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After reading many books, watching the news, and seeing some debates It suddenly seemed to me that gun control (from the top at least) could be just social class warfare issue. Here are some items that lead to my suspicions.

Sara Brady: making a straw purchase for her son.
Rosie Odonnell: Has here children escorted to school by armed guards.
George Soros: Funding the U.N. global gun ban.

After reading The Samurai, The Mountie, The Cowboy by David B. Kopel I became more convinced. Countries like Britain, Japan, and others see their populace as subjects and therefore do not have rights like the U.S. They are ruled by an entirely different class and tend to be less confrontational then Americans. It always seems that the "grass roots" Anti-gun campaigns are organized by at least somewhat affluent people. Is there any record of A grass root effort by a "normal Joe"? It would only seem natural the the super upper class would eventually fear the uncontrolled rabble. The strictest gun control happens in the largest cities. This could be a factor of so many people living so close together or it could be a factor of the higher wealth accumulated in large cities.

This seems to me to be a strong indicator of a class bias. I myself could be biased by reading so much "pro" literature. I just wanted to here some other views on this subject (pro and con).
 

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You propose an interisting point of view. The haves are always afraid that the have nots will take what they have and therefore their positional authority. In this way you may just be right. :buttkick:
 

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I do think you will find way more anti's in the more affluent groups.

They tend to look down on what they see as inferior beings - not trusting them and probably too begrudging them their rights. That said however - they usually see their own rights as sacrosanct - and seem to separate them from ours.

Overall tho it is, as we so often say, mostly about control - subjugation even if you will. They are scared by the ''masses''
 

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You must remember that the Rich and Powerful, the Intelligenca, and the National News Media belive that they are destined to rule the People of the United States and the World. These people have agendas that will benifit themselves and will create hardships for the average working families of this country. The number one thing that stands between them and the fulfilment of their dreams is the Second Admendment of the US Constitution. They have learned that citizens armed with Semi Automatic Firearms have the ability to ensure their own domestic tranquality. They know that a .50 Caliber Browning Machinegun Round will pierce their armored Limousines and have ranges that do not afford the Rich and Powerful reasonable safety. It is not Gun Control that the Rich and Powerful, the Intelligenca and the National New Media Elites worry about, its the Control of the American Citizen that they are most intrested in. Its about ensuring their Rulership over the Families of this Country. Its about the Control of the Economic and Politics of the World.

As they say, "Its good to be the King".

How many times have I heard folks say, "When you come for my guns, bring yours, you'll need them".

Me, I tell the ones whose job it will be to breach the walls of the US Constitution, "Don't worry about coming to my house to see me about confiscating my firearms. When that day comes, I'll be at your house, bright and early to see you".

Only a fool would let them Waco his family.

Jungle Work
 

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Good thoughts.

I've heard the banning of "Saturday night specials" referred to as racist in the past. It usually happens in the bigger cities and banning affordable self defense guns generally affects the "lower" and "oppressed" classes.

You're right, this stuff is funded mainly by the rich who themselves own or hire a gun (Rosie, Boxer, and all the other icky names I can't bring myself to type). For some reason it's OK for them, but not for the working class. Hmmm.
 

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That's a credible viewpoint, but I wonder, if the elite have so much power, how is it that we've made incredible advances (IMO) with concealed carry and Castle Doctrines in the last several years?
 

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how is it that we've made incredible advances (IMO) with concealed carry and Castle Doctrines in the last several years?
The advances I agree with but ''they'' do not IMO have power sufficient to make major changes fast and so things seem just fine.

They do however have lobbying abilities and funds to match - with which they will continue to try and erode our constitutional rights. Nothing sudden and dramatic - just the dripping faucet - insidious - of which we must be constantly aware.
 

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P95Carry said:
They tend to look down on what they see as inferior beings - not trusting them and probably too begrudging them their rights. That said however - they usually see their own rights as sacrosanct - and seem to separate them from ours.
The typical "intellectual superiority" this group self-perceives.......:gah:


P95Carry said:
They do however have lobbying abilities and funds to match - with which they will continue to try and erode our constitutional rights. Nothing sudden and dramatic - just the dripping faucet - insidious - of which we must be constantly aware.
This is the real risk - and why gun owners of all persuasions need to be politically involved - personally and financially.
 

