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I guess this will fit here.

I reproduce a new post from THR which is decidedly interesting - for all I think. I have corrected one or two typo's.

Patrol120 was the poster - it seems only fair to credit this to the originator - who I assume is a cop.
Tonight I had the unfortunate opportunity to fire my weapon in the line of duty. Thankfully it was a dog, not a person. I reponded to a viscious animal at large call, and with head fully in a$$, I did not grab the shotgun from the car when I got out.

I spot the dog, a very agitated Pit mix. The dog, instead of doing the normal dog thing, and backing off while remaining defensive, comes toward me in a menacing manner. It lunged at me once, and backed off. Light bulb above my head goes off, and I unholster my Sig P220, and ooze ever so slowly towards my patrol car to fetch the scattergun.

The dog doesn't give me chance, and again approaches me in a threatening manner. I shot the dog once in the center of the chest from a distance of about 6 feet, maybe 8. Shot lands good, and the dog does a complete backflip, and takes off running. I fire one more shot, that I THINK landed in the gut region. The dog then proceeds to run about a mile and a half into the woods, where I lose it.

The whole time the dog is running, it's dying. From my hunting days, I can tell a lung shot easily. Frothy blood everywhere, and running on pure fear and adrenaline. Every few feet, the dog falters, and regains its step. By the time I lose visual, the dog is completely red, covered in blood it has aspirated.

230gr .45acp Gold Dots are good rounds. No one has ever denied that. This simply goes to show that a one shot stop is a myth, even in a dog. Anger, fear, and adrenaline are powerful mitigating factors in survival. I am sure the dog died soon after losing it. I am sure the dog would have died had I not chased it, causing more fear. I should have gone for a head shot, but Hindsight is 20/20, and the shot did protect myself, stopping the threat.

Now, I must undergo a shooting advisory board. Have I lost faith in the Gold Dot? Absoultely not. The shot was good, and the best I can tell, the bullet performed as designed. The dog simply did not want to die, and thats what any shooting boils down to, I imagine.
 

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I bet the 12 ga would have stopped it. :tongue:
 

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I bet the 12 ga would have stopped it.
At that range - you betcha! :wink:
 

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He was down to 5-6 rounds if that was a 1911. Good thing there were not 3 dogs! :) Caliber still that big a deal, or shot placement and rounds on hand?
 

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oregonshooter said:
He was down to 5-6 rounds if that was a 1911. Good thing there were not 3 dogs! :) Caliber still that big a deal, or shot placement and rounds on hand?
Still would take a 45 over the 9 it would have bounched off the pit :biggrin:

Also been many a acases here where 9's and 40's have faild to stop the pits and rots the drug dealer like to have on hand in the house some with head shots some with out


But yeah its more shot placement but rember 45 never gets smaller and its almost a 1/2 hole ever time


Also its his own falut for not using proper tool for the job ala shotgun he has one i would have nabbed it on way out
 

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<Taco Bell dog>I think I need a bigger gun</Taco Bell dog>

Yep, just needed a bigger gun is all. A shotty would have probably have worked nicely. Also what if the officer had followed what we typically say for a human. Double tap to the chest and then maybe one to the head. Although I realize our four paw drive friends move faster and differently from people, maybe the multiple quick shots would have stopped the mutt?

A P220 in 45 is the same capacity as a 1911 BTW. In fact my Sig P220 mags work in my 1911.

-Scott-
 

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Thats really the main reason i carry when i'm at home. not so much for 2 legged problems, but i'm much more likely to be approached, in the country, by an unkonwn animal and should it show agression i am prepared for such.
no shotgun though. kinda tought to tote a 12 ga. though so my 38 snubby (mr relaible) or 1911 (my lil pain) will hafta do.
 

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That was an interesting and thought provoking post. I wouldn't have thought a dog would be that hard to bring down. Something to file in the back of what's left of my mind!
 

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I know one shot stops are basically mythology where angry/drug laden humans are concerned. Would never have imagined a dog of any size would be that tough to stop. I carry outside on my place as I am in the country and we do have cougars in the general area, though we haven't seen one in about 6 months. I figgered the old .45 ACP would do the job. Guess I'll have to lean the shot gun up against the wood pile.
 

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Good food for thought. One shot doesn't always do the trick.
I'm certainly going to remember this. 2 to the COM.... and 1 to the head if at all possible. Hopfully all the power will be shut off by that time.
 

