Defensive Carry banner

1 - 20 of 60 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
148 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hey fellas,

I have read a lot of the people on this site seem to be down on the 9mm for self-defense EDC usage. It seems like everyone feels the need to put the biggest hole in an attacker on the 1st shot. The thing I worry about more is ensuring I am accurate, and that no one other than the attacker is injured when I take shots. Depending on the factors involved, there is always the chance that you may actually miss. You do not want an overly powerful round to cause huge problems for an innocent person nearby(especially not death). In self defense situations the main objective is to ALWAYS to preserve your life, and not necessarily kill the attacker.

With all that said, I decided to purchase a small Subcompact Glock 26. I did so because as a beginner I felt that the Glock Subcompacts were easier to control for accuracy purpose in 9mm than the .40 or .357 models. Also becuase the smaller handgun is easier to conceal at the caliber I chose. After making the decision to buy the 26, my next question for the guys at my local range(usaually DFW Gun range for those of you near Dallas,Tx) was what is the best Defensive Carry Ammo? The Corbon Pow'R Ball Premium SD ammo was the 1st thing he recommended. I asked about the Federal HST 124gr(a very highly recomended ammo), but he still stood firm thart the Corbon Pow'R Ball ammo is superior.

He explained that the Pow'R Ball altho less proven than the Fed HST (due to being the newer product) it still is the better choice. Quote from him was that "These bad boys will open up a pretty nast hole in whatever they hit." He said that the Polymer-Ball that caps the hollow point ensures penetration into thicker clothing that can clog up in normal HP bullets. It also ensures that the round loads into the chamber each time(Similar to ball ammo) as hollow points seem to have issues with the edges causeing problems that can lead to jams. You dont want these problems increase the chances of allowing the avg. bad guy trying to do you harm to continue coming after you.

I eventually bought the 9mm +P 100Gr Pow'RBall. The velocity(1475fps) & Energy (483ft/lbs) count on the box seemed to amaze the guy selling it to me. I purchased the ammo at a different shop than the place that recommended them(The Bullet Trap, Plano,Tx), so I asked the salesman what he thought about Pow'R Ball for a different persons opinion. The salesman said that "I have heard nothing but good things about the Pow'R Ball ammo" and even tho its a lighter load it will still do just as good of a job as the Fed HST 124gr +P ammo upon impact on the bad guy, and insome cases better. Since it costed a bit more than the Federal HST ammo(out of stock) I hoped that it would be worth the extra money. But then again, you cant put a price on your life.

It is said to completely mushroom everytime because of the polymer ball that caps the hollow point(very important IMO), and it's also light enough that it will not over-penetrate and possibly kill someone that you are not intended to catch the slug. Especially if in a building/crowded place . No of us are perfect shots, and will miss target from time to time. The only thing about this ammo is its never found in abundance as some of the other brands seem to be. A lot of places do not even carry it. If you find some, and decide that you like them, make sure that you buy a lot. This is not Ammo I'd waste for range practice, altho I would recommend shooting a few.

The purpose of this post was not to sell anyone on Pow'Ball ammo, but to share some info about a 9mm ammo that is great for SD purpose. Please voice your opinion on the Pow'R Ball 9mm ammo, or opinions on the Pow'R Ball ammo in general(any caliber)? Also can you share any stories or experiences you have had using it please?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,263 Posts
Cor-Bon is traditionally much hotter ammunition than other stuff available.

And I would give serious thought to not only stopping the attack, but ending your attackers existence as well. Then it is your word against his, and from what I understand, dead BGs make terrible witnesses. They also have a hard time suing you too.....Just a thought.
 
  • Like
Reactions: oldnfat

·
Registered
Joined
·
148 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
True, but he is not always the only witness outside of yourself these days, with all the eyes in the sky, camera phones, etc. I mean the right for self-defense, does not mean you have the right to kill. I have no problem doing so, if the occasion arrises, but I'd rather let the authorites arrive, and find that I was merciful and only wanted to survive the attack. Not take a life if I did not have to.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
469 Posts
I see what you are saying about being merciful and all, but think for a minute. YOU go to court because you shot and WOUNDED someone with a gun. SymPATHETIC jury can hang you and you lose your 2A and/or the perp comes after you at a later date to exact his revenge so to speak. Dead men tell no tales, they tell no LIES either. If my SD handgun is drawn and used, it will be used to END the threat, not just STOP it. But off that subject, I have heared that powrball is a VERY good load, but as stated before Cor-Bon is usually loaded hotter than other ammo on the market. It is a reliable feeder from what Ive heared and in my limited (50-100 rounds) experience with it. Also, it DOES cause a sharper recoil IMO (especially in my .40, which has a snappy recoil to begin with). For SD, you need to use a load YOU have tested and YOU are comfortable with, I decided against corbon and went with hornady 155 XTP HPs. I still have a couple boxs of corbon and may rotate it into my EDC after the next range trip.
~Steve
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
148 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Anytime you draw your weapon, you may possibly have to go to trial over the matter. Even if the guy is dead. Dont get me wrong tho, Im not a person who will be shooting to wound the bad guys. My comments are more about overkill or stray bullets hitting wrong targets(possibly in/out body hitting innocent person). If if you make a righcheous kill of the bad guy, if a innocent person falls or is injured in process then you still may be sued or have charges pressed for man slaughter. Discharging a firearm in public can alway lead to complications.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,103 Posts
I used to use PowrBall in 9mm. However, every test I've seen shows it shedding its jacket. Weight retention is not good, and penetration can suffer - especially since it is a light round to begin with.