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That's a credible viewpoint, but I wonder, if the elite have so much power, how is it that we've made incredible advances (IMO) with concealed carry and Castle Doctrines in the last several years?
Lets not forget that requiring a permit to excercise something that is specificaly stated in the U.S. Constitution is not exactly reason to celebrate.

In the next big crisis, whether fabricated or not, could see all carry "permits" being abolished as a condition of martial law. In that case mere ownership of a gun could result in a summary prison sentance.

Dont think it could happen here ? Educate yourselves on FEMA doctrine and find out.
 

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but I wonder, if the elite have so much power, how is it that we've made incredible advances (IMO) with concealed carry and Castle Doctrines in the last several years?
Excellent Question,
Its my belief that Gun Control was shoved down the throats of the Common Man and Woman by the Elitest for about 40 years. I also remember the "Saturday Night Specials" of the 50s and 60s. They were first described as Cheap, Poorly Made, Small, Concealable Pistols that were as much a danger to the user and the useee. After about five or six years of that crap the definition was changed by the Gun Controllers to just the Small, Concealable Pistols. And they started making runs at J Frame Smith, The Dick Specials made by colt and the smaller Semi Auto.

By the last decade of the Twentith Centuary the Average Man and Woman had a gut full of being the Unarmed Victim of the Savages and seeing the Rich and Powerful and the Elites of our society able to obtain Carry Permits, where they could not. Too the citizens of today are not the go along to get along of past generations. They don't mind organizing and turning on the Oven of the Politicians and turning up the heat.

The Major Gun Control or Pro Gun Acts since 1791:

1791 Second Amendment Ratified
It states, "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

1871 National Rifle Association Founded
Union soldiers Col. William C. Church and Gen. George Wingate found the NRA to "promote and encourage rifle shooting on a scientific basis." Civil War Gen. Ambrose Burnside, who was also the former governor of Rhode Island and a U.S. Senator, serves as the organization's first president.

1934 National Firearms Act
Brought about by the lawlessness and rise of gangster culture during prohibition, President Franklin D. Roosevelt hoped this act would eliminate automatic-fire weapons like machine guns from America's streets. Other firearms such as short-barreled shotguns and rifles, parts of guns like silencers, as well as other "gadget-type" firearms hidden in canes and such were also targeted. All gun sales and gun manufacturers were slapped with a $200 tax (no small amount for Americans mired in the Great Depression; that would be like a tax of $2,525 today) on each firearm, and all buyers were required to fill out paperwork subject to Treasury Dept. approval.

1938 Federal Firearms Act
Congress aimed this law at those involved in selling and shipping firearms through interstate or foreign commerce channels. Anyone involved in the selling of firearms was required to obtain a Federal Firearms License from the Secretary of Commerce ($1 annual fee). They were also required to record the names and addresses of everyone they sold guns to and were prohibited from selling to those people who were convicted of certain crimes or lacked a permit.

1968 Gun Control Act
The assassination of John F. Kennedy, who was killed by a mail-order gun that belonged to Lee Harvey Oswald, inspired this major revision to federal gun laws. The subsequent assasinations of Martin Luther King and presidential candidate Robert Kennedy fueled its quick passage. License requirements were expanded to include more dealers, and more detailed record keeping was expected of them; handgun sales over state lines were restricted; the list of persons dealers could not sell to grew to include those convicted of felonies (with some exceptions), those found mentally incompetent, drug users and more. The act also defined persons who were banned from possessing firearms.

The key element of this bill outlawed mail order sales of rifles and shotguns; Up until this law, mail order consumers only had to sign a statement that they were over 21 years of age for a handgun (18 for rifle or shotgun); it also detailed more persons who were banned from possessing certain guns, including drug users, and further restricted shotgun and rifles sales.

1972 Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms created
Enforcement of the Gun Control Act was given to the Dept. of the Treasury's Alcohol and Tobacco Tax Division of the Internal Revenue Service. The organization replaced "tax" with "firearms," nearly doubled in size, and became the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms (ATF).

1986 Law Enforcement Officers Protection Act
Made it illegal for anyone to manufacture or import armor piercing ammunition, or "cop-killer bullets," which are capable of penetrating bulletproof clothing.
Firearms Owners' Protection Act
Eased restrictions on gun sellers and the sale of some guns. Imposed additional penalties for persons using a firearm during certain crimes and persons with robbery or burglary convictions who are illegally shipping guns.

