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Discussion Starter #1
I have met a lot of nice people lately who tell me that they like my -Make America Great Again- cap. I think that the news media and the electoral college will try to steal the election if we don't show them that we support Trump. Anybody who has ever been oppressed will tell you DON'T GIVE UP YOUR GUNS because that is the first thing they do before they take away all of your rights. That is what Hillary wants to do. I know that this sounds political but this is in on a forum where it is important to defend our rights.
 

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Not sure what the issue is? Your Hat and people's perception of you or Guns?
 
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America is already Great.
 
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Ii wish I knew who turned guns into a something so political!
 

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America is already Great.
#3 in global competitiveness
#9 in individual prosperity
#14 in education
#17 in freedom from corruption
#24 in literacy
#43 in homicide rates
#44 in health care
#47 in infant survival
#125 in GDP growth

1st in GDP
1st in incarcerations
1st in women's Olympic gold medals
1st in breast augmentation

I think we're falling in ways that are important, like individual freedom, individual costs of living, national security and economic opportunity, while rising in areas like national debt, individual debt, government corruption.
 

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#3 in global competitiveness
#9 in individual prosperity
#14 in education
#17 in freedom from corruption
#24 in literacy
#43 in homicide rates
#44 in health care
#47 in infant survival
#125 in GDP growth

1st in GDP
1st in incarcerations
1st in women's Olympic gold medals
1st in breast augmentation

I think we're falling in ways that are important, like individual freedom, individual costs of living, national security and economic opportunity, while rising in areas like national debt, individual debt, government corruption.
America was great, but there is no comparison to the America I grew up in. We've become a nation of lies, devoid of moral compass or reputation. What's worse is people accept it.

Read Atlas Shrugged. Seemed absurd when it was published. Ayn Rand was prescient, no matter what you feel about her philosophy. Its the picture of our current road.

This may be the last opportunity to fix things in the election booth. After this, if not successful, there's only one way left and it wasn't pretty the first time and won't be pretty the second time.
 

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#3 in global competitiveness
#9 in individual prosperity
#14 in education
#17 in freedom from corruption
#24 in literacy
#43 in homicide rates
#44 in health care
#47 in infant survival
#125 in GDP growth

1st in GDP
1st in incarcerations
1st in women's Olympic gold medals
1st in breast augmentation

I think we're falling in ways that are important, like individual freedom, individual costs of living, national security and economic opportunity, while rising in areas like national debt, individual debt, government corruption.
Obviously it could better. I'm not sure those statistics really paint a picture of quality of life for everyone. Obviously our healthcare system is terrible; most of the good systems use single payer. I'm not planning on having a baby, either so infant mortality doesn't apply to me.:tongue: Clearly a lot of countries do some things better than we do and that's always been the case. But we still pretty robust free speech protections and overall more RKBA than most countries. GDP growth isn't great but it's a fantasy to think it can grow forever unless we discover another planet to exploit.

Sadly the things that most need fixing won't be fixed by either of the clowns the Pubs and Dems have on offer. Our absurd incarceration rates stem almost exclusively from our misguided Drug War. Aside from Dr. Jill Stein and Gary Johnson all of the candidates want to expand it, not curtail it. Neither one of them give a fig about improving health care (and thus infant mortality). Our high homicide rate is rooted in systematic socioeconomic inequality but The Donald and HilClin are both tools of the oligarchy.

America is great in a lot of ways, but it will almost certainly get worse under either of the jackwagon's we'll be electing to POTUS.
 
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America was great, but there is no comparison to the America I grew up in. We've become a nation of lies, devoid of moral compass or reputation. What's worse is people accept it.

Read Atlas Shrugged. Seemed absurd when it was published. Ayn Rand was prescient, no matter what you feel about her philosophy. Its the picture of our current road.

This may be the last opportunity to fix things in the election booth. After this, if not successful, there's only one way left and it wasn't pretty the first time and won't be pretty the second time.
We've always been a nation of lies. And Ayn Rand was hypocritical moron.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
The big difference is that Hillary wants to control your guns and Trump knows that it is the thugs that need to be controlled. She constantly talks about gun control and anti gun laws while claiming to want to protect the rights of gang members that the police want to stop and frisk. I know that there are some on here who think that felons should be entitled to carry guns but for right now arresting felons with guns is the only thing that stops some of the killing by the thugs. As far as I'm concerned I think that America can be a lot better than what it is now because it is getting to be like a third world country with the riots and the shootings on the expressways.
 

