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I'm looking to get a 1000 yard rifle, the gun needs to be capable of hitting a 8x8" square plate at that distance. The gun that caught my eye was the Remington 700 tactical in .308... I believe it has a 20" bull barrel. Should I be looking at a different caliber or gun? It also needs to shoot at least 1/2" groups at 100 yards. I do hand load if that help at all in finding the right gun/caliber.
Thanks everyone:)!
 

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Classic oldie that can still reach out there. P1010186.jpg


Or if you want something a bit newer. M_1A.JPG
 
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1000 yards from .308 you better know what you are doing if you want reach 1000 yards and make 1/2 inch groups. if i was you i would go for 300 win mag. even army was or is looking at it to replace 308 in certain SOCOM units.
 

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Thats fine, but if YOU want to be able to shoot 64 square inches at 1000 yds you had better be shooting 1/2 moa @ 100 yds, because if you can't you've droped your hit percentage to 1/4 IF you are good enough to compensate for the 25+ moa youre going to be flinging at a target at that distance. Thats a drop of way over 220 inches, or close to 20'. You are going to be spending the $$$ on the optics to see the target (30x for my eyes with a mil dot) and with a .308 at that distance you are going to need to have bases under your scope mounts...big ones. You simply couldn't do it without the bases and zeroing the rifle at, at least half the distance, and preferably further. Have you ever looked through a normal (hunting) scope at a target that's only 300 yds away?

Personally, for my ability level (at the risk of selling myself short), .308 is not a good choice at all. My goat rifles are in 7mm or .300 win mag, which I believe are both massively superior to .308 in every respect. I'll shoot targets at that distance but my longest shot on an antelope was 730 yds confirmed with a rangefinder, and even that was pushing the limits of an ethical shot even with a .300. The scope on the 7mm I hunt with costs five times what the rifle cost me, and the rifle will still out shoot it. Don't do .308 if you really want to get into distance shooting, because I think it will frustrate you quickly.

Get a 7mm to start with, because its way flatter, and simply much easier to shoot at those distances, where everything starts to matter a great deal. You're also going to want to spend a whole bunch of money on bullets made to the highest tolerances. Something like Siera Matchkings, that will run you $.50 a piece.

There are certainly quite a few guys who can do it well with a .308, but not many for whom shooting is an avocation and not an occupation.
 

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in all seriousness, if you want accuracy at long distances you will need speed.

Weatherby mark V comes to mind. hand loaded 30-378 can remain super sonic at 1500 yards. some factory can retain super sonic at 1000 yards.

Wikipedia: A hand loaded .338-378 Weatherby Magnum used for 1000 yd target shooting loaded with a 19.4 g (300 gr) boat-tail hollow point from a rifle with a 71 cm (28 in) target barrel will yield a muzzle velocity of 917 m/s (3010 ft/s), at 914 m (1000 yd) will carry a down range velocity of 590 m/s (1936 ft/s) and at 1372 m (1500 yd) will still be carrying a supersonic down range velocity of 462 m/s (1517 ft/s).

however this comes at the cost of high price ammo and high rate of barrel wear, the action itself will hold up fine.
 

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...it sounds more like a home-based business than defensive carry:wink: to me...

...some of the snipers in the military use the .338 Lapua, I've read...
 

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Many rifles are capable of the accuracy you desire, the problem is in the trigger actuator.
 

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Funny you should post this. I got to talk to a competitive bench rest shooter and shoot his 22 lb $2000 rifle with a $2000 42 power scope on it. He has won national 1000 yd championships. The other funny thing is I recently bought the very rifle you referred to, a Remington 700 SPS Tactical in .308.

First a comment about it being a big gun - it isn't. I has a 20" medium bull barrel. The gun is a bit heavy, about 8 lbs, but that's a buddy of mine's choice for hunting and he's willing to deal with the 8 lbs to gain what the gun gives him. Then yesterday at the range, I talked to a hunter with a lightweight Tikka and he was looking for a heavier rifle for hunting.

Second, a comment about accuracy in MOA. Let's see what 8" is at 100 yards. Dividing 1000 yds by 10 gives 100 yards, likewise dividing 8" by 10 gives 0.8". So the implied accuracy is just a bit under 1 MOA. A lot of guns can do that. So it would seem, a gun that can shoot 1/2 MOA should be able to hit the 8" at 1000 yds. Of course the more accurate the gun is to a degree, the better.

In fact, yesterday I shot a five shot 0.94 MOA group with my Remington .308 SPS. Four of the shots were in a 0.56 MOA group. There's always one messing up the group! In interest of full disclosure, I shot this at 50 yards. Now before you start to challenge it being a 0.56 MOA, that's the true MOA. Remember MOA is not range dependent. My eyes are though, that's why I'm having to work up the nerve to try 100 yard shots. I'm not sure I've got the eyes for that. Although, I did shoot a 0.5 MOA at 100 yards with my buddy's bench rest gun. He could do better than that.



