I'm sure this has been covered before, but I'm curious how you all carry. Cocked and locked? what about a single action pistol with no safety? Still carry cocked? It makes most sense to carry cocked, if the pistol is needed, chances are every split second counts. I like to practice cocking my pistol as I draw it. I can have it cocked by the time I bring it up to eye level. What are your thoughts on this important part of concealed carry?
Carry cocked?
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cocked & locked
I carry a Kimber Tactical Pro II cocked and locked. For me, it would be silly to carry any other way.
I would never carry (a 1911 style pistol) with the hammer down on a loaded chamber, it has no advantages over condition one, only disadvantages.
Good luck. :smile:
I carry a Kimber Tactical Pro II cocked and locked. For me, it would be silly to carry any other way.
I would never carry (a 1911 style pistol) with the hammer down on a loaded chamber, it has no advantages over condition one, only disadvantages.
Good luck. :smile:
I agree, with any type of 1911 or clone, that is the way they were meant to be carried.
About the only one that I can think of (and I bet their are many more but I don't have that knowledge at hand) is the USP which can be carried cocked and locked or hammer down (maybe the CZ also?).
Wayne
About the only one that I can think of (and I bet their are many more but I don't have that knowledge at hand) is the USP which can be carried cocked and locked or hammer down (maybe the CZ also?).
Wayne
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I carry my Springfield Champion 1911 cocked & locked (aka Condition One). If you have some variant of a 1911, it was designed to be carried this way. I think it is a bad idea to carry with the hammer down on a 1911 - what if your thumb slips while cocking the hammer? One some 1911's, the hammer will hit the firing pin and ... you've just had an ND. Even if your gun has a half-cock notch (which should prevent this), don't bet that you can use fine-motor skills to cock the hammer if you are in a self-defense situation. Fine motor skills go out the window when we are under extreme stress.
If you're not comfortable carrying Condition One, try carrying it around the house unloaded for a few days with the hammer back and the safety on. You'll see that there is nothing to it.
As far as single-action pistols without a safety, the only ones I'm aware of are the old single-action revolvers.
If you're not comfortable carrying Condition One, try carrying it around the house unloaded for a few days with the hammer back and the safety on. You'll see that there is nothing to it.
As far as single-action pistols without a safety, the only ones I'm aware of are the old single-action revolvers.
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Certainly with 1911 condition #1 is way to go. I did carry my BHP for a while thusly but - while detent on safety was good and positive - I did feel a tad disadvantaged compared with 1911 - simply cos no grip safety as another safety measure.
I carry SIG 226 these days so condition #2 really - but no slower to bring in to play - just the minor variance thru that first DA pull.
I carry SIG 226 these days so condition #2 really - but no slower to bring in to play - just the minor variance thru that first DA pull.
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I primarily carry a Kahr Arms P9 cocked. It's a DAO gun. When I carry my Springfield 1911 A1 it is cocked and locked. It's the only way to fly as far as I am concerned.
Then in all honesty you probably shouldn't own the gun.
For decades, folks successfully lowered the hammer on Colt SAAs and their ilk without blowing up the farm. The 1911 is no different.
I don't carry one any more, having chosen to eliminate a step altogether in my draw and gone with my Sigs.
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Yowza! I don't think we have many Darwin candidates here :wink: . Carrying an S/A cocked, no-safety will earn you the knick-name "Hop-a-long" or "DRT" in short order.Otis said:
S/A autos should (in my opinion) be carried cocked & locked. Sigs for an ultra-smooth DA, Glock for striker-fired, P-7 for the High-tech, all other C&L.
Carry a revolver cocked?
Whenever I DO carry a 1911, it's always cocked and locked. When I carry a Glock, it too is cocked but the safety arrangement is different. When I carry a Sig Sauer, it's just like carrying a revolver: No external safety, but hammer down on a loaded chamber, first shot is DA all successive shots are SA with a slightly lighter pull. NEVER EVER carry a REVOLVER (either SA or DA) COCKED!!!! Do not cock the hammer on a revolver as you draw it unless it's a SA and why would you want to immitate Doc Holiday anyway? Get used to shooting a revolver the way it was meant to be fired for combat in the Double Action mode.Otis said:
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Condition One with my 1911 types. (Colts, Springers, AMT, etc) Condition One with my Detonics pistols, even though they have no grip safety. I'm very comfy with these weapons. Full mag and round in the chamber on the others single action Glocks and D/A (Glock, H&K, Sig, S&W Etc) S/A wheelies are carried, depending if they have the transfer bar system, quite possible on an empty chamber, should they be of old vintage.
