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Discussion Starter #1
ExSoldier's NOTE: S'pose it doesn't work? S'pose there is a shift in who controls WHAT on the national scene....S'pose a Somalia type plan were to emerge to ask for UN "Peace Keepers" to come onto US Soil and "control rampant gun crime?" NOTE this is not an anti-UN SHTF scenario. PLEASE DON'T ruin this thread with wild Rambo assertions. I just want to see where all this "send in the national guard to disarm the bad guys" mentality might be leading.....


National Guard called to fight New Orleans crime
By Peter HendersonMon Jun 19, 8:09 PM ET
Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco on Monday said she would send National Guard troops and state police to New Orleans to fight rising violence after five teenagers were shot and killed.

The brutal pre-dawn shooting on Saturday was one of the most deadly attacks in the history of New Orleans and raised fear among residents that crime is returning before the city can completely recover from the devastation of Hurricane Katrina.

"The situation is urgent and we will accelerate our plans to deploy law enforcement to the city tomorrow," Blanco said in a statement after Mayor Ray Nagin and the city council called for reinforcements for city police.

"We will respond with personnel from the State Police and National Guard," she said, adding that 300 National Guard troops and 60 state police would start arriving on Tuesday.

The mayor and city council members held a special meeting on Monday morning in the wake of the shooting in the city which used to have one of the highest murder rates in the United States.

"We are not going ... to let hurricane crime replace Hurricane Katrina," City Council President Oliver Thomas said in televised remarks as mothers of victims of the Saturday shooting stood nearby. Nagin also said he would set a curfew for young people in the city.

The mayor and governor both said that before the shooting they had been working on a plan to reinforce the city.

New Orleans is still reeling from Katrina, which hit last August 29, and only about 220,000 people, or half the pre-storm population, have come back, leaving many neighborhoods dark and many returning citizens isolated.

HELP WELCOME

"I'm really frightened to come back here," said Iris Beck, cleaning out her house in the Sugar Hill section of town, which had flooded with a few feet of water after the storm. Most homes on the block still stand empty, spray-painted red crosses with the numbers 9 15 showing rescuers searched the neighborhood mid-September, or about two weeks after Katrina struck.

Beck called the National Guard proposal an "excellent idea" to respond to crime with discipline. "I'm going back to old school tactics, the way we were raised," she said, remembering stern elders who whipped children for disciplinary infractions but also gave them firm direction in life.

One or more assailants with semi-automatic handguns sprayed a sports utility vehicle shortly before dawn on Saturday, killing a 16-year-old, a 17-year-old and three 19-year-olds, said police, who found the vehicle slammed into a utility pole, surrounded by shell casings.

Four were dead on the spot and the fifth died shortly thereafter, raising the number of killings to 52 this year.

That is less than half the number a year ago, but the city's population is similarly low and killings have accelerated in the last two months, according to police statistics. Residents and local media frequently voice a fear that crime is accelerating.

New Orleans was once one of the most dangerous cities in the United States, but the level of violence dropped sharply in the wake of Katrina, which killed more than 1,500 and drove nearly the entire population from their homes.
 

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IMHO they're going to continue even with the guard on site three hundred to patrol how much distance. Don't see em as much of a deterrant but then again the citizens can't defend themselves. THE GOVERNMENT DISARMED THEM FOR THEIRE OWN SAFTY !!!sheesh:aargh4: :rant:
 

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Give it time. The NRA will be all over it. 5....4....3....2....
 

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I heard this story on the radio and thought, "out-law guns and this is what you get."

I tend to think that this country is a lot bigger than Nagan's little toilet hole (as he has turned it into.) There is just too much of the rest of this, "greatest country on the face of the planet," to make New-Orleans the template for the rest of us. (Not that the Libs wouldn't have it that way if they could. You can't control a population if you don't turn them into victims first.)

Anyhow, I'm thinking that this will eventually stand more as an example of what not to do, than the example of what to do. The American public will not accept national guard troops in our streets as the norm. There is just too many examples of communities where law abiding, armed citizens, cared for each other better than the guard can.

Maybe I'm just to optimistic, but I hope, and expect better from my countrymen in the long run.

My 2 cents.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Sheeple will accept nearly ANYTHING....

elkhunter said:
I heard this story on the radio and thought, "out-law guns and this is what you get." The American public will not accept national guard troops in our streets as the norm. There is just too many examples of communities where law abiding, armed citizens, cared for each other better than the guard can.

Maybe I'm just to optimistic, but I hope, and expect better from my countrymen in the long run.

My 2 cents.
You ARE an optimist. I think the sheep are getting desperate for some "comfort" and are willing to look anywhere but the RIGHT place (themselves) in order to find a little "peace & security." From sheep, I expect just about what N.O. got in the long run....zero. Not enough sheepdogs to fill the gaps....so far.

The real danger is not that the guard is in the streets....the danger is that the guard is in the streets absent martial law and they're NOT really trained to conduct LEO functions. Riot/mob control (the good old ROMP & STOMP) isn't the same thing. What they are demonstrably good at is conducting combat operations against an armed and determined enemy in an urban environment. Talk about militarizing the police!

I'm hoping that the NRA does get involved as soon as there are incidents of abuse (and it's coming sure as God made little green apples). A better use of this precious resource would be the valid militarization of the Southern Border and the armed incursions of the Mexican military escorting MS13 into our country.
 

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ssssthesnake said:
THE GOVERNMENT DISARMED THEM FOR THERE OWN SAFTY !!!sheesh:aargh4: :rant:
I'm from the Government and I'm here to help.
Can you touch your toes?
 

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Clearly a police issue, with no justification to mobilize the guard, but still it is a state issue, not the federal army. I hope someone with Louisiana/Federal constitutional expertise gets in the mix soon to stop the insanity. You're right, it sets a very bad precedent, and we all may regret it.
 

