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Discussion Starter #1
Guys, your thoughts on this one.

I am on the fence between the Keltec and the Kahr. Any thoughts to sway my decision ? I am not worried about the price difference. Small investment for peace of mind.

I plan on using it as an 'always' in a pocket rig. I'll be stepping up from my .380 AMT backup that I have carried daily for 10 years. Both the P11 and PM9 are only fractions of an inch larger and I will feel a lot better stepping up to a 9mm round.

Suggestions ?
 

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Both Kel-Tec and Kahr make good weapons. Having said that there are things that need to be considered in each. Kahrs need a good breakin. Manufacturer recommend at least 200 rounds. In the Kel-Tec the trigger is unusually long for some. In the ones I have fired the trigger gets to a certain point and then seems to break, but the pistol does not fire. You have to continue to pull past this seeming break to fire the pistol. I have never been able to get used to it.

I guess my best suggestion would be to fire both if possible and see which one works best for you.
 

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My advise is to at least handle both and shoot both if possible . I own two Kahrs ( pm9 and p9) and love them , they are truly a leap above the kel-tech line as far as the finer points of quality goes . Kahrs come from the factory tight and Kahr recommends a 200 round break in period .
Personally I belive in the case of the pm9 this is to break inn the shooter more than the pistol . The pm9 is right on the edge of the envelope that you can stuff a full house 9 mm into and as such it is extremely unforgiving of shooter error ( weak wristing, improper or loose grip , ect.. ) I understand that rorbaghs are the same. So summing it up the Kahr is closer to the size you are used to and certainly better quality .... IF you will commit to properly griping the little beast you should have no problem with it . I really cant speak to the Kel-tech 9 other than what I have read , it seems to be light , has more capacity , is reliable after a fluff and buff , and a lot of people just cannot manage the trigger characteristics .

Its not that I don't like kel-techs heck I carry a p3at as an always gun and am looking forward to their pf9 that supposedly will hit the market in aug. now it may give the kahr some competition since they redesigned the trigger for it , and it is thinner than any double stack . time will tell .

For me , and for now its not even a competition tho the kahr wins hands down over the p11.
 

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both are great guns. i have a p11 and love it. never had a kahr, but have played with one. you can not go wrong with either gun. but the p11 is lower in price. you could buy the p11 and with the rest of the money buy lots of ammo and a good holster. or just go with the kahr. either way both are good guns. kel-tec is coming out with a smaller 9mm this summer. take a look at it.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Well I didn't realize new Kahrs were quite so expensive, but I have turned up a used PM9 for $400. That I can live with. This weekend I'll start the shopping and handle them both- but I gotta say the Kahr looks good.

The higher capacity of the Kel-Tec is tempting, but in 12 years of carry I have fired a whopping 3 rounds.
 

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Unlike Frankmako, I have a much different opinion of the Kel-tec P11- IMHO, it should be a PS 11, as in "Piece of @#$%". I bought it as a pocket gun. I figured that it would be easier to carry than my Glock 26 in a front pocket. I had read numerous favorable reviews, so I went ahead and bought the gun. It was mentioned that the trigger pull was long. That's an understatement. To me, it feels like it starts in Vegas, and breaks about Cleveland. The trigger pull is also pretty hard (you can get a better trigger done). My biggest complaint is that it jams. Now, I'm fairly new to auto pistols, having bought my first last August. That said, I now have 5. All of the others- my Beretta FS92, my Glock 19 & 26, and my new XD45 have all functioned perfectly out of the box. The P11 was misfeeding, jamming, stove piping, etc. It jammed so badly that I couldn't clear it. I ended up taking it to a gunsmith. I did get a "fluff and buff" while it was there, which did, I must admit improve things. But overall, I just did not find it to be reliable. When I buy a TV, I expect it to work out of the box. I shouldn't have to take it to the shop, and pay more, just to have it do it's basic function. Also, the gun rubs a blister on your trigger finger after shooting a magazine or so. I had to wear Band-aids on my fingers when I qualified with it. It's just not a fun gun to shoot, and it just sits in my safe. I found that with the Nemesis pocket holder, my Glock 26 actually works fine with front pocket carry. So, when I can't wear a cover garment, I carry the 26. I may use the P11 for a BUG, but that's it. If the gun shop would give me more than 50% of the purchase price, I'd sell it back in a heartbeat. I haven't tried the Kahr, but I would pick the Kahr.In the end, it boils down to you get what you pay for.
 

