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We new that this kind of stuff was going to happen when they said they would bring it to a vote. To me it seems like a simple reach around, you want UBC, we want rights restored. I think it creates to much mud in the water and nothing gets done...
 

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I do not have a major objection to the Manchin-Toomey bill. As a member of the 2A Foundation, I am pleased that they had a hand in drafting the bill. Sure I would have preferred a national right to carry as a quid pro quo for the expanded background checks, but they could not get to closure on that one. And, the other pro gun owner benefits that are in the bill that Gottlieb mentions in his speech are nothing to sneeze at. I'll reserve my final opinion until I see what the bill looks like after the amendment process, but I think Gottlieb's logic of why it was a good idea to propose this bill at this time is spot on politically.
 

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Would have kill the Member Buy, Sell & Trade forum here if it passes....can't have private citizens buying and selling guns over the "Internet" without background checks....

Classic case of "We must give on something to be reasonable....."

And after the next mass murder, the next bill in, say, 2015 will remove the family exemption. Then all transfers require a check. It's just a small change to save the lives of children.

And after the next mass murder, the next bill will remove the restriction on background checks. Because if the Government could just track the sales, and couple that to the health records they already now have access to, the murder could have been prevented. And it will save the lives of children.

And then, during the next democratic House majority and Senate super majority, it's over. Just like the affordable care act.

But come on, such a grab would not be upheld by the Supreme Court! Oh, wait, it's not a Second Amendment grab, it's merely the Government's exercise of taxing authority. Oh, okay, yes, you do have to pay a firearms retention tax each year of $2500 for each gun to keep each gun and if you don't pay it's tax evasion (thank you John Roberts).

See, there's never going to be gun confiscation. Just an exercise of tax authority. What's the big deal?

Of course, I'm just talking crazy. Because the scenario I just laid out will never happen if we're "reasonable" from the start.
 

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I've always been concerned more with UBC,than anything else.If this isn't gun registration,it's a lot better than i expected,but,no one knows for sure,what they will have in it,by the time it comes out.So far as private sales go,i can sell a gun to someone,and that's it.But,if it's to someone via internet,they have to pass a background ck?How is that suppose to stop anything bad from happening?Unless i missed something,that would be a really stupid law.
 

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None of these Bills,Laws,Restrictions will stop a person from doing the unthinkable ! Look what Timothy McVeigh did ...... (ammonium nitrate and nitro-methane ) People Hell bent on destruction and death will find a way, with or without Handguns, Rifles and ammunition. I like the above post, what happens after the next mass killing ? And the Next ?
 

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A UBC won't work; at least not if the people don't follow it. And many won't. Of course neither will the criminals, naturally.
With all of the guns in private hands which have paperwork which is many years, if not decades, old, not to mention the guns with no paperwork at all, (basically pre-1968), the govt would have to do house-to-house searches to find out who has what.
I'd like to think they wouldn't try, but if they did something like that, they would start an actual 2nd American Revolution.
 

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Why are pro gun groups helping write this garbage???? I agree with PEF. Its the we have to give up something to seem reasonable idiocy. Just why do we have to suffer infringement on 2a just to seem reasonable????

Im sick to death of being a reasonable door mat.
 

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I am 100% against any kind of new gun laws BUT I will say that compared to what those libs wanted in the beginning... This is nothing. It might even help because part of the bill is allowing you to carry across state lines an if the state doesn't agree well federal law supersedes state laws
 

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If the waffle house gang hadnt broken the filibuster there wouldnt be a Toomey Manchin mess to worry about.
And if they dont waffle some more and break some more filibusters on individual items there still wont be but I bet ya they do I bet I bet :frown:
 

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I have no problem with them background checking me all they want. BUT as we all know background checks don't mean sqwat if they don't keep track of the guns. I think that Obama will use exec. order to institute registration under the guise of "enforcing UBC law". No vote no congress just one anti-american doing what he wants. Destroying our nation.

Sent from my SCH-I405 using Tapatalk 2
 

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Im sick to death of being a reasonable door mat.
And that sir, is precisely how more & more law abiding gun owners and lovers of liberty are feeling including myself.

After some time, many will want the "door mat" cleaned of it's filth. Some believe this will happen at the polls; I believe it will not happen at the polls
but "by the people and for the people."
 
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