While I can't say for sure, based on my other shooting yesterday, that wide one was more me than the gun.

One thing that will be a problem at 1000 yards for the Tactical is the trigger. Remington kind of does a number on us about this. My buddy's bench rest gun has a 6 ounce trigger in it! Remington suggests, by the owner's manual, that the trigger in the Tactical can be adjusted, with a screw by the user, to 3 lbs. Mine would only go to 3-3/4 lb so I called them. They were adamant that it could only be adjusted to 3.5 lbs. When I mentioned the 3 pounds spec in the owner's manual, he simply said they changed that for safety reasons.

I don't know why they think that's a safety reason, the Mossberg MVP has a 2.5 lb trigger right out of the box, a Savage model 10 has an amazing trigger well under 3 lbs but I haven't measured it yet. I'll be calling a gunsmith today to ask him about reducing the trigger pull to under 3 lbs.

The final thing is the whole package - the inherent accuracy of the rifle, the bench or rest you're shooting from, the acuity of your eyes, the power and resolution of the scope and crosshairs, trigger pull weight, nerves, controlling breathing, etc. Then there's wind drift etc.

I simply don't know if the .308 will shoot flat enough to do well at 1000 yards. If I run into my buddy I'll run that by him.

Oh, how could I forget this: You will need to reload to get the best accuracy from any rifle. It gets really complicated. E.g. my bench rest buddy was testing loads with seating differences of one-ten-thousands of an inch. I'm not sure I believe he has the equipment to do that and I'm not sure you could see a difference in shooting. I think he might have meant ten thousandths. The first is increments of 1/10,000; the second is 1/100, and I think the latter is what he really meant. But the point is, there's a lot to long range shooting. You will need a wind gauge too.

And you may find this encouraging and inspirational:

 

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I would look at some of the Lapua rounds developed for long range shooting. As mentioned a great scope is as important as the rifle and round.
 

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All good points. That rifle will certainly get on the paper at 1000yds, but it has to be set up for it, and the operator a true marksman. Shooting those kinds of rainbows isn't for the novice. You can get more gun for the same money and flatten it out to make it a heck of allot easier.

The problem with the exotics is both guns and brass are so much more expensive. If forced to choose between gun or optics go with the good scope. You'll shoot better with a great scope on an average rifle than you will with a great rifle and an average scope. You want a sniper rifle, not a tactical one, and you want something faster than .308. Just my opinion. That said, if you can consistently hit that target at 1000 with the .308, you'll be shooting the eyes out of a mosquito with a Lapua, .50, .375 WM, etc.

My eyes are going too. A pair of glasses would probably do more for my accuracy than anything else.
 

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The. 308 is used often in1,000 yd. High power rifle competition, but not with a 20" barrel. It won't give enough velocity to keep the match bullets you will need to use super sonic. FWIW the X ring @ 1,000 is 10" in diameter and it takes an accomplished High Master to run a decent X count with a top grade match rifle out of a sling.
The bench rest records are just over 4" IIRC with rifles weighing over 40 lbs. using highly modified target scopes shooting a wildcat. 30-.378.
So, if you need to hold sub 8" @ 1,000 yd. be ready to spend 3K+ and a lot of time on the range.

FWIW "I" would go Tubb 2000 in 6.5-.284 for a sling gun and contact the "Original 1,000 yd. Bench Rest Club" in Williamsport, PA for a builder of a bench gun.

Best of luck, it is very rewarding to score well at that distance. I have shot 1,000 yd. Service Rifle competition with my AR's and the few X's and 10's I have scored are great memories.
 

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...If forced to choose between gun or optics go with the good scope. You'll shoot better with a great scope on an average rifle than you will with a great rifle and an average scope...
I have found that to be true for the scope; I simply can't speak to the average rifle or better. But, if you can't clearly see the target, you won't hit it no matter what rifle you use.

Along those same lines, I've found the reticle in the scope is a critical part of the mix too. Some scopes are made for tactical situations which needs quick acquisition and acceptable accuracy out to about 100 yards. These reticles can be used for hunting probably out to about 100 yards, maybe more in some cases, but the long range scope needs a simple reticle. My buddy's bench rest gun has a simple crosshair with about a 0.3 MOA dot, not sure that's the size, but it's just a bump at the intersection of the crosshairs. I found that small dot to be "the" object to sight on.

I bought my scopes with shorter ranges in mind and got the tactical scopes with dots and split rings etc. And that's probably best for my applications.

Simply be aware there are tactical scopes and precision scopes - they are different. For 1000 yards I don't think a tactical scope would work well at all. Of course OTOH, if you're concerned about 1 yard to 200 yards a tactical scope is mighty attractive.

I have a Weaver 1-5X by 30mm with a tactical reticle. On 1X power I can point it at the ground in front of me and everything is in focus, the reticle, the objects on the ground; I can read print on the ground it's so clear. So at 1X, except for some generous eye relief, it's essentially a red dot sight but with a more complicated but equally fast reticle. You can truly, truly use it as a both eyes open aiming device at 1X.

