Defensive Carry banner

1 - 20 of 38 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
265 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I work frequently in North Philadelphia. For those of you who don't know N. Philly is one of the worst areas in the US. I am a utility worker (fiber optic splicer) and am alone in these neighborhoods 99% of the time. Usually my day consists of the gang members and drug dealers accusing me of placing cameras on the poles to keep an eye on them, or of disconnecting there services (ie. Power, phone, cable TV) which I don't work for any of those utilities. I do get hassled a lot and have gotten pretty used to it. I really never thought to ask in a defense class what I'm to do if I ever do have to draw my weapon and take a life. Something tells me if I happen to successfully protect my life while taking the life of one of these "gangbangers" those wont be the last shots fired. I'm sure I would be out numbered quickly. And obviously I can't leave the scene. What would you di if this situation presented itself to you? I won't accept "find a new job, don't work in that area etc. This is my profession, I've been doing it for 17 years, and it's just the way it is. Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
384 Posts
Perhaps your handgun just needs to get you to the van/truck. There you could have a carbine, like a Keltec Sub 2000 that could even run off your handgun mags. The Sub 2000 folds up nicely, so you could stash it away pretty easily. There are large capacity mags available as well.

Kel Tec CNC
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,343 Posts
I'm surprised you haven't had to do anything thus far. I think it might be prudent to invest in a lapel cam or something to record any confrontations. After all it's not really the BGs you worry about but the cops and legal system indicting you, just saving your own life in a clear SD situation. If you have proof that you were stopping a real threat it could help you.

I'm not sure I follow you here - "...obviously I can't leave the scene". Have you talked to your manager about how to handle any confrontations in such a high crime area? I'd think he'd tell you to get out of there and maybe come back when things cool off, or even take a partner on the install.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,169 Posts
I would make sure to carry a few spare mags and keep the phone charged. A dash cam would not hurt.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
265 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
I'm surprised you haven't had to do anything thus far. I think it might be prudent to invest in a lapel cam or something to record any confrontations. After all it's not really the BGs you worry about but the cops and legal system indicting you, just saving your own life in a clear SD situation. If you have proof that you were stopping a real threat it could help you.

I'm not sure I follow you here - "...obviously I can't leave the scene". Have you talked to your manager about how to handle any confrontations in such a high crime area? I'd think he'd tell you to get out of there and maybe come back when things cool off, or even take a partner on the install.
As far as manager, I am the owner of the business. I have 4 other employees, only 1 that CC's (I've suggested to the others, and offered to pay for any defense classes they feel would be best to get them comfortable. Anyway I tell my guys to drive through the work zone first to eye up the situation. If they feel there is a potential threat, continue to drive right out. And then we'll usually go back with 5 trucks strobes and beacons going to really maintain a presence. But there are times when all appears quiet and then hell breaks loose. This is the scene I'm more thinking of.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BadgerJ

·
Registered
Joined
·
36,937 Posts
I know nothing about your company policies, your state laws, or any of your local ordinances, but if my personal safety called for me to exit the scene after a shooting, you can bet your sweet bippy I'm beating feet. I can settle up with the law and the lawyers once I'm safe.

And the world extends beyond N. Philly, by the way.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,153 Posts
You options are pretty clear. You will need to bring more to the fight than the Gangbangers bring. A rifle in the truck is a good Idea. Use the pistol to get back to it. You may or may not encounter more BGs. Generally they do not want to get shot, so if one goes down, maybe two, the fight may be off, however do not count on that.

In the context which you described, I would have a good fighting pistol, with at least 4 extra mags. In the truck I would have a AR with at least 4 mags. You should be able to stop any gang activity with that. As far as tactics are concerned. You will have to seek out some training in urban combat.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Wreckr

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,140 Posts
You've been doing it for 17 years and been fine. Another 17 and you'll probably be fine.

Keep carrying a gun but you probably don't need to tool up like Rambo.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,153 Posts
You've been doing it for 17 years and been fine. Another 17 and you'll probably be fine.

