Defensive Carry banner

1 - 20 of 48 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
122 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hopefully I won't get flamed for this too badly, but I picked up a brand new Stag Arms 15 the other day and I have a concern about something that I didn't notice before,

This is a 5.56 chamber, noted on the barrel, on the paperwork, all over. But the exit hole (for lack of the correct term) looks to me like a 22lr. I can't see how the .223 Remington rounds I have would be able to fire through a hole that small. As this is my first purchase of a 5.56/223 rifle, I'm not familiar with the details yet.
Before I trek back to the LGS to let them eyeball it, what do you suggest? Call Stag with the serial number and have them look it up?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,762 Posts
22lr is .22 5.56/.223 is .223 only very very slightly larger.
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
8,501 Posts
The bullit that comes out the end of the barrel IS a .22. You can buy a .22lr conversion kit to shoot .22lr through your AR 15.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,236 Posts
Hopefully I won't get flamed for this too badly, but I picked up a brand new Stag Arms 15 the other day and I have a concern about something that I didn't notice before,

This is a 5.56 chamber, noted on the barrel, on the paperwork, all over. But the exit hole (for lack of the correct term) looks to me like a 22lr. I can't see how the .223 Remington rounds I have would be able to fire through a hole that small. As this is my first purchase of a 5.56/223 rifle, I'm not familiar with the details yet.
Before I trek back to the LGS to let them eyeball it, what do you suggest? Call Stag with the serial number and have them look it up?

It must be broken. I will take it off your hands for 1/2 price. :duh:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
122 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Ha! since I paid $50,000 for it, I will let it go for half. :)

Seriously though, a 223 is exponentially larger in size than a 22lr, or are you guys just picking on me?

I don't want to convert it, I just don't want the 223 round to blow up because the barrel is not sized like it is supposed to be.

And frankly, 223 ammo is easier to find in these parts than .22lr is. My S&W M&P 15-22 is sitting idle for the time being.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,224 Posts
The entire .223/5.56 round is larger than a .22 long rifle round but the bullet/projectile is .22 caliber.

As stated you can buy a conversion kit and fire standard .22 long rifle from your rifle.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
24,738 Posts
You are absolutely positively OK. Really.

The .223 is only .003 nominally larger than a .22 which is a miniscule difference. A reloader could explain that in terms of inches or mm, but rest easy. At absolute terms (and we're talking very small differences) that is only 1.36%.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
122 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
The entire .223/5.56 round is larger than a .22 long rifle round but the bullet/projectile is .22 caliber.

As stated you can buy a conversion kit and fire standard .22 long rifle from your rifle.

I see, so most of the bulk is in the jacket portion of the round?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
182 Posts
this is the problem with brand new gun owners (i am one too..im not flaming!!). There is an incredible amount to learn and understand about every single aspect of firearms. I wish the stores had more time to REALLY work with the people that are purchasing. I know that when I went the guys working always acted like I should all ready know everything. Like the OP, i'm not too proud to just say, "hey, i have no idea what im doing" because i dont want to die. But I can see a lot of timid people buying that seem like they will just never ask the correct questions.

ad to try and clarify the OP question; what you have with a .22 and a .223 is virtually the same diameter bullet. The CARTRIDGE...that holds the bullet, powder, primer, is COMPLETELY different. The .223 cartridge is massive compared to the .22lr. When you shoot, the cartridge ejects out the side, which is why you can convert it to a .22LR. The bullet itself, in either caliber will exit the barrel, properly.

Keep asking questions! Someday you will be able to answer them for another newb that will appreciate it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
182 Posts
also to clarify,
The "jacket" is a laminated material around the lead bullet. So its like a lead bullet dipped in some other material. The piece that holds the bullet is a cartridge.
I think i'm correct...like i said..im still a newb.

I'm sure somebody will correct me if im wrong.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
122 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
this is the problem with brand new gun owners (i am one too..im not flaming!!). There is an incredible amount to learn and understand about every single aspect of firearms. I wish the stores had more time to REALLY work with the people that are purchasing. I know that when I went the guys working always acted like I should all ready know everything. Like the OP, i'm not too proud to just say, "hey, i have no idea what im doing" because i dont want to die. But I can see a lot of timid people buying that seem like they will just never ask the correct questions.

ad to try and clarify the OP question; what you have with a .22 and a .223 is virtually the same diameter bullet. The CARTRIDGE...that holds the bullet, powder, primer, is COMPLETELY different. The .223 cartridge is massive compared to the .22lr. When you shoot, the cartridge ejects out the side, which is why you can convert it to a .22LR. The bullet itself, in either caliber will exit the barrel, properly.

