Defensive Carry banner

1 - 20 of 27 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi,
I am new to the site, this is my first post. I am a bartender as well as a student in FL (24 yrs old). I have had my CCW license since I turned 21. I know the law says "any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the
premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose" is ILLEGAL. However, I am not drinking at the bar, I am working behind it. I leave 5 nights a week at any time between 3:00AM-4:00AM, and walk a few hundred feet to my car in a dark parking lot. Also, 2 businesses on the same street have been robbed at gun point in the last month.

I would feel much safer with my pistol on me, concealed. Is there an exception to having a weapon at a bar if it is you're place of business??
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,416 Posts
Hi,
I am new to the site, this is my first post. I am a bartender as well as a student in FL (24 yrs old). I have had my CCW license since I turned 21. I know the law says "any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the
premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose" is ILLEGAL. However, I am not drinking at the bar, I am working behind it. I leave 5 nights a week at any time between 3:00AM-4:00AM, and walk a few hundred feet to my car in a dark parking lot. Also, 2 businesses on the same street have been robbed at gun point in the last month.

I would feel much safer with my pistol on me, concealed. Is there an exception to having a weapon at a bar if it is you're place of business??
As your employer FIRST! See what they think about the situation and if it would be acceptable. Regardless of whatever law there may or may not be, your employer does have the right to prohibit carry while you're at work.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
50,585 Posts
FL gun laws are unique when it comes to bars/businesses.

I cannot eat a burger in the bar portion of a restaurant while armed, even if I'm not having a drink.
I can, however, have a burger and a beer while armed, as long as I am in the food part of the restaurant.

In any case, I cannot be in just a plain old bar, while armed. That said, if you are actually an owner (or an employee with the owner's permission) of a business, you can be armed (either CC or OC)...although in a business other than a gun shop, I would assume the owner would prefer CC if he allowed you to be armed. OMO

Good luck with talking to your employer.:bier:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
The owner would not be acceptable of me having a gun as they are very liberal people. However, the owner is never there at night, so as long as it is legal and it does not mention anything in the policy, I should be fine, right?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
76 Posts
Carrying is Legal ONLY with the permission of the business owner,
Especially in a Bar where, as you already know, Carrying is Not Legal per State Law,
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
471 Posts
Carrying is Legal ONLY with the permission of the business owner,
Especially in a Bar where, as you already know, Carrying is Not Legal per State Law,
Can someone point me to the statute that makes it legal with business owner's permission, please? I can't seem to find it in Florida statutes.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,416 Posts
Ask him/her, explain your reasoning in a calm and professional manner. Don't raise your voice or yell. Simply tell the owner that you have had situations at night where you are not comfortable walking to your vehicle and you would feel better if allowed to have a small, discreet, and concealed firearm. Also explain to them that you are licensed for carry legally by the state and don't forget to thank them for the time and for hearing you out. That could go a long way right there. When you tell someone that you did not expect to make demands but wanted to state your case and explain the situation and allow them to take any and all authority regarding it.

Good Luck!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
471 Posts
So - are you talking about FL Statute 790.25? I don't see where 790.25 allows an employee with permission to carry concealed. It looks like to me that (n) only provides for the owner of that business.

(n) A person possessing arms at his or her home or place of business;

Am I missing something? If "his or her home or place of business" is interpreted to mean place of employment, then there is no requirement for permission specified.

I am not saying you are incorrect, I just am not seeing it myself.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,416 Posts
So - are you talking about FL Statute 790.25? I don't see where 790.25 allows an employee with permission to carry concealed. It looks like to me that (n) only provides for the owner of that business.

(n) A person possessing arms at his or her home or place of business;

Am I missing something? If "his or her home or place of business" is interpreted to mean place of employment, then there is no requirement for permission specified.

I am not saying you are incorrect, I just am not seeing it myself.
All rights granted to you by the state stop once you enter private property. You still have the right to carry concealed if it is otherwise legal for you to do so there, but it's up to the owner. If they say no, please do not bring it and you do the opposite then you are committing armed trespass.

You are allowed to walk around in your home with a firearm with or without a CCW, and at your place of business again with or without a permit. So if you run a sales business of some type and handle money often, you may have a gun on your person without a permit. However, if the owner of the business says no way, then you may not.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
471 Posts
You are allowed to walk around in your home with a firearm with or without a CCW, and at your place of business again with or without a permit. So if you run a sales business of some type and handle money often, you may have a gun on your person without a permit. However, if the owner of the business says no way, then you may not.
I am curious about the without a permit part as well, then, because Florida statute 790.25 also contains this:
(2) USES NOT AUTHORIZED.--

(a) This section does not authorize carrying a concealed weapon without a permit, as prohibited by ss. 790.01 and 790.02.
So, maybe I am dense, but I don't see where that statute would allow an employee to carry a concealed firearm without a license in a bar with the bar owner's permission. I can sort of see it with a license.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,858 Posts
The owner would not be acceptable of me having a gun as they are very liberal people. However, the owner is never there at night, so as long as it is legal and it does not mention anything in the policy, I should be fine, right?
You can only assume that the boss would tell you no without sitting down and asking. Would you go against your bosses wishes if he told you no firearms allowed? How long have you worked there? Do you call in sick often or are you a model employee?