Keep carrying a gun but you probably don't need to tool up like Rambo.
Thats true, I might have gotten a little carried away, but he did ask....:wink:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
265 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
And the world extends beyond N. Philly, by the way.[/QUOTE]

Believe me Old Vet N. Philly is not the only area I service. But unfortunately it's one of them. The fiber Optic cable has to get into Center City Phila. some how. It just happens to be the route it takes. I'm trying to expand my business so that I will be fortunate enough to be able to work in a much more desirable place. As rammerjammer said I've been doing it for 17 years. I dont lose sleep over it, just looking to hear what others thought. That's all.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,343 Posts
As far as manager, I am the owner of the business. I have 4 other employees, only 1 that CC's (I've suggested to the others, and offered to pay for any defense classes they feel would be best to get them comfortable. Anyway I tell my guys to drive through the work zone first to eye up the situation. If they feel there is a potential threat, continue to drive right out. And then we'll usually go back with 5 trucks strobes and beacons going to really maintain a presence. But there are times when all appears quiet and then hell breaks loose. This is the scene I'm more thinking of.
Well good to know you're handling it cautiously and with a show of numbers. I would strongly suggest you do not go the route suggested of having a rifle in the truck. This looks as though you are prepped for a fight and not just SD. If it got out that you were doing this it would be very bad publicity and if someone broke into the truck, they'd then have a rifle.

Otherwise I like your plan. Stay safe.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,338 Posts
Take a look at CZ duty p9 it carries 19 plus one in chamber might have a hard time finding one seem to be out all over but 40 rds in two mags sounds good
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,306 Posts
I'm surprised you haven't had to do anything thus far. I think it might be prudent to invest in a lapel cam or something to record any confrontations. After all it's not really the BGs you worry about but the cops and legal system indicting you, just saving your own life in a clear SD situation. If you have proof that you were stopping a real threat it could help you.

I'm not sure I follow you here - "...obviously I can't leave the scene". Have you talked to your manager about how to handle any confrontations in such a high crime area? I'd think he'd tell you to get out of there and maybe come back when things cool off, or even take a partner on the install.


Do you really believe a working man would have a difficult time with the criminal justice system ? More than likely if one had to draw a handgun for self defense, there would be more than one gun present, and it's likely the lone worker would probably die next to his tools used for cable splicing. Gang banger carry guns for a living !! BUT, in the hopes he was able to get back into his van/truck he should get out of there and call police from another, safer location.

Does anyone really believe the police are going to believe a bunch of gang bangers, or better yet, do you really believe a bunch of gang bangers are going to be waiting around to talk to police ? The worker can return to the scene with police and explain how a shooting went down. It is not requisite a shooter remain at a shooting scene if it is not safe to do so. It wouldn't be the first time officers had to go to a scene from a point meeting a compalinant.

This from investigating hundreds of murders and shootings scene.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,304 Posts
It is not requisite a shooter remain at a shooting scene if it is not safe to do so.
This was my thought too. Getting to safety is the absolute number one priority. In the immediacy that undoubtedly means your vehicle. As soon as possible, call 911. Keep your SA up, remain on the line with the 911 dispatcher and if at any time you sense a threat coming, leave the area and tell the dispatcher what you are doing and why. They should be able to help co-ordinate a location for you to rendezvous with the police.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,740 Posts
I dont know what your carry gun is, but my choice would be at least a G26 with 17 round mags for reloads. And a nice Mossberg Shotty in the truck.
They dont call a shotgun "street sweeper" for nothing.

But, on top of all that, just be nice to them when they come around. Most are ignorant as hell, and if they are convinced that you are not there to mess with them, all the better.
You could say something like " hell no Im not hooking up police cameras, I cant stand the police". Or any creative thing you can think of to put them at ease.

Re direct their attitudes and natural animosity and territorial suspicion.

Be nice, until its time not to be. The biggest factor in avoiding confrontation and attack is understanding thug thinking.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
265 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
I dont know what your carry gun is, but my choice would be at least a G26 with 17 round mags for reloads. And a nice Mossberg Shotty in the truck.
They dont call a shotgun "street sweeper" for nothing.