...You want a sniper rifle, not a tactical one, and you want something faster than .308. Just my opinion. That said, if you can consistently hit that target at 1000 with the .308, you'll be shooting the eyes out of a mosquito with a Lapua, .50, .375 WM, etc...
Well, maybe. You certainly aren't going to win matches with a Tactical, but it may be good enough for the range of applications. But yes, if it's a 1000 yard gun first and foremost, the .308 is going to be a disadvantage.

Jaeger, this would be interesting. Do you have handy the ballistics on some of the rounds you mentioned, especially velocity and bullet weight.

...My eyes are going too. A pair of glasses would probably do more for my accuracy than anything else.
That's a real bummer isn't it - getting older is just no fun at all. My eyes are fair due to all the vision correcting surgery I've had, but the RK I had done some 20 or so years ago is really haunting. The tiny slits of RK never go away and each one refracts light. If my eyes didn't have the RK scars I would probably not use anything but an Aimpoint Comp C3 as a 'scope'. Unfortunately, due to those scars, I see three red dots. I have to really, really focus to pick the same dot every time and it is slooooow. But when I do get it the same every time, I have shot 1 MOA groups at 50 yards.

Oddly enough, I don't have that problem with scopes; I suspect the difference is the exit pupil of the scope collimating the light through the center of my eye where the scars don't extend. The 1X red dots don't collimate at all so the scars affect what I see.

Hmmm, kinda drifted off topic there didn't I?
 

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Jaeger, this would be interesting. Do you have handy the ballistics on some of the rounds you mentioned, especially velocity and bullet weight.
I have a bench full of manuals and books in my basement, but you can just google "rifle ballistics" and get some basic ideas off the web. 7mm is GENERALLY loaded with smaller lighter bullets moving faster than .300, and it generally delivers more down range energy than the .300 Win Mag because of the velocity. They meet an overlap at around a 150 grain bullet, so you can keep goin' and load much heavier bullets in .300. Shooting paper this isn't as much a concern as long as you're controlling for windage and drift. Going light on a calm day is fine, but on a windy day those light bullets can blow all over the place. The further out you go the more small things, that don't matter up close, start affecting everything in a big way, which is why so many bench rest guys are engineer and OCD types who enjoy the precision of the thing. Most of them need a drink or two to loosen up.

The .300 has considerably more recoil if you up your bullet weight beyond what the 7mm can handle, and the detective who sold me the 7mm I hunt with sold it to me because he hated the recoil so much. I think that's funny, because I'll shoot a deer with big 30 ought 6 size 180 gr bullets out of the .300. Both are so versatile, that there are wide open holes in this, and if you ask ten people you will probably get ten different answers, because you can load them in so many different ways.

I don't try to hot load anything or max out anything. I go well within tolerances for distance shooting and weigh everything on a tear scale for perfect consistency (often trying to remove one errant grain of powder with a probe). I can reload more accurately than I shoot!

My eyes are fine close, but way out at distance shooting ranges things get a little blurry. I simply need glasses (have needed them for years), and it's getting to the point shooting wise that I can't ignore it anymore.

You don't have to spend huge piles of money on a distance rifle, or have one built for you. You just need a decent rifle (same price as the one you're considering) with a very good scope, and to read a book on how to set it up to shoot at those distances. It really helps to find the guys who are into it and get their advice, but you can do it yourself. It isn't rocket science, but becoming a marksman at those distances is no easy task, and takes many rounds and lots of time.
 
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Get a Savage HS 338 Lapua top it with a Nightforce scope.
You will most likely need to have all the reloading equipment for the 1,000 yard game.
308 will do it 338 Lapua will get you there ALOT faster.
308 will need a minimum of 20 MOA rail.
Good luck I'm shooting my first 1,000 yard match next Saturday with my Savage HS 308.


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Get a Savage HS 338 Lapua top it with a Nightforce scope.
You will most likely need to have all the reloading equipment for the 1,000 yard game.
308 will do it 338 Lapua will get you there ALOT faster.
308 will need a minimum of 20 MOA rail.
Good luck I'm shooting my first 1,000 yard match next Saturday with my Savage HS 308.


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Savage Model 10 FCP HS Precision, .338 Lapua, 5rd detachable box mag, AccuTrigger adjustable trigger, 26in bbl, fiberglass stock.
 

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Yes this is the one.
Paired with decent NightForce glass, that would be one sweet "little" rifle. Mmmm.

Heck, at 300yds with a Rem700 .243 and acceptable glass, I've done reasonably regular ~1.5" groups. At 600yds, I can't do anything like that. Partly, IMO, due to the glass not being sufficient (a Vortex Crossfire 8-32x50mm scope, which gets somewhat dim/fuzzy at 600yds). By comparison, a couple of benchrest grade scopes I've looked through at 600-1000yds, there's no comparison. Agree, with your recommendation to invest in great glass, if going out to 1000yds.
 
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