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Wife likes small revolvers wanted something with no recoil and light. She ended up with a S&W 351c it’s hammerless, j frame, airlite. Its 7 shot 22 WMR and weighs 11oz iirc. Extremely easy shooting no recoil means follow ups are a breeze. In my experience 22WMR tends to be a bit more reliable ignition wise then 22LR for whatever reason.
My wife carries the LCRx in .22WMR. It's way better than the alternative, which would be nothing.
 

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Not suggesting, or saying anyone should! But if a .22 is all you have on you, or the only firearm you own, check out the results of his test. At point blank range,that 22lr is some nasty stuff, even out of a short brl. Pretty impressive results for the lowly .22. Here’s the link.....
Noted that .22 can be a bit unreliable. Use a revolver which only requires another trigger pull. And do use high velocity hollow pts.
 

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My wife carries the LCRx in .22WMR. It's way better than the alternative, which would be nothing.
We tried the LCR and she didn’t like it. I thought man what’s not to like! Then I shot it. Totally subjective but something about the trigger just seemed off. Glad I tried that one a buddy had before purchasing cause I really wanted one.
 

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For anyone looking for .22 revolver...I recommend the Sentinel Deluxe and Sentinel Snub that High Standard used to make.(NOT the Mark revolvers that they made...their triggers are horrendous...the first type in 4" or 2 3/8". 9 shot DA/SA and super-reliable. They're becoming more available lately...I found two clean ones. I'm not going to buy a new model as long as they're around.
 

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If the 22's reliability comes into question, wasn't the 25 acp created to eliminate that
I have a Colt 1908 Hammerless .25 Vest Pocket .25 ACP built in 1915. It works great. I bought it because it is a Colt. I cleaned it an took it to the handgun range at the gun club.

I put two out of six rounds in the black at ten yards and all of the rounds on target. I thought I did good. My wife shot it and put four of six rounds in the black and all of the rounds on target. She declared it was now her gun.

We have never had a misfire or issue with it. I would only trust it for contact shooting. Sixty-four foot-pounds of muzzle energy is not that impressive.
 

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I carried an ol' Ruger .22 standard waay back in the 80's. I never felt under gunned 'cause I knew the gun ran 100% and I know where it shot.

Even now, I'll sometimes carry my SR22 on a walk around the area.
 

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Haven't read this entire thread yet, but it's interesting to consider.

If depending on a .22 pistol I'd avoid all hollow point ammunition and load with high velocity 40 grain solids, desiring to gain all the help I can insuring that a bullet will get in deep enough to do the most good. I've always pinned my best hope on the well delivered first shot while recognizing that subsequent shots very well may be required, especially with paltry cartridges.

Feel the same way about .25 ACP, .32 ACP, and .380 ACP. Eschew any expando-matic bullets and ensure penetration above all else. Any of these paltry cartridges are beneath my personally preferred threshold for cartridge effectiveness.

I sometimes wonder if I'm the only person in forum-land who doesn't worship at the alter of expansion, no matter how it's marketed with the latest and greatest of product manifestations. In the hunting fields game and critters large and small can be depended on having a bad day with good hits. Bad hits with expansion can be ugly, yet still not achieve the desired effect. I've observed this for many years. Jello tests of expansion aside, I can't imagine that similar results wouldn't be observed with human assailants.

I'm also a card carrying member of both the Flat Earth Society and the Luddites, hah!
 

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Just for thought and basic information.

I was reminded yesterday of a range day with our local PD late 90's. They had some late 80's early 90's III-A panels that were expired.
We took them to the range and did an unscientific test with various firearms. We set them up with sand bags as backing.
The panels performed as expected with everything from 380-44mag. The 223 and 308 sailed through as expected. 12g 00 buck left a huge crater, but stopped all the pellets. Don't remember trying slugs.

The big surprise was 22lr from both rifle and pistol @ 10 yards defeated the Kevlar. I'm guessing it probably didn't have much energy left, but still surprised me.
Today's ballistic panels are more effective than the early Kevlar, but I'm wondering how well it performs against the small projectile of a 22lr?
 

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sort of did the same thing with a couple of old side panels.....not very scientific on my part......just leaned them up against the dirt embankment and shot into them at 3 yards. the 45, 9, and 357 were stopped. the 22 magnum penetrated the most but eventually stopped. .....if it had not been a HP....it might had made it. Of course these panels were very old, sweat stained, and well past their expiration date.
 

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I sometimes wonder if I'm the only person in forum-land who doesn't worship at the alter of expansion, no matter how it's marketed
You should know better than that after all of this time. I’m one who could care less about HP expansion, or velocity for that matter.

Ive always felt like the only purpose of an expanding bullet was to decrease penetration by increasing the frontal area in an effort to prevent over penetration.
Other than that, I believe it’s mostly hype at handgun velocities.
 
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Haven't read this entire thread yet, but it's interesting to consider.

If depending on a .22 pistol I'd avoid all hollow point ammunition and load with high velocity 40 grain solids, desiring to gain all the help I can insuring that a bullet will get in deep enough to do the most good. I've always pinned my best hope on the well delivered first shot while recognizing that subsequent shots very well may be required, especially with paltry cartridges.

Feel the same way about .25 ACP, .32 ACP, and .380 ACP. Eschew any expando-matic bullets and ensure penetration above all else. Any of these paltry cartridges are beneath my personally preferred threshold for cartridge effectiveness.

I sometimes wonder if I'm the only person in forum-land who doesn't worship at the alter of expansion, no matter how it's marketed with the latest and greatest of product manifestations. In the hunting fields game and critters large and small can be depended on having a bad day with good hits. Bad hits with expansion can be ugly, yet still not achieve the desired effect. I've observed this for many years. Jello tests of expansion aside, I can't imagine that similar results wouldn't be observed with human assailants.