Where the other business robbed during working hours or after closing?

Are you responsible to take the nightly receipts to the bank? Or Are you worried about your personal safety?

Have you hung out with your boss after hours in his home?

To DC Florida members:: Would leaving the firearm locked up in an employee locker room be allowed under the law?

You could ask Jack what not to do. J/K :danceban:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,954 Posts
If the employer doesn't allow you to carry while working, perhaps arrangements can be made to keep it in a safe in the building, still allowing you to have it when you are leaving and walking to your vehicle?
It would be a comprimise but better than nothing.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
471 Posts
This lawyer's take on the employee carrying concealed is basically that the law is ambiguous, state prosecutors say that the law does not extend to employees only to owners, and that there has been no court ruling on it. So, I guess the answer would be concealed is concealed, but if someone official makes a stink about it, it's a roll of the dice if you are only an employee and not the owner.

Can a Person in Jacksonville, Florida Legally Carry a Concealed Gun at His/Her Place of Business? :: Jacksonville Criminal Lawyer Blog
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,416 Posts
I am curious about the without a permit part as well, then, because Florida statute 790.25 also contains this:


So, maybe I am dense, but I don't see where that statute would allow an employee to carry a concealed firearm without a license in a bar with the bar owner's permission. I can sort of see it with a license.
OPEN carry :hand5:

Not concealed. I am allowed as a business owner to have a holster with a firearm in plain view while in my own business if I choose to do so.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
891 Posts
If the employer doesn't allow you to carry while working, perhaps arrangements can be made to keep it in a safe in the building, still allowing you to have it when you are leaving and walking to your vehicle?
It would be a comprimise but better than nothing.
This could be especially true if you punch a clock or log your time. This is that gray area. Although you are off the clock they owner/employer has some (and so does the employee) liability/responsibilitiy to provide for the employees safety while on company property. If they do not provide parking I'd use that as one of my arguments with the employer/owner.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
You can only assume that the boss would tell you no without sitting down and asking. Would you go against your bosses wishes if he told you no firearms allowed? How long have you worked there? Do you call in sick often or are you a model employee?

Where the other business robbed during working hours or after closing?

Are you responsible to take the nightly receipts to the bank? Or Are you worried about your personal safety?

Have you hung out with your boss after hours in his home?

To DC Florida members:: Would leaving the firearm locked up in an employee locker room be allowed under the law?

You could ask Jack what not to do. J/K :danceban:
If my boss said no to the firearm, then I would definitely NOT do it. I have been there about 1.5 years and I had keratitis (bad eye infection) once, that was the only time I called in sick. I do not take money to the bank but I do carry over $3,000 to the safe every night. The only time I have hung out with the boss was in a golf tournament two seperate times.


About 3 months ago a patron at the bar pulled a gun on someone. No shots were fired but the police came. There are bar fights about twice a week. The bar is filled with a broad spectrum of low class people.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
399 Posts
I know the job market isn't all that hot, but maybe the best thing to do is start looking for another job, preferably in a better environment.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
FL has a law that employers cannot bar you from the RTKABA; however, FL law also states that you cannot carry a firearm into a place that sells alcohol for consumption on site. The exception being a restaurant of course and then you cannot be in the "bar" area.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
522 Posts
Florida carry

Being I was the asst. "safety/security" guy at work, and my boss is also a CCW holder, we researched just how much you can restrict the employees from on-site firearm carry.
I mentioned that the company was in a relatively "bad" part of town, and if there was a night call out because either the fire or security alarm went off, I would be packing, even so there would be LEOs on the grounds when I arrived. He said "Keep it in your car when you get there"
On premisis, according to Fl law: (paraphrasing) "The owner of a business, or employer, can, by setting employee rules, can restrict firearms or weapons in general. This includes even going on a call in a company vehicle"
Also, in Fl, if you have, say, a shop in the mall, you can post a sign forbiding firearms in your establishment to the general public, as well.
Now, heres a caviet: If you carry anyway where there s a prominently visible sign, and refuse to leave, that's called "armed trespassing", a felony third.
If you are the employers premisis, and do the same, still a felony third, with or without a permit.

Where do you tend bar? On OBT ?
 
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
Top