I went to Federal Expanding Full Metal Jacket in 124 gr, +P. However, you can't find any right now - next production run is not until Jan 2010. Weight retention is near 100%. I will buy more next year.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
838 Posts
I used to use PowrBall in 9mm. However, every test I've seen shows it shedding its jacket. Weight retention is not good, and penetration can suffer - especially since it is a light round to begin with.

I went to Federal Expanding Full Metal Jacket in 124 gr, +P. However, you can't find any right now - next production run is not until Jan 2010. Weight retention is near 100%. I will buy more next year.
I agree , the 100 gr. is moving to fast to hold togather and penetration does not meet FBI specifications (12 inch min.).I have changed to 124+p ammo as well (Gold Dot).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,103 Posts
Yup. Too many folks get impressed by velocity and "energy." Does no good if the bullet only penetrates 6 inches, and then blows up, failing to reach the vitals.

By the way - loved Babylon 5! Once you got past the weird costumes, you had a really great Sci-Fi soap opera of sorts. Spirituality, religion, political intrigue, comedy...that show had it all!:smile:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
156 Posts
I also carry the 124grn +p gold dot on the occasions that I carry a 9mm. The powerball doesn't hold together well and the penetration is sub par compared to all the other options.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,106 Posts
I'm a little confused by your mindset. You state you want to be merciful and not kill if avoidable, but part of your justification for choosing this round is this round is the following statement:

Hey fellas,
Quote from him was that "These bad boys will open up a pretty nast hole in whatever they hit."
In addition to not sound very "merciful" for the guy trying to kill you, the "nasty hole" thoery does not jive too well with your stated concern of hitting innocents, either. That being said, if somebody is trying to do serious enough harm to your or your family that you feel justified in shooting them, is mercy really what you want in the forefront of your mind? I would fear that this mindset will lead to hesitation and hesitation kills. Mercilessly.

the Pow'R Ball altho less proven than the Fed HST (due to being the newer product) it still is the better choice.
In my opinion, "less proven" and "better choice" don't really go together when it comes to something that your life might depend on.

I eventually bought the 9mm +P 100Gr Pow'RBall. The velocity(1475fps) & Energy (483ft/lbs) count on the box seemed to amaze the guy selling it to me.
Trusting the opinion of the guy selling you the ammo might not be the best way to form an opinion.

This is not Ammo I'd waste for range practice, altho I would recommend shooting a few.
- or -

But then again, you cant put a price on your life.
Which is it?

Hustle, I'm not trying to bust your chops. Personally, I think the 9mm, in modern loadings, can be an extremely effective SD round. Just trying to stir your thought process a bit about your choice of ammunition and how you arrived at your decision. Whatever you choose, practice with it. Fire enough of it to make sure your weapon functions with it reliably and to find where the point-of-impact tends to be for that round from your particular gun.

Safe shooting!
Gonzo
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,765 Posts
I agree , the 100 gr. is moving to fast to hold togather and penetration does not meet FBI specifications (12 inch min.).I have changed to 124+p ammo as well (Gold Dot).
I agree... I prefer the loads with heavier bullets for the penetration aspect of the wound profile...

The Powerball loads are too light to be reliable performers...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,023 Posts
Semantics. You SAY you're shooting to "STOP" the attack. The law says that anytime you use a firearm, whether or not the perp dies you have employed "deadly force." That's why you shoot "Center of Mass" because that's where the vital organs lie. If the perp fails to stop after two COM hits, you instantly segue to the cranial vault (forehead) for the instant "lights out." Make no mistake, when you shoot in self defense, you are shooting to kill. We merely sweeten the rhetoric when we use verbiage like shooting to "stop." We also don't use any additional verbiage that sends any note of satisfaction or communicates any sense of glory in the taking of a life. THAT sends a very different signal to society. A negative signal. I for one would feel a sense of grief in what that other person's actions forced me to do. I would not feel "regret." Regret signals guilt. A lawful self defense shooting is undertaken without any other recourse as a last chance for survival. With that in mind always choose your firearm and ammo to procure for yourself the optimum chance to keep breathing and then make certain that your skill at arms is at least equal to or better than your equipment.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
148 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
@ The GreatGonzo:

Well, a lot of those comments you quoted were salesman comments. I do feel that you should use the ammo at the range to be comfortable with its performance, but at the same time, you dont need to perfect your shot using premium ammo.