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CLASS3NH said:
Good food for thought. One shot doesn't always do the trick.
I'm certainly going to remember this. 2 to the COM.... and 1 to the head if at all possible. Hopfully all the power will be shut off by that time.
Hmmmm. If you're taking time to evaluate effectiveness......your opponent has time to react. I have a working slide-lock for a reason.... :wink:
 

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Rob72 said:
Hmmmm. If you're taking time to evaluate effectiveness......your opponent has time to react. I have a working slide-lock for a reason.... :wink:
I totallt agree with you Rob. No time to think about it, just time to react and deal with the situation at hand. My training as I remember it, was the way I described it above. That way, the "lights go out" and the confrontation ends. :biggrin:
 

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A valid point was made on this later - by a guy who teaches anatomy and physiology - reminding us usefully of the fact that it is not the loss of heart function, aortic leak, bleed-out etc - that directly stops anything - it is of course lack of O2, which is transported by circulatory system.

The brain can probably manage for the approx 4 minutes and even muscles have some ''depot'' aspects re oxygen and even ATP which can metabolize without O2. Only when O2 is sufficiently depleted will things stop, other than as we all know - a CNS hit where lights go out real quick.

I think too there is the factor with four legged critters, where there will be no ''psycho'' effects to slow them - no thoughts of ''oh crap, I have been shot" - just pure adrenaline reaction to fight or flight.
 

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Dogs die hard. I have had the occasion to kill a few feral dogs when I was on active duty in Washinton State. I always went for the head shot, which was pretty easy since they were always up close and getting closer! When I walk my gentle giant Newfoundlands I always carry a 45 to protect them and my wife from the occasional Rottie, or Akita that sometimes roam the neighborhood. I had to warn an IDIOT once that his big dumb Akita had better not get loose while my family was in the area. This guy just loved scaring folks with his big mean dog. He stood in his front yard behind a three foot wall and smirked at me and said in heavily accented english: Yea...what-choo gonna do HESSE? He sounded just like a cartoon character or Cheech Marin. I politely told him that if his dog attacked my leashed dog and my wife and me, I'd have to very regretfully put a 45 caliber slug thru it's tiny brain. Then it was: REX!!! GET INSIDE!!! I never drew, never flashed the weapon....but this bozo had a neighborhood rep. I called the cops when I got home to go on record about his threatening mutt.

The one shot stop is ONLY a reality when the shot is cranio-ocular. Thru and eye or into the 4x6 cranial vault behind the forehead. That will reliably put anybody down. Making the shot is something else. Any old head shot won't do....what if you shatter a BGs jaw? I think that'd just make him mad.
 

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ExSoldier762 said:
The one shot stop is ONLY a reality when the shot is cranio-ocular. Thru and eye or into the 4x6 cranial vault behind the forehead. That will reliably put anybody down. Making the shot is something else. Any old head shot won't do....what if you shatter a BGs jaw? I think that'd just make him mad.
Yah, empty the brain pan, and it becomes Raggedy Andy. Unfortunately we aren't allowed to carry scoped .300 WSM's for CCW........ :biggrin:
 

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P95,

Amazing story...glad you posted it.

When working as lineman re-conductoring cable through fenced easements, I came upon a yard that had a "mama" pit bull with several pups (9-10 weeks old) in evidence. Needless to say, she was quite protective of her pups and this required that I request the occupant of the house to put the dog up. The dog was chained to a about a 6 inch wooden post with what I thought was an eyebolt. It was a lag bolt as it turned out, and when I came in the yard the dog went to raising a fuss. The next thing I know it was coming across the yard at me (it jerked the lag bolt right out) and the occupant of the house was either shocked and didn't say anything to call the dog off, or didn't care. It happened so quickly that the only "weapon" I reacted with was my hard hat, an industrial one with the three ridges on top. Due to lucky timing, I smacked the dog right on top of the skull with the center ridge of that hard hat. It cracked the dog's skull and it died at my feet almost instantly, and yet a .45 at close range didn't take the dog in the post out. I'll never cease to be amazed at the odd way things can happen. It took many hours of explanation to my company (and their lawyers), and several hundred dollars to the occupant of that house to keep me out of trouble. You never know what it'll take to stop any kind of assailant or what a simple act of defense will cost you. I was in a probationary period (recently hired) and nearly lost my job over this incident. I suppose the bottom line is "do what you gotta do"...
 

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guess that officer wasn't much of a hunter. Should have waited about 15-30 min. To track the dog. chasing it , just makes it run further. I think animals are a bit diffrent than people as how they react from a gunshot. that said 1 shot stops are not reliable!
 

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As others have already noted, it's good to keep in mind that most animals die a lot harder than most humans. They'll fight to and past their last breath. For the most part we humans are far weaker in comparison.
 
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