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I think if a good guy has made the poor choice to stand with a rioter destroying property and hurting people, whatever comes his way shouldn't be a surprise.
Respectfully, I was on the other side of this helping organize Lobby Day in January. We were all exercising our 1A rights to campaign for 2A. One of our biggest worries is that there might be bad actors among us who would start some mayhem, including shooting. Then we would have been in the position of people saying it was our choice to stand with people doing violence, so if we got hit in the crossfire, people might have said it shouldn't be a surprise and we deserved it.

I think most of these people are pure protesters and that is a treasured right in this country. I think the mayhem is done by a small percentage of bad actors. FWIW, there was violence here in Richmond last night. This morning, a bunch of peaceful protesters showed up to help business owners clean up their property that was destroyed by bad actors. One of them said, "We were here to protest only. We do not condone violence or destruction." So how do you hit a mixed group like that with "overwhelming force?"
 

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There's little room for moral relativism when it comes to rioting.

Last night, watching the DC riots, I saw a lot of lookie-loos among the rioters. The were out for thrill of watching and getting a crappy video on a smart phone, and probably outnumbered the rioters 10 - 1. I thought "What the heck are those idiots out on the streets for? They are just getting in the way of the police."

If you are in the middle of a riot just to watch, don't complain if the police mistake you for a rioter, especially if they mistake comes when you are breaking a lawfully imposed curfew.

My view is that anyone breaking curfew is a de facto rioter, as they are interfering with imposing law and order.

(I don't like curfews one bit, but here we have no choice but to impose them until order is restored).
 

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Respectfully, I was on the other side of this helping organize Lobby Day in January. We were all exercising our 1A rights to campaign for 2A. One of our biggest worries is that there might be bad actors among us who would start some mayhem, including shooting. Then we would have been in the position of people saying it was our choice to stand with people doing violence, so if we got hit in the crossfire, people might have said it shouldn't be a surprise and we deserved it.

I think most of these people are pure protesters and that is a treasured right in this country. I think the mayhem is done by a small percentage of bad actors. FWIW, there was violence here in Richmond last night. This morning, a bunch of peaceful protesters showed up to help business owners clean up their property that was destroyed by bad actors. One of them said, "We were here to protest only. We do not condone violence or destruction." So how do you hit a mixed group like that with "overwhelming force?"
Simple.

1) If a curfew is in effect, anyone breaking the curfew will be considered a rioter and subject to immediate arrest. Crowds after curfew refusing to disperse will be dispersed by use of non-lethal means, such as tear gas, and people among the crowd will be subject to arrest.

2) If before curfew, and looting and vandalizing starts, you must immediately clear the area so that law enforcement can engage the rioters. Failure to do so will result in you being subject to arrest for interfering with law enforcement.

Seems harsh, but we need to bring a hammer down on this. Not lethal force (unless lives are in danger of course), but enough to subdue law breakers and cause generally law abiding citizens to go home.
 

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Simple.

1) If a curfew is in effect, anyone breaking the curfew will be considered a rioter and subject to immediate arrest. Crowds after curfew refusing to disperse will be dispersed by use of non-lethal means, such as tear gas, and people among the crowd will be subject to arrest.

2) If before curfew, and looting and vandalizing starts, you must immediate clear the area so that law enforcement can engage the rioters. Failure to do so will result in you being subject to arrest for interfering with law enforcement.

Seems harsh, but we need to bring a hammer down on this. Not lethal force (unless lives are in danger of course), but enough to subdue law breakers and cause generally law abiding citizens to go home.
I’ll dissent on the non-lethal point. When 60+ secret service officers are injured its time to go lethal.
 

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How many of the DC rioters pushing against the Capitol police line would have backed off if a few heads had been cracked. The police have got to be able to use appropriate force. Charging a police line may not warrant gun fire, but the offenders should be stopped in their tracks.
 
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