But, on top of all that, just be nice to them when they come around. Most are ignorant as hell, and if they are convinced that you are not there to mess with them, all the better.
You could say something like " hell no Im not hooking up police cameras, I cant stand the police". Or any creative thing you can think of to put them at ease.

Re direct their attitudes and natural animosity and territorial suspicion.

Be nice, until its time not to be.
My EDC is an S&W m&p 9c 12+1 with 2 xtra mags, and a Benchmade in my weak side pocket. And a S&W 1911- 7+1 holstered to the drivers seat with a spare mag. Also I do the splicing in the back of my van so I keep a Kel-tec strapped back there. I do have my eye on a purrty 10mm Glock that will rotate with the 1911
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
13,164 Posts
I work frequently in North Philadelphia. For those of you who don't know N. Philly is one of the worst areas in the US. I am a utility worker (fiber optic splicer) and am alone in these neighborhoods 99% of the time. Usually my day consists of the gang members and drug dealers accusing me of placing cameras on the poles to keep an eye on them, or of disconnecting there services (ie. Power, phone, cable TV) which I don't work for any of those utilities. I do get hassled a lot and have gotten pretty used to it. I really never thought to ask in a defense class what I'm to do if I ever do have to draw my weapon and take a life. Something tells me if I happen to successfully protect my life while taking the life of one of these "gangbangers" those wont be the last shots fired. I'm sure I would be out numbered quickly. And obviously I can't leave the scene. What would you di if this situation presented itself to you? I won't accept "find a new job, don't work in that area etc. This is my profession, I've been doing it for 17 years, and it's just the way it is. Thanks
Your post reminds me of a comment made to me by a heating oil dealer when he went to my son's home near the South edge of Center City; near Christian.

He took one look at me and let out a deep breath. Then he said, "I usually have to tell dispatch to call the cops if they don't hear from me in
10 minutes."

Maybe a similar approach is needed for you. I assume you are in constant communication with your company. Could you use some pre-arranged
word, or time limit, or both @ which they will call the cops.

And, at least it sounds as if you are allowed to be armed. OTOH, it being Philly, you'd probably face charges and a long tough legal slog if you
used your gun.

There is no answer to your problem. Some jobs are just plain dangerous. Hope the pay makes it worthwhile.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
13,164 Posts
My EDC is an S&W m&p 9c 12+1 with 2 xtra mags, and a Benchmade in my weak side pocket. And a S&W 1911- 7+1 holstered to the drivers seat with a spare mag. Also I do the splicing in the back of my van so I keep a Kel-tec strapped back there. I do have my eye on a purrty 10mm Glock that will rotate with the 1911
Keltec or LCP in one of your pockets as well. I don't like the idea of leaving either of the other two in your van. The filth might get to it before you do. If you must leave a couple in your van, make darn sure they are out of sight; especially the one holstered to the driver's seat. And make sure
you can see what is going on near the van and who is near it at all times.

Bright side. You have been doing the job for 17 years and you are still here to tell about it. A lot of Phily has improved in the last decade-15 years.
Its got its charms too. Good luck.
 
  • Like
Reactions: G-man*

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
13,164 Posts
Well good to know you're handling it cautiously and with a show of numbers. I would strongly suggest you do not go the route suggested of having a rifle in the truck. This looks as though you are prepped for a fight and not just SD. If it got out that you were doing this it would be very bad publicity and if someone broke into the truck, they'd then have a rifle.

Otherwise I like your plan. Stay safe.
And this might also apply to having as many weapons as you have described. It can be misconstrued. OTOH, better misconstrued and alive.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
111 Posts
You have lots of guns. My opinion sell some, keep the keltec. Get a glock 19 or a 27. Whichever caliber matches your keltec. That way all your mags are interchangeable. When they are shooting at you any mag will work in any gun. Also get plus 6 mag extensions for every mag they are cheap, glockstore.com sells them. Keep a high capacity mag in the kel tec to start. That way you can focus on defense not mag matching
 
1 - 20 of 38 Posts
Top