1990 Crime Control Act
Directed the attorney general to develop a strategy for establishing "drug-free school zones," including criminal penalties for possessing or discharging a firearm in a school zone. Outlawed the assembly of illegal semiautomatic rifles or shotguns from legally imported parts.

1994 Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act
Imposed, on an interim basis, a five-day waiting period and background check before a licensed gun importer, manufacturer or dealer can sell or deliver a handgun to an unlicensed individual.

Required a new National Instant Criminal Background Check System, run by the FBI, be ready to replace the waiting period by Nov. 30, 1998. The new background check system will apply to all firearms and will allow checks to be done over the phone or electronically with results returned immediately in most cases.

Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act
Commonly referred to as the "Assault Weapons Ban," this bill banned the manufacture, possession, and importation of new semiautomatic assault weapons and large-capacity ammunition feeding devices (or magazines) for civilian use.

Criteria for semiautomatic assault weapons that fall under the ban are provided as well as a list of 19 specific firearms.

Prohibits juveniles from possessing or selling handguns and directs the attorney general to evaluate proposed and existing state juvenile gun laws.

The Assault Weapons Ban, we all know about this piece of fluf legislation pushed through by Willy Jeff Clinton and the DemoMarxist on Capital Hill. It defined five "Evil" Features on the semi auto rifles and the Gun Makers just laughed at the Politicians, changed those guns to have fewer of the Evil Features and volia, Semi Auto that were almost identical to the originals. The Gun Control Groups, the Gun Control Politicians were outraged. They said the Gun Manufactors were violating "The Spirit of the Law" on the Assault Weapons Ban.

2004: On September 14 the Assault Weapons Ban Sunseted. The DemoMarxist and the Gun Controlers were livid. They Claimed Blood would run in the streets. Didn't happen.

Now most states have a Concealed Weapons Law, the Citizens put it to the Liberal DemoMarxist Politicians over these laws. In Agust of

Now it looks like the DemoMarxist and Liberal Politicians will, more than likely gain Control of the US House and Senate and probably win the office of POTUS. There is no doubt that they will attemp to pass legislation that will ban the possession of Assault Weapons, Pistols and High Cap Magazines. It is yet to be seen whether this will be allowed to happen by the Gun Owners in this Country. Since the gun owers of this country now know that the aim of the DemoMarxist and the Liberal Politician Gun Controlers is not to control crime, but to Control the PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES, I believe that this might be the spark that set off the Second Civil War of the United States and after it is over, the break up of the Union into States of Like Minded Citizens.

Jungle Work
 

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Good post Jungle Work.

Since the gun owers of this country now know that the aim of the DemoMarxist and the Liberal Politician Gun Controlers is not to control crime, but to Control the PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES, I believe that this might be the spark that set off the Second Civil War of the United States and after it is over, the break up of the Union into States of Like Minded Citizens.
I hope you that are wrong, but I fear that you are not.
 

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Jungle Work and HotGuns

God knows how I wish you were wrong. But I fear greatly that you are not!
 

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Interesting.
I believe a big part of gun control is historically to keep blacks from having guns, particularly in the south.
Gun control has a history almost as strange as the Jim Crow laws.
God Bless
 

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There is no doubt that GC is class warfare- straight from the parody of Marxist-Leninist heritage: "All are equal; some are more equal than others.....".

To combat this:

1) Nationalist, anti-Globalist movement.
2) Severe tax penalties for corporations of American origination "outsourcing" more than 5% of core/support services.
3) Reciprocal trade laws; ie, Japan allows 10,000 US-made autos in, per annum, with a 40% tarriff, we reflect their policies.
4) Civil liberties/social services do not apply to non-citizens. Period.
5) Voter validation. Drivers license and SS card required to vote.
6) English as the National Language.

If one feels any or all of these to be discriminatory/racist, I would commend Gibbon's Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire to their immediate attention. A Constitutional Republic cannot survive globalistic inclusivism. If the Dark Ages sound like a period of history that was fun to live in, we should certainly continue as we have been.........:tired:
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Wow I thought I might get flamed on this one but it seems that once again I'm in good company. The point of my argument was to find the common denominator for the anti movement. The ones at the top know better but the sheeple still follow them. This dose seem to tie together the Hollywood, political, media, and billionaire types in to one agenda. They don't want to just take guns they want your freedom and independence too. That was one of the conclusions to Kople's book; the more freedom people have the greater the occurrence of crime. So what do we do become a fascist state to eliminate crime? Great freedom comes with even greater responsibility. BTW Kople's book did point out gun control was started along with drug control to keep African Americans under control. In other countries it was the fear of the anarchists and bolshivics ruining the corporate economy.
 