I'm also a card carrying member of both the Flat Earth Society and the Luddites, hah!
Yer American Luddites Assn card's expired...online payments not accepted.
 

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Do they accept wampum Snub?
 
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Just for thought and basic information.

I was reminded yesterday of a range day with our local PD late 90's. They had some late 80's early 90's III-A panels that were expired.
We took them to the range and did an unscientific test with various firearms. We set them up with sand bags as backing.
The panels performed as expected with everything from 380-44mag. The 223 and 308 sailed through as expected. 12g 00 buck left a huge crater, but stopped all the pellets. Don't remember trying slugs.

The big surprise was 22lr from both rifle and pistol @ 10 yards defeated the Kevlar. I'm guessing it probably didn't have much energy left, but still surprised me.

Today's ballistic panels are more effective than the early Kevlar, but I'm wondering how well it performs against the small projectile of a 22lr?
I've read of similar tests, it's been determined some .22 solids have the ability to penetrate between kev weaves.
 

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You should know better than that after all of this time. I’m one who could care less about HP expansion, or velocity for that matter.

Ive always felt like the only purpose of an expanding bullet was to decrease penetration by increasing the frontal area in an effort to prevent over penetration.
Other than that, I believe it’s mostly hype at handgun velocities.
Expanding bullets have two other uses.
They provide LE Legal departments with the data to show that they have chosen the bullets that are safest and meet all federal specs. Does that mean the bullets do anything better? No not really, But it does provide the legal team with tons of data to use when things aren't going their way in court.
And second they provide something NEW! Something everyone has to have! Because NEW and Improved are the words that sell bullets! DR
 

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I hope these Youtube links come up when clicked. Judge for yourself. I judged and what I see looks pretty impressive for a caliber that gets trashed as if it's no better than a BB or pellet. For my wife who weighs 103 lbs. and doesn't have very strong hands and getting up in age with a first number starting with "7", there is no problem and no doubt this is what she shoots best. I've tried all of the others with her. .32, .380, 9mm, .38. The main thing is for whoever uses it...don't shoot one bullet and then stand there admiring the handy work for a one shot stop. EMPTY IT!

.22 lr FOR SELF DEFENSE?? - MUST WATCH (.22 vs. FRESH side of Beef) - YouTube

22lr vs 9mm will the 22lr save your life? - YouTube
 

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More food for thought.

gun death statistics by caliber - Google Search

Anything that achieves penetration to the vitals or causes a wound which becomes infected and is untreated will be lethal. You want stopping power, not necessarily lethality.

A 10 grain pellet at 1000FPS = 22FPE
A 500 grain arrow at 180FPS = 36FPE
A 7000 grain rock [1lb] thrown at 30 MPH [44FPS]=30FPE

All will kill a person with perfect shot placement. (click to enlarge)
525.full.pdf (bmj.com)

Killed by a BB - Teen killed after being shot in left eye by a BB gun - CNN

Shootings in Boston between 2010 - 2014 PubMed Central, Table 2. : JAMA Netw Open. 2018 Jul; 1(3): e180833. Published online 2018 Jul 27. doi: 10.1001/jamanetworkopen.2018.0833
 

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More food for thought.

gun death statistics by caliber - Google Search

Anything that achieves penetration to the vitals or causes a wound which becomes infected and is untreated will be lethal. You want stopping power, not necessarily lethality.

A 10 grain pellet at 1000FPS = 22FPE
A 500 grain arrow at 180FPS = 36FPE
A 7000 grain rock [1lb] thrown at 30 MPH [44FPS]=30FPE

All will kill a person with perfect shot placement. (click to enlarge)
525.full.pdf (bmj.com)

Killed by a BB - Teen killed after being shot in left eye by a BB gun - CNN

Shootings in Boston between 2010 - 2014 PubMed Central, Table 2. : JAMA Netw Open. 2018 Jul; 1(3): e180833. Published online 2018 Jul 27. doi: 10.1001/jamanetworkopen.2018.0833
Right.
Some people don't seem to get that "stopping power" and lethality are not the same.
Example: "22lr has killed ____ people" ... omits how quick (or not) they stopped the attack.
The flu can be lethal but it is not quickly incapacitating upon contact.
ASAP potential and lethality may be inexorably lined (ex: 12 GA, .556/.223)
However, lethality and ASAP potential are not always linked. (ex: 22lr and Flu)

Those that have never hunted with a bow can't appreciate the wound potential of a broadhead.
A four blade 1 1/4'' diameter broadhead (Slick Trick Grizz) makes a big wound.
Despite having a 1 1/4'' hole through both lungs, deer are still capable of running 50+ yards.
Appropriately placed, a broadhead is both lethal and quickly incapacitating (less than 10 seconds).

Apply the same up to 10 seconds of voluntary action after lethal hit(s) to a human.
Hits to the lungs/heart that are non-CNS are lethal but attacker is still capable of aggressive action.
Larger and/or more powerful handgun bullets have more ASAP potential, 9mm HP is my minimum.
 

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Discussion Starter #120
Buddy of mine killed a nice deer with a 300mag. Ran over 200 yards. Perfect broadside shot. Both lungs exploded. And that’s not the only one he has killed with 300mags, 7mm, and 270’s. He has had some run further than that with good shot placement. I have killed several with .243’s and 22-250’s, and most dropped where they were and have never had one run 200 yards. Does a 300 mag have more stopping power than a 22-250, or .243? Most would argue it does. What’s the explanation? Who knows....
 
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