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Discussion Starter #1
I like my XDs. I do. I'm quite pleased with them, but I have a beef with the design.

You see, I have found the most worthless feature I've ever seen on any gun. Its presence is actually starting to tick me off a little. It didn't used to bother me, but now I resent it slightly.

They say it's a safety feature, I say it makes the gun more dangerous.

It's indentified in the user's manual as a Loaded Chamber Indicator.

At first I was neutral to this feature. I didn't really want it, but it's starting to grate on me ever so slightly.

The problem is that all guns are always loaded. Of course they are. An unloaded gun is useless.

Therefore why should anyone need a loaded chamber indicator?

What's more, what if someone starts to rely on this indicator and it somehow malfunctioned? I realize that's nigh impossible because it's just a piece of metal on a pivoting pin and has nothing that can really break, but what if?

What I see as slightly more likely is somehow the indicator is falsely indicated as having the chamber loaded. That could also be a death sentence considering this is a single action pistol. Imagine a police officer issued this for a duty weapon hearing click instead of bang and then having to rack the slide in the middle of a gun fight... not good no matter how well trained you are!

I've honestly never used it. I don't trust it for one thing, and it would be a lousy habit to get into for another. I can't fathom what it's supposed to be good for.

This is one feature that needs to go.
 

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My Walther P99 has the same. A little red fleck of paint visible when the chamber is full. I don't pay it any attention because like Euc put it, it's always considered loaded.
Agree with your assessment of useless.
 

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I realize that's nigh impossible because it's just a piece of metal on a pivoting pin and has nothing that can really break, but what if?
In a basic gun safety class I took a couple years ago, the instructor asked constantly throughout the day "What is a safety feature?"

The class was expected to answer loudly "A mechanical device that can and will fail."

I agree...a loaded chamber indicator is useless and potentially dangerous.
 

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I agree with the dubious need for a loaded chamber indicator (LCI); as others posted, always consider the gun loaded and treat it as such.

The Steyr M and S (and I think the A1) series have LCI's. I can usually tell which empty cartridge case has been through my Steyrs due to the dent and drag marks on the rear of the empties.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Scott said:
Two words for you Euc...

Grinder Wheel

-Scott-
Wouldn't work terribly well on the XD... you'd wind up taking a fair chunk of the slide with it!

Besides I wouldn't dare touch it lest I have it before a civil court as a lawyer explains I obviously was too stupid to realize the gun was loaded because the LCI had been tampered with. :mad:

Oh heavens, how did we ever survive without this vital lifesaving feature? :rolleyes:
 

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Euc,
I couldn't agree more. I despise lawyerized guns. :mad: My 1911 has a key lock in the mainspring housing, and a notch cut into the barrel hood so you can see a loaded round. I never use either feature.
 

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i agree with both.loaded indicator and key lock are useless/dangerous to me. always check the chamber. key lock? if you don't have your guns secured in some way and somebody steals them, it's your fault. if they're secured and they still get them i don't think having a lock on the gun will do much good. if they're good enough to get the guns, defeating a lock shouldn't be a problem. just another part to possibly fail at a critical moment.
 

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Reverse lawyerization at it's finest. Some dumbass will have an ND and claim it was because the loaded chamber indicator was not large enough.

Then, we'll be stuck with pistols equipped with flashing lights to indicate a loaded chamber.....

Arrgh.

Matt
 

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I HATE all that stuff- indicators, key locks built into guns, and especially that D**n text on the barrel, mind you, that says "Please read the manual blah blah blah"
Good grief- it is a gun, yuh know?? :mad:
 

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Settle down Beavis...

I don't ever use mine either, and I don't think I would ever rely on it, but try to think of a situation that it may be used- for example, maybe you are in total darkness and need to check to see if there is a round in the chamber, etc.

Who cares, like I said, I don't use it anyway and it's not like it takes away from the aesthetics of the gun.
 

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I like it myself. while I would never rely on it to let me know if the chamber was loaded or not, its nice if someone else has this on their gun. That way if they hand mre a gun and I see the indicator I can tell em to unload it first. Or if someone is on the line /range cold.
 

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Much sound and fury about nothing really. If you don't like it, ignore it or remove the paint so it isn't noticable. On the other hand they can serve a purpose, though I wouldn't bet my life on it. It is a good indicator that a shell is in the chamber after you first load the gun and can't remember if you've racked the first round into the chamber. Unlike some folks here (or so they say), I don't keep all my guns loaded, especially when they are stored. I may remove a magazine when the gun is to be locked away and though it's unlikely and has never happened- yet - I may have left a round in the chamber, became distracted, then forgot to check the chamber. I can see other possible uses, but I personally don't pay attention to the one on my gun. My only indicator is on a Taurus semi-auto and is located on the extractor so is less noticable than the ones that are mounted on the slide or near the hammer.
 

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Know what you mean , although, on my Beretta 9mm 92FS, besides being visual, it is also slightly raised which is a nice feature to run your finger across in the dark if need be to inform you of one in the pipe.
 

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rachilders said:
On the other hand they can serve a purpose, though I wouldn't bet my life on it.
Having thought a bit more about it, that is my argument against it.

The thought of new shooters and new guns with all the so-called "lawyer safeties" bothers me greatly.
I imagine the natural tendency of folks to ignore the tried and true rules because the gun does it for them...and that's a scary thought.
 

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Quote from the Kahr manual:

"The loaded chamber indicator should never be used as an "unloaded chamber indicator" - meaning that it should never be used by a firearm handler to confirm that a chamber is empty, to the exclusion of manually checking the chamber as explained....The user must know that the surest method to determine the absence of a round in the chamber is to visually and manually check the chamber of the firearm by pulling and locking the slide to the rear."

This quote is in red ink and is listed as a safety warning. I know it's not like most of us guys to read instructions or ask directions, but...

As far as I'm concerned, the fewer doodads on a CCW piece, the less I have to think about in a time when concentration on matters at hand is tantamount. Be safe...
 

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The Glock's extractor performs a similar function. When its outer face is parallel to the slide surface, it's being held there by a chambered cartridge. When nothing's in the chamber, the extractor leans in slightly. Hard to see even in full daylight. A Walther P38 I used to own had a little pin that would stick out of the rear of the slide just above the hammer; you could easily feel this one even in complete darkness.

This "press check" I keep hearing about... Is this something for people who frequently carry with no round in the pipe? When I set up a pistol for carry, I chamber a round and it stays this way for maybe a couple of weeks until I fire off the carry ammunition at the range. I have no need to check if it's loaded, ever. Of course it is.
 

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Anubis said:
This "press check" I keep hearing about... Is this something for people who frequently carry with no round in the pipe? When I set up a pistol for carry, I chamber a round and it stays this way for maybe a couple of weeks until I fire off the carry ammunition at the range. I have no need to check if it's loaded, ever. Of course it is.
Well I know that I check mine every morning before I put it on.
 

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My SW99 too, same!!! Same as P99 - of course!

It does not irk me too much because I totally ignore it - and carry on as usual with MY safety drills - not using some design feature that could ruin someone's day - perhaps!

My safety (points to cranium) - is up here. :smile:

I think ''press-check'' is really just a reassurance to make sure one in the pipe - same as a reassurance to see empty chamber if that is what is desired. Never any harm in re-checking, for whatever condition - but yes anyways - my guns are always loaded - only way to go - even after two or three checks for clear - still loaded :smile:
 
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