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Discussion Starter #1
Has anyone had experience with concealed carry of a tokarev automatic?
Problem:
A keltec 3AT is about the biggest thing I can carry in summer clothing and it is just not big enough to shoot well and the caliber is small. With me the major issue is thickness, not height or length. I have a Glock 33, j frame .38s, multiple 1911’s single and double stack, S&W VE 9mm and others.

Facts in favor of the tokarev: 1- it has a very thin frame, relatively snag free construction, available in 9mm and 7.62 and it is cheap.
Disadvantage: 1- safety mechanism on most US imports is quarter cock with a sear blocking safety and 2-it is not rust resistant (In Florida we sweat a lot.)
I would greatly appreciate any constructive input.
 

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Several people I know own one but no concealed carry. I have heard that quality varies a great deal depending on importer/country.
I'm putting my 2 cents in here because you cite the thin frame - might consider a PPK. I have heard good reports about the S&W PPK and they have a really thin profile. Also, they're stainless, so that would help some with rust (but not a complete worry-free situation - I have a S&W 629 that has rusted in places from sweating on it).
They are not cheap, but I can't think of any reliable handgun that is inexpensive.
 

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Seems I recall reading about some safety issues with them, either on Xavier's site or Stephen Camp's - can't remember which though. Based on that, I'd pass on using one for a CCW.

I'm 5'-10", 185lbs and can conceal a fullsize 1911 under an untucked shirt - many of the other members here are smaller than me and pull it off easily. I'm curious what your wardrobe is like, is it possible to modify it a bit to allow for better concealment or are you restricted by work dress codes?

I prefer to choose my caliber and weapon first, then dress around it. A 1911 in .45acp on my hip makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside so it's well worth the effort to modify my clothing where necessary.
Jack
 

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Tok's and Concealed carry

I bought a Norinco Chinese Tok and a 1000 round case of milsurp ammo about 15 years ago, back when Kalifornia was sensible about firearms ownership. Anyway, I shot the living heck out of it and I found it to be a surprisingly reliable and accurate handgun. I have small hands so it worked pretty good for me. I liked it so much I even bought a second Tok 213 with a ribbed slide and drop-in .38 Super barrel. Now THAT was a little Blaster!

We had a "wide open" off-duty carry policy in the PD I worked at back then, so on occasion I would carry it off duty. It was slim and concealed very well in an IWB holster. I eventually sold the Tok's and the left over 7.62X25 ammo. Nowadays, I think I'd carry something better if I could, but I still think Tok's are a great little gun.

Practice is everything in defensive pistol and the Tok ammo is pretty cheap so if the operator does their part I'd say it's got potential as a viable defensive piece. It's like the old saying, "Beware the Man with One Gun...He probably knows how to use it!"

Stay Safe!
 

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I carried one when it was all I could afford. It has disadvantages (rust, poor safety system, etc) but was accurate, reliable, and functional.

I wouldn't dream of having to do it again, but I wouldn't be underarmed if that was my only option.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
CQBManny: Can you tell me what is an IWB holster? One problem for me with a tokarev is finding concealment holsters for it.

David III: The PPK I believe is either .32 or .380 and I want at least a full size military-police caliber. I have a few .380s and .32s already.

maclean3 Senior Member: I am 5'10" and at 174 lbs I am dieting trying to get back to at least 165 lbs. You are more likely to die overweight from health problems then crime where I live. Bending over will pull up a loose shirt and expose your gun. If I could choose any weapon it would be a machine pistol. A CAR would also be nice. Those are great at close range, but alas I do not have one. They are perfect close range medicine for pit bulls and most other dangerous entities.
 

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What about a makarov, I don't know much about them except they are 9x18 - a little more than .380, and they are cheap - I have a friend who just got one for less than $180
 

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True Yoshi - the Mak is still a great little gun at a very good price.

I do know some folks you use them for carry and the 9x18 has a useful ''edge'' on the 9x17. They are for some tho a tad heavy for size and I expect the same might be said for a Tok - tho much depends on what someone finds comfortable.

The main requirement I'd say with any of the Eastern block type semi's is, if considered for carry - make sure to know the manual of arms inside out and backwards - including the safety aspects. The Mak certainly is for most, myself included, dead reliable and for sure these guns can be useful for folks starting out on a real tight budget - a means to have ''something'' at very least.
 

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Tok's & Concealed Carry

IWB stands for Inside Waist Band. I don't know of any holsters that are made to fit the Tok and its so cheap I don't think I'd spend serious cash on a custom rig, no matter how much I liked it. Get a nylon Uncle Mike's IWB holster and you will be in good shape. If you are a fat boy like me you'll want the kind with the extended lip about the slide. That way my oversized love handles don't get pinched or abraded excessively. I'm carrying my SIG P229R in one right now and hardly know it is there.