As far as the comment about opening up a nasty hole, and me being merciful. It's not about showing mercy, but more about not going too far. So far that the law deems my actions to be over the line when it comes to using self-defense as my reason to use lethal force. Opening up a nasty hole is something that I expect any bullet to do, but opening a nasty hole does not alway lead to death. I am a heavily tattoed african-american male, and pretty large/intimidating in size. Often times, people are gonna find it hard to believe that I was fearing for my life & possibly doubt my need go far enough to kill the attacker. I would not hesitate to fire on a attacker until they threat is over. But thats all that is necessary. I will let Law Enforcement & The courts deal with the rest.

I guess when it comes to trusting the salesmen, you are be right. I am new to all this, and realize that its important to figure out for myself what works best, but I just wanted some kinda starting point for what I should consider using as SD ammo. Especially since the Ammo I really wanted was not avialable anywhere(Federal HST 124gr). I guess the fact that I am on here consulting with you guys is that I still wasnt sure I made the right choice and wanted to hear from others who have tried this ammo.

Thanks for all the comments fellas! I hope Im not coming off as a smart ass newbie when it comes to all this. Im Just a bit ignorant when it comes to a lot of the technicall numbers & such when it comes to ammo. I need your guidance fellas! Dont give up on me!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
148 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Semantics. You SAY you're shooting to "STOP" the attack. The law says that anytime you use a firearm, whether or not the perp dies you have employed "deadly force." That's why you shoot "Center of Mass" because that's where the vital organs lie. If the perp fails to stop after two COM hits, you instantly segue to the cranial vault (forehead) for the instant "lights out." Make no mistake, when you shoot in self defense, you are shooting to kill. We merely sweeten the rhetoric when we use verbiage like shooting to "stop." We also don't use any additional verbiage that sends any note of satisfaction or communicates any sense of glory in the taking of a life. THAT sends a very different signal to society. A negative signal. I for one would feel a sense of grief in what that other person's actions forced me to do. I would not feel "regret." Regret signals guilt. A lawful self defense shooting is undertaken without any other recourse as a last chance for survival. With that in mind always choose your firearm and ammo to procure for yourself the optimum chance to keep breathing and then make certain that your skill at arms is at least equal to or better than your equipment.
Thanks brother! I will take that mindset going forward. I guess I had that mindset before, but kinda deprogrammed myself, thinking it was a street thug mentality that if you shoot, you are to shoot to kill! I decided that if I was gonna do things right, get my CHL and be legally authorized to carry my gun then I'd need to be warry of how I responded in these situations. That meant not to kill attacker if they have been stopped from the attack. But as the other gentleman stated, stopping the attack this day, may not mean they are not free to come after me another time.

I will always shoot to permanently stop any attacker who may likely mean to do same to me! I just hope that there are several NRA members on my jury if the DA thinks that my kill was questionable :smile:.

Thanks!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,055 Posts
The Power Ball was originally made as a cheap practice alternative for the Glaser Safety Slug. It is not made to hold together, sheds it's jacket pretty easy. I don't really consider that a failure and I don't worry too much about it. It probably will work as good as anything else out there, and at least it's in stock in your area.

My concerns are the interior ballistics. The further away the round gets from standard ballistics, the more I want to shoot it a bunch to verify it's reliable in my guns. Yes, the poly ball nose will help, but it is a lightweight and high velocity round. I'd want to know the slide was cycling good with them. Maybe even try to limp wrist or shoot weak handed at least.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,106 Posts
Thanks for all the comments fellas! I hope Im not coming off as a smart ass newbie when it comes to all this. Im Just a bit ignorant when it comes to a lot of the technicall numbers & such when it comes to ammo. I need your guidance fellas! Dont give up on me!

Heck no! This place is one of the best in the world to seek out information. It is a heck of a let better to ask and know than to not ask and wonder! :smile: It is great that you are putting serious thought into your carry ammo. Your life may depend on it one day.
Gonzo
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
Powr ball jams

I had two boxes of 9mm Pow'r Ball ammo that I decided to shoot for practice on the range, using a Sig P239, I had a lot jams due to the shortness of the round. This is the only round that has ever given me a problem in this Sig and it's shot a lot of rounds. So if you have a box of Pow'r Ball ammo check the OA length vs a regular 9mm round. I think I will stick to my Corbon DPX ammo for the SIG.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,023 Posts
+1 on DPX!

I think I will stick to my Corbon DPX ammo for the SIG.
Yup, I love DPX in both 9mm and 45 and I often carry those in my spare mag. For years I have loaded my primary mags (those in the gun) with MagSafe, primarily for their lack of ricochet or over penetration and other reasons, but I may start loading DPX in the primary mags.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
148 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
I keep reading good things about Gold Dots, Ranger Ts, & Fed HST ammo. I will have heard u cant go wrong choosing either of these 3(All are good quality). 124gr Gold Dots or 124gr Fed HST are likely the way I might go. I rather not step up to the 147gr count right away(especially if 124gr can be very affective/reliable). I will test fire a box of all 3 brands to see what I like best, and what my gun likes best. I will also see what is most likely to be available. Currently I have found that the Gold Dots seem to be available more often than the Fed HST.
 
1 - 20 of 60 Posts
Top