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I'm not disagreeing. I do think personal attacks warrant substantive backup.
I don't think my comments towards a hack author that's been dead for decades should offend too many folks. If you need justification for my opinions simply open one of her moldering tomes. It's really sophomoric drivel. As for the substance re her hypocrisy note that she was pointedly against welfare until her own financial situation grew dire; she was then more than happy to suckle at the public teat.
 

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We've always been a nation of lies. And Ayn Rand was hypocritical moron.
Strongly disagree. At no time in our culture has acceptance of the big lie been so prevalent. Nor so promoted. As a point of fact, we were educated substantially on this topic when I was a youth and the contrast between our country and the practices of the Soviets and Chinese were clearly at odds.

As to whether Aayn Rand was a hypocrite I neither know nor care. She has been eerily accurate in her description on the future that awaits nations who promote extreme liberalism, over reaching government authority and political correctness. If truly a moron could see so clearly, what does it say about the current populace and leadership who fail to recognize what is clearly self evident?
 

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What you think of as clearly self evident I see as largely a lurid fantasy. We've reach a point of political polarization in this country were reality is seen only through the murky lens of ideology. It seems like almost no one cares at all about the underlying reality, just the perpetuation of their own political system. I can say though that lies have always been a very important tool for America. It's pretty easy to see that if you look back at history dispassionately. Lies and propaganda are woven into the fabric of the American identity going all the way back to the beginning. The same is probably true for all countries. But it's true that lies seem to be quite palatable for a lot of the country. Just look at the trumped up 'controversy' over climate change. If you rounded up all the scientists that conclude that anthropogenic warming is real you couldn't fit them on an ocean liner. If you rounded up all the scientists that deny it you couldn't fill a single SUV. Yet we have half the country pretending it's not true. Same goes for evolution, etc. We have maybe the most ignorant populace of any educated country; is it any wonder we have the two worst presidential candidates in a century running against each other?
 

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Obviously our healthcare system is terrible; most of the good systems use single payer. .
Do you, honestly, believe this?

That is a friggin joke...

You low info voters are killing this place and don't have enough sense to know it.
 
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Do you, honestly, believe this?

That is a friggin joke...

You low info voters are killing this place and don't have enough sense to know it.
That was a simple statement of fact. Sorry it contrasts with your unfounded and uninformed opinions. You can pretty easily get the information based on health outcomes. The US is ranked pretty low among developed nations although it you happen to be rich it's pretty good.
 

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That was a simple statement of fact. Sorry it contrasts with your unfounded and uninformed opinions. You can pretty easily get the information based on health outcomes. The US is ranked pretty low among developed nations although it you happen to be rich it's pretty good.
I don't care to read how the rest of the world rates our healthcare. Everyone that I have ever known, in my 56yrs...has had access to whatever healthcare they needed...without being put on a waiting list to get treatment at some point the the future. And, NONE OF THEM HAVE BEEN RICH. There you go with that ridiculous RICH drivel...class warfare. That is right...bring everything DOWN to the lowest common denominator...don't build anything up... Also, most anyone, that has anything on the ball and will plan there life...and not just let their life happen...can have access to the best healthcare in the world...right here. The government has done more damage to our healthcare than anything...I don't need them to take complete control of my life...healthcare or anything else. Just tell me ONE thing the government does better than the private sector...oh, I can answer that for you...NOTHING. Just look at this miserable mess Obamacare has made...but that was done by design. Hell, it has priced even more people out of the heath insurance market. Made everyone pay through the nose for less care. They never intended for it to work...don't want it to...they want to further our servitude..by controlling when and where we can go to the doctor. Well, you will get your wish...and you and your family will ultimately get the chance to suffer under it as well as the rest of us...and I think that will be great...as YOU and YOUR type will deserve it...but the rest of us, will not.