I forgot to mention, I did not have any any faith in the half cock or add-on safety lever on my Tok's so I just carried chamber empty with a full mag. Like I said, this was only something to stuff in my pants while mowing the lawn or running to the store for a quart of milk...just an insurance policy.

Stay safe!

P.S. We just had a nasty shooting here locally about two weeks ago. A homeless guy walked into a Denny's restaurant in south county and opened fire without warning and killed some innocent folks. Very sad. I have to wonder though what would have happened if some legally armed person had been there and could have intervened...
 

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I wouldn't trust my life to a Tokarev if I had a choice in the matter, and it isn't the safest gun out there either. True, some folks are on a very tight budget, and in a gun fight a Tokarev is better than no gun at all; however, there are many better pistols.

I personally wouldn't cheap out on my personal defense gear, since you frequently don't get second chances in a life threatening situation.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Omni: Can people legally carry concealed where you live in canada?

My interest in the tokarev is not driven primarily by the price since I have other more expensive guns. I even have a P14 that is made in your country. The tokarev in military issue format is reliable (most soviet era weapons are.), but it does have manual safety issues.

CQBManny: Thanks for the information on Uncle Mike's IWB holster.

For an el cheapo gun while working in my orchard and nearby woods I carry a S&W VE pistol (cost $200 2nd hand, guy's wife did not like the trigger) with the heavy factory trigger pull unmodified. I might happen upon a rattlesnake, wild animal (hog, rabid raccon, etc) or two legged intruder and it should serve until I can get to one of two used pump shotguns ($80 each) I keep loaded around the house. I have absolute faith that a full load of buckshot at 30 feet will neutralize anything that I might encounter.
 

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barnetmill said:
A keltec 3AT is about the biggest thing I can carry in summer clothing and it is just not big enough to shoot well and the caliber is small.
So am I to understand you have a P3AT?

If so, just hunt around for a Keltec P11 (or that shiny new PF-9 single stack) ... should be able to find one under $300 and since you're already familiar with the manual of arms it should fit the bill about perfectly.


Then get a good holster for it and you're set.




The Tok would be kinda cool, but frankly I'd get a pistol designed for CCW first.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I have a lot of interest in the PF-9 single stack

Zundfolge:

I have a lot of interest in the PF-9 single stack. My .32 and .380 Keltecs both needed work (new parts) to get them functional and I assume the same will be true of the PF-9. The P-11 is not thin enough. Right now the PF-9 is not available yet but I will soon be giving my dealer a call along I am sure with two dozen others to get on the waiting list.

Tokarevs, Colt .45 autos, P38s were designed to fire under the worst possible conditions, Keltecs are not.
 

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I've read about safety problems with the Tok's. One or two posts have recommended that it be carried with an empty chamber.

John
 

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I understand where you are coming from...

my carry weapon is a bit unusual, a CZ-52. In my opinion, reliable operation and user training are the most important aspects. I'm results oriented. If the weapon is mechanically sound and reasonably accurate, it's technically good to go. I have always felt that equipment discussions were a little silly, in the civilian world and in the military. It's the training. I opted to buy a lesser expensive, reliable firearm and put my money on range memberships and ammo. So, long story short, if you feel it functions reliably and you can shoot it accurately under stress, carry it.
 

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Barnetmill asked, "Can people legally carry concealed where you live in canada?"

I have a Utah CCW permit for when I'm in the U.S., but I can't carry concealed in Canada. I guess your government trusts me more than my own government. :mad:

There is lots of good hunting here though!
 
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JaredMcLaughlin: You do have a point "In my opinion, reliable operation and user training are the most important aspects."

There are actually three aspects to this equation. 1-one is the weapon (equipment) 2- is your ability to use it. 3-Mindset and ability to make the proper decisions and acts under stress. Number 3 is for me the hard one.

I have a CZ-52 and prefer the tokarev. The CZ-52 on the drawing board is a good design, but it really should have been improved for things like the firing pin and one of the pins on one of my CZ-52's keeps coming out. I will fix it when I get around to it. Right now preparing for the next hurricane season is more important.

The real problem with a CZ-52 is that it is a full size service pistol and I might as well carry 1911.
 

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I like my Polish Tok no end, but I agree about it not being particularly rust-resistant. I'm giving some real thought to hard-chroming it.

For carry, I've found that an IWB for a BHP or 1911 works fine. I keep the hammer down on an empty chamber, although a friend of mine tells me that - given the weight of the pull on his - he'd feel comfortable carrying hammer back with a loaded chamber. Not me (even if there is a strap between the hammer and the pin)!

Anyway, it's a dandy gun and the cartridge is great. My Polish Tok averaged over 1500 fps with S&B ammo last time I took it to the range - nothing to sneer at, even with an 85-gr pill.
 

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Look at the Polish P64 in 9X18. Same gun as the PPK but made in Poland, You can get new ones (1970's) for under $150.00. They love Wolff ammo and will feed anything that you give it.
frankmako
 
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