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Keep in mind what some ANTIs have said....

An article in Virginia's official university law review called for a "prohibitive tax... on the privilege" of selling handguns as a way of disarming "the son of Ham", whose "cowardly practice of `toting' guns has been one of the most fruitful sources of crime... Let a negro board a railroad train with a quart of mean whiskey and a pistol in his grip and the chances are that there will be a murder, or at least a row, before he alights." -Comment, Carrying Concealed Weapons, 15 Va L. Reg. 391, 391-92 (1909), George Mason University Civil Rights Law Journal, Vol. 2, No. 1, "Gun Control and Racism," Stefan Tahmassebi, 1991, p. 75]

"We must stop thinking of the individual and start thinking about what is best for society." -Hillary Clinton, 1993

"Germans who wish to use firearms should join the SS or the SA — ordinary citizens don't need guns, as their having guns doesn't serve the State." -Heinrich Himmler

"Our ultimate goal — total control of handguns in the United States — is going to take time. My estimate is from seven to ten years. The problem is to slow down the increasing number of handguns sold in this country. The second problem is to get them all registered. And the final problem is to make the possession of all handguns and all handgun ammunition — except for the military, policemen, licensed security guards, licensed sporting clubs, and licensed gun collectors — totally illegal." -Pete Shields, Chairman and founder, Handgun Control Inc., "A Reporter At Large: Handguns," The New Yorker, July 26, 1976, 57-58

"Yes, I'm for an outright ban [on handguns]." -Pete Shields, Chairman emeritus, Handgun Control, Inc., 60 Minutes interview

"I honestly think — and I am not an expert on the amendments — I think the only people in this nation who should be allowed to own guns are police officers. I don't care if you want to hunt, I don't care if you think it's your right. I say, 'Sorry. It is 1999, we have had enough as a nation. You are not allowed to own a gun and if you do own a gun, I think you should go to prison.'" -Rosie O'Donnell, April 21, 1999

"[The United States] can't be so fixed on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans..." - President Bill Clinton March 1, 1993 during a press conference in Piscataway, NJ.

"Proposing an amendment to the Constitution of the United States repealing the Second Amendment to the Constitution." - H.J. Res. 81, Jan.27, 1993.

AND from that glittering jewel of colossal ignorance, Dianne Feinstein...
(notice the last paragraph, where it is OK for HER to have a concealed weapon, to bad about the rest of us serfs.)


"If I could have gotten 51 votes in the Senate of the United States for an outright ban, picking up every one of them... "Mr. and Mrs. America, turn 'em all in," I would have done it. I could not do that. The votes weren't here." -U.S. Senator Dianne Feinstein, CBS-TV's "60 Minutes," February 5, 1995, speaking about her authorship of the 1994 "assault weapons" ban

"Banning guns addresses a fundamental right of Americans to feel safe." -U.S. Senator Dianne Feinstein, quoted by the Associated Press, November 18, 1993

"Because less than twenty years ago I was the target of a terrorist group. It was the New World Liberation Front. They blew up power stations and put a bomb at my home when my husband was dying of cancer. And the bomb didn't detonate. ... I was very lucky. But, I thought of what might have happened. Later the same group shot out all the windows of my home" "And, I know the sense of helplessness that people feel. I know the urge to arm yourself because that's what I did. I was trained in firearms. I'd walk to the hospital when my husband was sick. I carried a concealed weapon. I made the determination that if somebody was going to try to take me out, I was going to take them with me." -U.S. Senator Dianne Feinstein, Democrat from California
 

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My feeling is that some gun control is a class tool but gun bans and overly restricting carry is not.

The affluent are outnumber by the "lower classes" so they want to even the odds by making sure they have access to guns while making it more difficult for those "less desirable" to have access to them.

Barriers to entry rather than bans. Restrict full-auto ownership so it costs a 5 figure sum to buy a full-auto weapon, check people background to make sure they are the "right kind" of person before issuing CCW permit etc.

At the end of the day the rich know that criminals will always be able to get cheap illegal guns, they would be crazy to restrict gun ownership too much as that would leave them defenceless.
 
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