Learning that every milli-second counts, especially when your life is on the line, makes a whole world of difference in your mindset.
Practice is the key word here, and knowing your weapon, and YOUR limitations is also key factor. :biggrin:
Learning that every milli-second counts, especially when your life is on the line, makes a whole world of difference in your mindset.
Practice is the key word here, and knowing your weapon, and YOUR limitations is also key factor. :biggrin:
I was a little hesitant to carry my 1911 in condition one. A friend suggested a strategy. Empty the gun, cock it, and lock it. Throw it in a backpack with your books (or whatever). Carry it around for a few weeks with all of the jostling, getting stuff in and out, throwing it here and there. At the end of a few weeks, take it out and it will, of course, still be cocked and probably with the safety still on.
I didn't try the exercise, but I see the point. When you think about it, it is an ultra-safe way to carry a gun and very available when you need it to be. The only problem is that while you get used to it, some folk still get a little nervous when you put a cocked gun into your holster.
I didn't try the exercise, but I see the point. When you think about it, it is an ultra-safe way to carry a gun and very available when you need it to be. The only problem is that while you get used to it, some folk still get a little nervous when you put a cocked gun into your holster.
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1911
I (of course) carry my 1911s Cocked and Locked.
It should be noted as a matter of historical record that the U.S. military wanted the original style Colt hammer (on the first submitted Colt semi~auto) to be redesigned especially so that it could be Thumb Cocked and it was redesigned for that express purpose on the 1911.
Times have changed and so has the hammer design and so have the general shooter safety rules and regs.
Just to comment on the previous question: "What if your thumb slips?"
The hammer will get caught by the sear on the hammer half or safety notch before the hammer contacts the firing pin on a properly functioning 1911 pistol. With high quality & properly fit factory parts the sear will not break & neither will the hammer notch.
In addition on the Series 80 pistols the added firing pin block will not allow the firing pin to move forward unless the trigger is pulled rearward to raise the lever that lifts the Firing Pin Block "up & off block"
That being said: I still believe the best way to carry the 1911 style pistols is cocked & locked.
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I (of course) carry my 1911s Cocked and Locked.
It should be noted as a matter of historical record that the U.S. military wanted the original style Colt hammer (on the first submitted Colt semi~auto) to be redesigned especially so that it could be Thumb Cocked and it was redesigned for that express purpose on the 1911.
Times have changed and so has the hammer design and so have the general shooter safety rules and regs.
Just to comment on the previous question: "What if your thumb slips?"
The hammer will get caught by the sear on the hammer half or safety notch before the hammer contacts the firing pin on a properly functioning 1911 pistol. With high quality & properly fit factory parts the sear will not break & neither will the hammer notch.
In addition on the Series 80 pistols the added firing pin block will not allow the firing pin to move forward unless the trigger is pulled rearward to raise the lever that lifts the Firing Pin Block "up & off block"
That being said: I still believe the best way to carry the 1911 style pistols is cocked & locked.
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Now I will admit my 1911 has been locked in the box for a while with CLP on it, but when I do carry it is cocked and locked. My SW 37 is just to easy to carry. I will dust the 1911 off this week end though. PS Just the feel of old slab sides in my hand almost causes my toes to curl. :banana:
PS Just the feel of old slab sides in my hand almost causes my toes to curl. :banana:
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The Problem
The problem with Condition 2 carry is not that the firearm cannot handle it...it's that there is a fallible human factor involved which requires that the operator do everything right in the exact correct sequence every time.
Making the pistol ready for Condition 2 carry necessitates pulling the trigger with a round in the chamber while preventing the hammer from moving forward. Not always such a great idea & it's just far better to stay in the habit of keeping your finger off of the trigger.
The problem with Condition 2 carry is not that the firearm cannot handle it...it's that there is a fallible human factor involved which requires that the operator do everything right in the exact correct sequence every time.
Making the pistol ready for Condition 2 carry necessitates pulling the trigger with a round in the chamber while preventing the hammer from moving forward. Not always such a great idea & it's just far better to stay in the habit of keeping your finger off of the trigger.
Just to advance the thread.
I have a Star Model Super, SA and a Bolister Molina (I don't know if I spelled that correctly or not ). They only have the thumb safety, no grip safety, should they be carried cocked and locked or am I better off with ranking the slide?