Keep asking questions! Someday you will be able to answer them for another newb that will appreciate it.
Thank you! When I was waiting for the final paperwork in the store, there was another guy asking some basic questions to the guy behind the counter. He looks at me and rolls his eyes, as if to say "I can't believe I have to spend time on this dunce." and I just smiled thinking to myself that I would be the next dunce in line.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
24,738 Posts
So what exactly is the difference between the .22LR and .223 cartridges? Both can be fired out of rifles, and both can be fired out of pistols. Both have been used historically by civilian and military shooters. Both can be used for hunting (.22LR for animals such as rats, squirrels, rabbits, ground hogs; .223 for larger animals including coyotes, and in some states deer). Both are extremely popular rounds — .22LR is by far the most popular rimfire cartridge, and .223 is near the top (if not at the top) of the list of most popular centerfire cartridges.

Well, there’s one difference right there. Rimfire is an older design, which for the most part has been replaced with centerfire. Almost all ammunition used now is centerfire. With rimfire, the firing pin impacts on the rim of the case. With centerfire, the firing pin impacts in the center of the case. Fairly self explanitory. But it doesn’t really explain the differences between the two cartridges very well.

As mentioned above, rimfire is an older technology than centerfire. The .22LR cartridge was introduced in 1887, while the .223 cartridge was designed in 1964, specifically for use in the M-16 rifle.

Nearly a century separates the two cartridges, but what makes them different? Size-wise, the newer cartridge is slightly larger. The caliber of the cartridge measures the diameter (in inches). So the newer cartridge is 0.003″ larger in diameter — who cares? A human hair is from 0.003″ to 0.005″ in diameter. Is such a slight increase in diameter really going to make a difference?

Below is a cardboard pizza box shot with a .22LR bullet. The entry point can be seen on the left and the exit on the right. A penny is used for reference.
Rimfire cartridges have for the most part been replaced by centerfire cartridges because the thin case walls of rimfires cannot handle nearly as high of pressures as those of a centerfire cartridge. Higher pressure means that the ejected bullet has more energy to deliver on its target because its velocity is greater.

The bullets also vary in size and shape. Availability for .22LR bullets varies from 36 to 60 grains in weight (2.3 to 3.9 grams), while .223 bullets range from 40 to 90 grains in weight (2.6 to 5.8 grams). The .22LR bullet is rounded while the .223 bullet comes to a sharp point.

The .223 cartridge contains significantly more powder than the .22LR cartridge (maximum pressure 24,000 PSI for .22LR; maximum pressure 50,000 PSI for .223). The .223 bullet is a much heavier bullet, travelling at a higher velocity. This means that the .223 bullet has much more energy to deliver on its target.

Upon impact .223 bullets demonstrate a tendency to tumble, increasing the size of the wound channel. The .223 bullet also delivers additional damage due to hydrostatic shock. The .22LR bullet has neither of these qualities.

The .22LR cartridge on the left, and the .223 cartridge on the right. A penny is used for reference.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
182 Posts
Thank you! When I was waiting for the final paperwork in the store, there was another guy asking some basic questions to the guy behind the counter. He looks at me and rolls his eyes, as if to say "I can't believe I have to spend time on this dunce." and I just smiled thinking to myself that I would be the next dunce in line.
I've never understood the mentality of specialty shop owners, of any kind, to treat the newbs like scrubs. To me, those are the people that if treated properly, are your next stream of revenue. If there was EVER a time to make people feel like they needed accessories, gun sales would be it. Cleaning kits, glasses, muffs, plugs, lights, lasers, targets, ammo, cases, bags, hats, timers, reloading stuff, i mean the list goes on and on and on.

(which reminds me, i need to order some magazines right now!)

I'd want to educate my newbs to the fullest to maximize my sales AND to make sure they kept coming back, which is impossible if you are dead!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
13,765 Posts
Nope you are correct the bullet is the pointy thing that leaves the barrel of the gun at a high rate of speed. It is usually made of lead and has a metal (usually copper) around it to keep the lead from coming off in your barrel.

The cartridge is the the bullet, gun powder, and primer that is all contained in the shell casing

The shell casing is the brass shell case with out the bullet, powder or primer.

The bullet part of a .223 is .22 caliber
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
179 Posts
also to clarify,
The "jacket" is a laminated material around the lead bullet. So its like a lead bullet dipped in some other material. The piece that holds the bullet is a cartridge.
I think i'm correct...like i said..im still a newb.

I'm sure somebody will correct me if im wrong.
That's a bingo!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk, please excuse typos.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42,314 Posts
A case (or casing as some may prefer) + primer + powder + bullet (or projectile) = cartridge (or round).
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
22,296 Posts
I've never understood the mentality of specialty shop owners, of any kind, to treat the newbs like scrubs.
After having spent considerable time on both sides of the gun counter, I can tell you why, the vast majority of noobs never say "hey, i have no idea what im doing" (you figure that out the hard way). It has to be a male ego thing, women customers new to the shooting sports rarely, if ever, pretend to know everything there is to know about firearms (now I'm talking stand alone gunshops, not Big Box "sporting departments").

Maybe I was just fortunate to come across truly gun savvy old-timers in gunshops.
 
1 - 20 of 48 Posts
Top