This healthcare crap is just like this global warming crap...a bunch of BS. You bleeding hearts kill me...destroy everything, making it better. You may not be able to take care of yourself....you may need the government to look after you and all of the others like you...but some of us are perfectly capable of taking care of ourselves.

Do you honestly believe that government run healthcare will not be a fiasco? Are you honestly so inept that you cannot look after yourself and raise your children to look after themselves? Did your parents fail at raising you to be independent?

If this place has been so bad...why in hell does everyone else want to come here?

There is word for those that need a nanny state to help them along...it is...LOSER.

I will answer that too...they are smarter than you.
 

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Some times, being older, when I hear folks talk about freedom ..... I chuckle, because in the past there was no political correctness police, police officers were not a target for a racist group, and things that were acceptable aren't.... and those that never were ... are. Same goes for guns and what the Dem's did in terms of gun laws over the last 50+ yrs.... chipped away and away until things had to be pushed, etc. to turn it back around. It's still a major battle, when it was never a question what the 2A meant, nor was it ever questioned.

To get it back, it's like turning a stampede of cattle, it's a wide turn to change the direction, but it can be done. I think many States have in terms of gun laws, cc , oc, etc. and getting back to Constitutional Carry (which never used to be even a question).

Key thing is Justices in the Supreme Court.... if Hillary is elected and makes those appointments, we could see things and rulings we never dreamed of ever seeing.

As Ronald Reagan said, "Bigger Government can't solve the problem, because it is the problem" .... that includes getting involved in health care, trying to limit our 2A rights, trying to throw as many roadblocks as they can for law-abiding citizens who are gun owners, etc.

3rd Reich's plan was ... Govt control of :
* citizenry owning guns, they can't & will have no means to resist.
* healthcare
* education system (endoctrinate the youth)
* Media (control the message)
* A National Police force
* Political correctness ; any dissent was considered a crime against the State, and could be punished (incl death)
The State takes precendence over the Individual ... discouraging or punishing all individuality, independent thinking, etc.
* Get rid of religion, and "worship" the State.
* Control the Judiciary, laws, etc.
* Eliminate old institutions, and create new ones to take their place.

* They implemented a plan, "see something, say something" against any person talking against the policies of the State, including kids turning in their own parents. So, they could be re-educated... it was for the good of the State. Fear of people to speak their mind, or they could be punished..... sure silences any dissent or disagreement.

See any similarities with the plans of the Dem's, of Hillary, of Obama ?

All dictators need control thru a central Government. Our founders planned it the opposite way to prevent that, limited control by the central Govt and control in the hands of the people and localized Government. Plus balanced out with the 3 equal but distinct segments of the Govt.

Folks don't just think National levels, but also who you are supporting in local and State Elections, and that are strong 2A supporters.
 

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Tell older Blacks, women, and gays how great things were in the past. Tell older Blacks how great our police force and race relations were in many parts of the county. Tell that to gays who couldn't be open, marry, or serve in the military. We had our first mixed President voted into office twice with the help of Whites, and we may have our first female president. We've come a long way in 50-60 years. We have more Constitutional carry states and shall issue, the Heller decision, and every year more pro-gun legislation is being passed vs anti-gun.

Conservatives would have been OUTRAGED if it had been a Democrat/Liberal who was running with that slogan. Funny how people get on Obama about talking bad about our country, but it seems like I hear Conservatives bad mouthing and trashing America more so than anyone else lately. We might not be the best in a lot of things, but when it comes to personal freedom, our role in the world, and our military, we're greater than anyone else. IMHO we're still a great country despite what some Conservatives and Liberals say.
 

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About the only good thing thats happened in the last 50 years is recognition of the 2A.

Gay rights have come at the expense of religious freedom and the subsequent persecution of Christians. The war on poverty has increased poverty in the black community, not to mention the collapse of 2 parent families. Our mixed race president has set civil rights back 2 generations and increased distrust of the police. Instead of integration the black community is calling for segregated schools and neighborhoods. The quality of healthcare in the USA is 2nd to none and thanks to government intervention so is the cost.

Even so we're still the greatest country in the world, bar none.


Conservatives would have been OUTRAGED if it had been a Democrat/Liberal who was running with that slogan.
Bill Clinton suggests Trump slogan racist ? but he used the same one | Fox News
 
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