Florida Bill Would Require CCW Applicants Undergo Mental Evaluation - Page 3

Florida Bill Would Require CCW Applicants Undergo Mental Evaluation

This is a discussion on Florida Bill Would Require CCW Applicants Undergo Mental Evaluation within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; I don't have much faith in polling data these days but they are of some interest. When I see polling data coming from foreign sources ...

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Thread: Florida Bill Would Require CCW Applicants Undergo Mental Evaluation

  1. #31
    Distinguished Member Array NECCdude's Avatar
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    I don't have much faith in polling data these days but they are of some interest. When I see polling data coming from foreign sources (i.e. with the BBC logo) or liberal media outlets I become suspicious. That said, when I looked into getting a firearm permit for Costa Rica I was informed that they perform a mental health evaluation before considering issuing a permit. But, stable mental health is subjective and subject to change. Anyway, having a mental health evaluation is preferable to authorities taking ones guns away before determining if someone is "crazy".
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  2. #32
    Senior Member Array Bikenut's Avatar
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    The definition of mental health changes according to whoever is writing the criteria for determining what is healthy.... and the criteria is dependent on what agenda they are trying to implement.
    Character is doing the right thing when nobody's looking. There are too many people who think that the only thing that's right is to get by, and the only thing that's wrong is to get caught. ~J.C. Watts

  3. #33
    Senior Member Array cal44's Avatar
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    I think any politician should be required to undergo a mental evaluation to run for the legislature.
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  5. #34
    VIP Member Array graydude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nix View Post
    No disagreement with what you've said here. I'm trying to be open minded though. The number of mass shootings we are seeing is concerning; gun deaths have been on the rise for a couple years now.

    At the same time, the number of firearm advocates seems to be decreasing. I see more politicians being willing to openly challenge the scope of the second amendment. Now I see corporate leaders calling for restrictions. While President Obama did his part to increase guns sales, I don't think this trend continues today. Only about 1 in 3 Americans owns a firearm. The current state of mind of the nation concerning gun rights seems to be shifting against us. I saw a concerning statistic on this: currently most Americans would like to see more restrictive gun laws in place (if some research is to be believed.) Note here that gun-owning Democrats are also mostly in favor of more restrictive gun laws according to this Pew data:







    It would seem to be in our interests--as supporters of the second amendment--to look at ways to prevent, as far as is possible, more mass shootings. Being inflexible and hoping that the second amendment will stand the test of time and a changing society, or not be repealed by the 28th amendment, does not seem like a sound plan to me. I forget where I heard the saying, "Hope is NOT a plan!", but the message stuck.

    I'm not saying mass mental health screenings is a good plan or a practical plan. Far from it. However, I do think we as a community should be considering ways to actively prevent unlawful actions. Actions that may lead to reactions and consequences we might not agree with. Keeping guns out of the hands of the irresponsible or incapable would seem to be a good idea. Surely none of us want psychopaths or mentally unstable individuals out in society representing us with their firearms?


    Another bit of Pew data to chew on:






    A combination of "more guns in more places" but also "keep guns out of the hands of crazies." The first part will be hard to sell, the second part is proving trickier to implement. Yes, it seems like Florida is fumbling with this idea. But that doesn't make the underlying impulse a bad one, per se. My two cents.
    Any effort to take guns out of the hands of mentally incompetent people needs to start with the assumption of innocence and competence until legally proven otherwise. Any legal inquiry into mental incompetence needs to be initiated based on sufficient evidence indicating a problem, not a 100% sweep of all carriers and applicants, nor a red flag sweep/swatting which is ripe for abuse.

    I agree the gun community should help find solutions to the problems rather than appear to be nothing but obstructionists. But the solutions need to start with effectively enforcing existing laws, not making more laws that infringe on law abiding citizens.
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  6. #35
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    When car owners are expected to work to prevent DWIís, Iíll worry about doing my part to prevent mass shootings. Until then, my role is gun rights, and protecting myself.
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  7. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok View Post
    When car owners are expected to work to prevent DWIís, Iíll worry about doing my part to prevent mass shootings. Until then, my role is gun rights, and protecting myself.