Now, with the HK and the Kimber, I've put in blanks and "thrown" the gun down, around, etc.. and no "bang". I had some blanks made for the Model super, only a thumb safety, and no bang.
Quite honestly, I trust my guns, the safeties on my guns, a lot more then I trust turning the key on the engine of a car/truck (oh, my 1981 GMC blew the other day... that was a surprise).
What I'm wondering is that I won't pull the hammer back on my .45LC (Ruger) and carry it that way but it doesn't have a safety, or a dual safety (grip and thumb), so it wouldn't be prudent to carry it that way.
Wayne
I have a Star Model Super, SA and a Bolister Molina (I don't know if I spelled that correctly or not
). They only have the thumb safety, no grip safety, should they be carried cocked and locked or am I better off with ranking the slide?Now, with the HK and the Kimber, I've put in blanks and "thrown" the gun down, around, etc.. and no "bang". I had some blanks made for the Model super, only a thumb safety, and no bang.
Quite honestly, I trust my guns, the safeties on my guns, a lot more then I trust turning the key on the engine of a car/truck (oh, my 1981 GMC blew the other day... that was a surprise).
What I'm wondering is that I won't pull the hammer back on my .45LC (Ruger) and carry it that way but it doesn't have a safety, or a dual safety (grip and thumb), so it wouldn't be prudent to carry it that way.
Wayne
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1,080 Posts
I just recently (within the past week) recieved my CCW, up until that point when I carried it had to be open. Since the only open carry holster I own is a Yaqui slide I wasn't too comfortable with the idea of carrying cocked and locked, so I was going around on condition three. Now that I can carry concealled it's condition one all the time.
A1C Lickey
A1C Lickey
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The Grip Safety
The only function of the grip safety is to physically block the trigger from moving rearward until the pistol is in hand.
I guess if a pistol has a beavertail type grip safety it might also serve to prevent the hammer from getting slammed too hard if you dropped your pistol on some concrete. The beavertail "might" take the brunt of the blow.
Back in the 50s & 60s & up to about the mid 70s ??? ~ the Colt Grip Safety was sometimes pinned down (as a custom modification) so that it stayed (depressed) in the DEPRESSED/OFF position.
A hole was drilled in the top of the mainspring housing that mated with a hole drilled in the bottom of the grip safety & then a steel pin was inserted as the mainspring housing was moved up on reassembly of the pistol.
It was not a real popular modification but it sure was done on some custom pistols. Some shooters (and obviously some gun makers) considered the Grip Safety to be a redundant safety feature that served no real useful purpose. It does not bother me being there on the pistol since it always works & goes down when I grip my guns...so I'm neutral on it being there.
The only function of the grip safety is to physically block the trigger from moving rearward until the pistol is in hand.
I guess if a pistol has a beavertail type grip safety it might also serve to prevent the hammer from getting slammed too hard if you dropped your pistol on some concrete. The beavertail "might" take the brunt of the blow.
Back in the 50s & 60s & up to about the mid 70s ??? ~ the Colt Grip Safety was sometimes pinned down (as a custom modification) so that it stayed (depressed) in the DEPRESSED/OFF position.
A hole was drilled in the top of the mainspring housing that mated with a hole drilled in the bottom of the grip safety & then a steel pin was inserted as the mainspring housing was moved up on reassembly of the pistol.
It was not a real popular modification but it sure was done on some custom pistols. Some shooters (and obviously some gun makers) considered the Grip Safety to be a redundant safety feature that served no real useful purpose. It does not bother me being there on the pistol since it always works & goes down when I grip my guns...so I'm neutral on it being there.
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New to 1911's - I have had a Ruger P94 for years. Can't carry it cocked and locked. If engage safety it doubles as a decocker. First shot (if you don't cock first) is DA then SA thereafter - unless engage safety again then decocks.
Other carry has been .38 snubby WO hammer to cock - hammer is there but smoothed down flush with frame ( DAO ).
When I got the Colt Defender 1911 .45 it took a while reading this and other forums and some thinking before I was compfortable with it cocked and locked.
Now that I have a better understanding about it (and reading in instruction book) I find I feel cocked and locked is the only way to carry. If not cocked then none in the chamber.
Other carry has been .38 snubby WO hammer to cock - hammer is there but smoothed down flush with frame ( DAO ).
When I got the Colt Defender 1911 .45 it took a while reading this and other forums and some thinking before I was compfortable with it cocked and locked.
Now that I have a better understanding about it (and reading in instruction book) I find I feel cocked and locked is the only way to carry. If not cocked then none in the chamber.
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