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  13. #27
    Ex Member Array AzQkr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldChap View Post
    @Nifty The most difficult part of my experience with law enforcement was not the officers, but the career bureaucrats. To this day I believe the ONLY criteria for hiring people for such positions was that they be terminally incompetent. Oh...and it helped if they had a Napoleon complex.

    The majority of our department's civilian employees were excellent and generally on-board with the mission. Some of the agencies we worked with...not so much. These lazy incompetents unfortunately give law enforcement a bad name.
    There's a lot of truth in that post sir.
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  14. #28
    Senior Member Array CaptSmith's Avatar
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    the key person for "responsibility" in these ex-parte court proceedings is the Judge....The judge decides if there is enough evidence to make a "emergency" order...and the requesting party (police) is responsible for the accuracy of the filings...clearly in this instance there is something to talk to the Judge about...hard to imagine a TRO that didn't have some form of police paper-work of some kind...especially if the requesting party IS the police...hope the juy has the stones to ***** loudly to their faces...big time
    Last edited by CaptSmith; August 20th, 2019 at 06:32 PM. Reason: edit..***** in this post is an Adverb..not a adjective, talking as in bitching v. female dog
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  15. #29
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    I'm surprised it took this long.

    If only there were some way to let the suspect face their accuser. If only there were some way to hear their side before stripping natural rights to self defense. If only we had a mechanism for someone to oversee these orders and ensure all information was accurate.
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  16. #30
    VIP Member Array OldChap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptSmith View Post
    the key person for "responsibility" in these ex-parte court proceedings is the Judge....The judge decides if there is enough evidence to make a "emergency" order...and the requesting party (police) is responsible for the accuracy of the filings...clearly in this instance there is something to talk to the Judge about...hard to imagine a TRO that didn't have some form of police paper-work of some kind...especially if the requesting party IS the police...hope the juy has the stones to ***** loudly to their faces...big time
    Does anyone know for sure if red flag hearings require a jury? I would expect they don't as they have no defense counsel, therefore no voir dire. The whole focus seems to be speed, as in, " Let's get this travesty of justice done so we can hurry up and whitewash ourselves of any blame!"

    I cannot imagine ANY serious legal objections being raised.

    I also see now that the word "juy" might be "guy" and not "jury" as I first thought.
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