    It's not clear to me that one excludes the other. Maybe we should advocate for both?

    I don't know that other people not being smart about protecting their self-interested rights makes me want to ignore my own. Suit yourself, though.

    I can foresee the day when insurance and legal pressures compel people to use self-driving cars rather that the fun sleds we use now. DUI's may become a thing of the past. And bar-hopping might be fun once again. I don't know that future gun enthusiasts will experience such a bright future without being a bit more savy.
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  8. #37
    VIP Member Array Havok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nix View Post
    It's not clear to me that one excludes the other. Maybe we should advocate for both?

    I don't know that other people not being smart about protecting their self-interested rights makes me want to ignore my own. Suit yourself, though.

    I can foresee the day when insurance and legal pressures compel people to use self-driving cars rather that the fun sleds we use now. DUI's may become a thing of the past. And bar-hopping might be fun once again. I don't know that future gun enthusiasts will experience such a bright future without being a bit more savy.
    Should people? Yeah, maybe so. Itís a good thing to do. But one group is expected to take the blame for other peopleís actions, and the other isnít. Right now, I do my part by not driving drunk, and not committing crimes.
    We get the government we deserve.

  9. #38
    Distinguished Member Array flphotog's Avatar
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    Not saying it's not a concern but this is probably just another crap bill, in dems introduce more of these than I'm willing to try counting every year and few if any get out of committe, at least in the senate a few make it out in the house but die along the way. Also we finally have a governor that I trust to veto anything that might actually make it to his desk
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  10. #39
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    Florida Bill?

    Heck, when I saw the thread title, I thought they'd finally released the name of Florida Man.

    This proposal makes just as much sense as a lot of other things we've read about that Florida Man has done! Now we know his name is Bill.
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  11. #40
    Senior Member Array pskys2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ddrew View Post
    I would like to introduce a bill requiring all democrats, especially ones holding office, to undergo mental health evaluations.
    I feel confident that well over half would fail miserably
    I doubt it, remember they will be evaluating on what their proffession deems normal. Last I checked most medical/psyciatric associations were anti-gun and/or liberal. So in their view normal would be to hate guns. Abnormal would be to carry guns. Just because you were there to get a CCW Permit would probably be a disqualifier to their "normal". In like mind the politicians who hate guns would be "normal". Sad to Say!
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  12. #41
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    People in the mental health business will tell you that outside of the extreme whackadoodles, they have no real way to separate who might go ballistic from those who won't. Any who tell you otherwise are lying or delusional.
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  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by pskys2 View Post
    Abnormal would be to carry guns. Just because you were there to get a CCW Permit would probably be a disqualifier to their "normal".
    Catch 22
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  14. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by pskys2 View Post
    I doubt it, remember they will be evaluating on what their proffession deems normal. Last I checked most medical/psyciatric associations were anti-gun and/or liberal. So in their view normal would be to hate guns. Abnormal would be to carry guns. Just because you were there to get a CCW Permit would probably be a disqualifier to their "normal". In like mind the politicians who hate guns would be "normal". Sad to Say!
    Evaluate their overall mental health, not their position on guns

  15. #44
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    What a load of dingo's kidneys. CCW holders across the nation are proven to be among the most law abiding citizens of all, and it's likely they would turn out to be among the most mentally stable and competent as well. Why do Lefties always feel the need to blame and punish millions of the most innocent and productive members of society for the actions of a few whackos?
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  16. #45
    VIP Member Array sdprof's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavesYourUncle View Post
    What a load of dingo's kidneys. CCW holders across the nation are proven to be among the most law abiding citizens of all, and it's likely they would turn out to be among the most mentally stable and competent as well. Why do Lefties always feel the need to blame and punish millions of the most innocent and productive members of society for the actions of a few whackos?
    As I recently heard on a podcast, they use the kindergarten method of jurisprudence.

    "One person misbehaves, punish the whole class."
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    ~~~~~
    The only common sense gun legislation was written about 227 years ago.

    I carry always not because I go places trouble is likely, but because trouble has a habit of not staying in its assigned zone.

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