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Hey guys just think of them as chefs in cammo because after all summer is basically here and you can't bake a chocolate city without stirring in the chips can you ?
 

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I hope this does not get started. I am afraid that if one area starts to set a precedent then other area's around the U.S. may start to do the same thing and once it starts, it will be VERY hard to shut down. Just my 2 cents.
 

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Trying not to sound racist; this is what you get from trying making it a pure "chocolate town". Most of all the good people never came back. This is what happened to Gary Indiana when the evil white people were driven out. Not to mention that any racism (from either side) drives a wedge between people and tends to destabilize everything else. I still can't believe that they reelected that racists, self centered, military general Impersonator.:king: :hand5: :gah:
 

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Precedent is never welcome - however small or localized. :frown:
 

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I just want to see where all this "send in the national guard to disarm the bad guys" mentality might be leading.....
It's going to lead to the sheeple accepting that we "need" the military on the street to control crime.

In my paper this morning, the article mentioned that they were sending 100 NG troops with law enforcement backgrounds and 60 state troopers. At least they are starting with the right thought that the jobs (military and LE) are different; not that I think it should start at all.

I agree with the comments that it sets a bad precedent.
 

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Since it is the La. National Guard, rather than the regular army, this is a purely state matter and probably isn't illegal/unconstitutional.

That said, soldiers are not cops and should not be used as such. This is a disaster waiting to happen. The NG's job is NOT preventing drug fueled inner city violence. They are not trained, nor equipped to do the job. This is just another meaningless guesture by the ruling politicos down there who are desperately trying to hide their own impotence/incompetence.

All the best,


Joe
 

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Its just as legal as using the National Guard during the Civil Rights issues of the 60s . I just don't see what NG troops are going to be able to do in this situation ( unlike on the border which lends its self to a millitary patrol ) but wtf if a few guys can get their deployment in NO instead of Baghdad or Falloja I say more power to them.
 

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It's going to lead to the sheeple accepting that we "need" the military on the street to control crime
Its about desensitizing the population to "accept" Troops in the city.

Kinda like the frog in the boiling pot of water.

We missed a dang good opportunity to make good after Katrina hit. The smart thing to do would have been to let Mother Nature take it over and build somewhere else. Eventually, it would have been a great place to fish with all of the structure underwater...done properly it would have been a great shot in the arm for the tourist industry.

Instead, Blanco calls in the guard because she cant handle it. She aint capable of handling it, her "stellar" record on the matters of responsibility and taking charge speak for themself. This whole matter of New Orleans has been nothing but an opportunity to experiment ever since it started.

First, they illegaly confiscated guns...and got away with it.

Now, they are using armed troops as cops and those troops are set up to fail from the very get go. The National Guard is not trained to act as police. They will violate the rights of citzens simply because they know no better. They are trained to act as soldiers, not police.

The Governer is using the acts of a few gangbangers to justify mobilizing the Guard. Not only is it just plain wrong, but it is irresponsible and misguided, but that comes as no suprise to anyone that has watched her actions ...or rather inactions in the face of emergency.

The right response would be to give the troopers a bit more latitude in areas of crime...a "crackdown" of sorts. Find the gangbangers and take it to them. Put them in jail and throw away the key. If they offer armed resistance, shoot them and be done with it...fight fire with fire.

Instead,she call out the "Guard".:hand1:

Stay tuned....the experiment continues...:scruntiny:
 

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I think this will have a certain amount of "working out" to do. Maybe an "incident" or something worse (though I hope not.) But remember what happened in San Francisco? The gun ban was reversed!

It's the "pockets" of liberal rule that remind the rest of the country how bad it can be.

Kansas and Nebraska have just gone CCW.
Wisconsin is trying with narrow losses.

Frog in the pot? Maybe. But the pot is turning RED too, not Blue.

2 more of my "optimistic" cents. (I'm almost up to a nickel.)
 

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Seeing as how hundreds of NO cops left their post during the storm and I assume many of those positions haven't been replaced, I am not surprised.

$20 says the NG's guns are unloaded with an empty mag in place, just like during the storm.
 

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As a first step to UN intervention on US soil - I don't think so. The UN may want the authority to control US soil as a supra-government body, but there are enough people opposed to the violation of US sovereignty that I doubt it will happen.

As a first step toward imposing martial law at the drop of a hat in anti-gun cities - much more likely. This is the slippery slope in action. It was a no-brainer to bring in the NG and impose martial law during the disaster. How much easier it is, now, to call in the NG and impose martial law for lesser circumstances, particularly for weak leaders of dysfunctional governments.
 

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Fargo said:
Since it is the La. National Guard, rather than the regular army, this is a purely state matter and probably isn't illegal/unconstitutional.
We are in a grey area. NATIONAL guard use is hardly a STATE matter, IMO.

The only constitutional issues I see happening is if the NG soldiers enter a residence, then you will have 3rd Amendment issues to deal with. People thought that amendment would never be tested and is useless. Let's see how they think of that amendment when NG soldiers come barging in. As stated above, NG soldiers have no power of arrest, they are not law enforcement and then issues of 4th Amendment rights will come into play. The 4th Amendment applies only to LE and government agents. Seeing as how the NG is a government agency (technically) it can violate one's 4thA rights and also, as aforementioned, violate the 3rdA as they are soldiers. The finicky definition of the word "quartered" is left up to interpretation.

Furthermore, I think with the "conservatively stacked" SCOTUS, they will interpret as being in the victim's favor. Then again, with the induction of the DHS into the ranks of national security, I wouldn't be surprised if they held "quartered" as being consistent with the Webster's definition.

This will be interesting to say the least.
 
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