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I just went through the same problem - which to buy KEL-TEC P11 or KAHR?

I bought a Kahr CW9. Now I carry it loaded with Corbon DPX 115 gr +P and am a happy camper. The Kahr handles about any ammo (infact, no FTF or FTE ever). I use the DeSantis Nemesis holster http://www.desantisholster.com/n38.html to pocket carry the weapon. My CW9 has a trigger pull of 5.5 pounds measured on a guage. Weighs ABOUT 21 oz fully loaded. The pistol is very accurate, shooting to point of aim. Down side is cost of extra mags. I managed to get mine at dealer cost. That was part of the agreement for the cost of the pistol.

Reason I did not select the P-11 was the trigger. The trigger pull is very heavy and so loooooong. I could not believe the trigger. I did not even fire the pistol due to the trigger, so I can't make an statement as to how it shoots.

Good luck on your choice.

Mark
 

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Good price on that used Kahr....you are talking about a $100 difference when all said and done. Kahr is a whole lot more gun for the money and more accurate/reliable in my opinion. You can always buy a kel tec later if you find that you need a lighter BUG. But the Kahr surely makes a better primary fo carry.
 

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My dad has a p11 and brought it out to shoot a while ago.
I HATED IT!. He left it with me to shoot if i wanted. i kept it but with NO intention of ever shooitng it.
way too long of a trigger pull and as was stated earlier, it breaks but then ya still got another 1/2" of pull...very deceiving and what i consider to be terribly designed in my opinion. others may have adjusted to it but i couldn't. no way.
the gun is light, compact and not overly ugly just that terribly long double action trigger- yuck.
I've never shot aKahr but, in my opinion, would not recommend the p11.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Well I found a LOT of used Kahrs and could barely make up my mind.

I picked up a P9, matte stainless silde over a polymer frame. Used, but not used much (more on that later) for $400.

Got to the range, and this was the biggest piece of crap I have ever seen. After every round, the slide would stay back. The slide stop would engage the slide.... GRRRR!! Checked that my thumbs were clear of the slide stop, didn't help. Gripped tighter, no luck. Gripped looser, no help. Removed the mag to shoot one at a time, and the slide STILL held open!!

I had to tweak the stupid slide stop spring. It's unique to the P-series and it's a tiny little thing. Not the best solution, but after a little bendin' and a cussin' it ran fine for another 50 rounds. I stopped only because the sun went down, still had another 300 rounds!

Runs great now, but I still want to feed it lots more and try a few different types of ammo.

:banana:

mstarm, thanks for the link to desantis. A holster will be the next requirement!
 

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Congratulations on the new shooter. Since you said it didn't look to be shot much, it may still be in that "break-in" period. I agree no gun should need one out of the box but some obviously do. Glad you seem to have gotten it running well, hopefully it'll stay that way. Gotta admit, the Kahr I handled recently really impressed me, might very well have to add one to my carry routine.
Jack
 

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LOL slide stop spring goes ON TOP of the slide stop , its a common re assembly mistake to get it on the bottom of the slide stop , and that little trick makes a kahr an excellent single shot
 

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I have the Kel-tec P11. And I carry it everyday all day. I shoot it once a week on wednesday. I put about 50 rounds each thru it. No problems.
I had it for two years now. Hope I never have to use it, but I know it there and it will go BANG.
 

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I posted before my opinion about keltecs. A friend of mine bought one and after a couple of weeks it was all rusted. I don't own a Kahr but as far as corrotion resistance, they are a lot better.
 
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