[Kid1911]

I am looking to purchase another 1911 as a ccw within the next month or so. I am looking to purchase a 4" 1911 and have narrowed it down to 2 different models. The first is a parked Kimber Pro Carry II, the other is a Springfield Champion also parked.
I am looking for any info on these susch as perfomance, reliablity etc from members who currently carry or have carried these as a ccw.
The only draw back I have noticed is with the Spinger, it has an ambi safety and I have a concern about it cathing on cover clothing.
I really like both of these pistols and would buy them both if I could.

 

[Bud White]

Ambi safety is a must for me course im left handed .

I prefer Springfields over kimbers ive never had a problem with one but have a few friends that have had them with kimbers

As to the 4" Model either one should really be good pick the one you like best
Both are bull barreled i think (cant rember for sure just got up ) That is only thing i really dislike i prefer a bushing barrel but have been told before it really doesnt matter

 

[rfurtkamp]

Based on reliability issues on the ones that have been sold at the shop, I personally own a Springfield over the Kimber, even though I could have gotten a few 'refurbs' at substantially less than book value or wholesale cost over the years.

 

[rocky]

I have only put 100 rnds thru my SA champion as of yet. But their warranty and reputation for service sold me on a SA over a Kimber. Also I like the 1 pc. feed ramp over the 2 pc. Just my personal feeling, but I think it might cycle HP's better.

 

[Bud White]

also for got to add lifetime warrenty for springer 1 year mimber

 

[buzzg]

I have one of each. I have NEVER had a stoppage, failure to feed or any other malfunction with the Kimber with any type of ammo. The Springer however, is "fussy" about ammo. Federal FMJ does not feed well in this gun. Averages maybe 2-3 fail to feed out of 40 rnds. Speer Gold Dot will occasionally fail to chamber properly as will Remington JHP ammo. Most other good quality factory ammo seems OK. I've put maybe 1,000+ rounds through both guns and the Kimber shoots everything without fail. I like them both, wouldn't trade or sell either one, but in the dark, in a hurry, I'd reach for the Kimber.

 

[ExSoldier]

Interesting

Based on reliability issues on the ones that have been sold at the shop, I personally own a Springfield over the Kimber, even though I could have gotten a few 'refurbs' at substantially less than book value or wholesale cost over the years.

In my personal experiences with Springfield, I have found the reverse to be true. Also I find that there seems to be an inherent flaw with Sprindfield extractors. It seems to me that more often than not, when a Springfield has a problem it's because there is not enough "mass" to the extractor. I have seen them shaved down at an angle so that they barely grasp the rim of the cartridge case at all. Maybe enough to pass a QC evaluation at the factory, but not enough to withstand protracted use. That's been my experience and my observations. Maybe that's also an anomaly.....THAT'S possible and since it happened to ME, it's left a bad taste in my mouth for Springfields.

 

[Bud White]

Springfield did have a bad run of extractors that were under cut and there was a bunch of them So yeah that would be a problem but seems they have got that fixed

 

[P95Carry]

Speaking not as an afficionado of 1911's - I have become a bit leary of Kimbers, as I seem to hear too many bad things these days. On balance I would go to a Springer.

Aquaintance of mine has a Wilson Combat which seems one heck of a fine gun.

 

[ExSoldier]

Aquaintance of mine has a Wilson Combat which seems one heck of a fine gun.

I first heard about NightHawk Custom on this board. Since then they have impressed the world....I just read a glowing tribute in GUNS magazine. I would go with one of theirs I think.

 

[Optr23]

I have bought a SA Micro Compact within the last year and I did encounter FTF JHP's in the weapon.
Yes, I was disappointed but I sent it back and 4 weeks later I have a perfect functioning 45. It should have been perfect out of the box but they really impressed me with their service.

After my experience, I bought a Champion. I know that I can count on SA to stand behind their warranty.

 

[ExSoldier]

S.A. "micro?"

I have bought a SA Micro Compact within the last year and I did encounter FTF JHP's in the weapon.

I had a "micro." I have such HORROR stories and nightmares associated with that gun that it's probably a main reason I swore off sub-compact 1911's altogether.

 

[gregarat]

I have a Springfield G.I. Mil-spec Gov. It had multiple problems out of the box. I sent it to Springfield to fix, I had a two week turnaround. It has been running great since.

 

[Ti Carry]

You guy's and calling Kimber's mimber's you crack me up. Kimber is a good gun not great but good. I would choose an American made Kimber before I would choose a made in Brazil Springfield. "LT" warranty or not Kimber takes care of their customer's if having problems. SF's high dollar custom shop gun's are the only gun's made here in the USA and don't kid yourself SF's are jam packed with MIM part's as well and did I mention made in "Brazil".

Kimber has had problem's yes! SF has too! Kimber's problems were created by them and are being fixed by them, SF's problems are created by Brazil and being fixed by SF here. Kimber had a difficult time with the creation of their version of the external extractor that went through 4 different designs but by then had so many problems with the early version's people have lost faith in the EE respectfully.

Kimber is now (and have yet to officially admit it) going back to the traditional internal extractor design on resent shipments reported by gun dealers and buyers have been internal extractor slides being shipped. This to me is good new's! and if you can pick up a Pro Carry with an Internal slide that is the gun you want. Super accurate, nice trigger 4.5 # trigger pull approximately, I would recommend the Stainless model but that is your choice, change the mag's to Tripp Cobra mag’s or Wilson Combat and you have yourself a GOOD carry weapon for about $820.00 for a PC/SS/w,NS and the PC/BL/w,NS for about $750.00.

Yes SF's are cheaper but are not made in the USA and does not support American industry! that for me seal's the deal on buying any.

Some have mentioned Nighthawk's and Wilson's! these gun's are in the "Great" category and are more than double the cost of a Kimber or SF. You didn't ask about them, you asked about Kimber and Springfield and I choose Kimber between the two. If you are open minded and want to consider a high end carry gun then yes! I would agree and recommend a Wilson Combat Professional or CQB, A Nighthawk Talon II, III or IV and the NH Predator II or III are all fine choices along with the Ed Brown Kobra Carry or Executive Carry, Les Baer Stinger or Thunder Ranch Commanche or even a Rock River Arm's Elite Commando in 4.25" Commander length are excellent gun's. None of these mentioned offer the aluminum frame as Kimber does.

These "great" gun's range from $1,800.00 to almost $3,000.00 depending on the one you choose and what you choose to have on them. At the Same time a Kimber bought for say $800.OO can be sent to your local smith that you trust or can be recommended to you, have a reliability tune and trigger job to your choice of # pull for about $100.00 and change the mag's to Cobra or Wilson [email protected] $60.00.

You will then have a very good, light weight, reliable, carry piece for under a grand! about $960.00 to be exact using the above example.

I did this with my Kimber UCDP although I spent much more and changed much more then I am recommending to you, this is all you will need to do to have a very nice carry piece. This is the perfect time to buy a Kimber now that the Internal extractors seem to be back, do yourself a favor and only get one with an internal extractor to save a possible headache.

I am done, finished, worn-out! I have written enough and that's how I feel about it. Your money, your gun, your choice! Good luck with it and let us know what you chose and why along with a range report and pictures.

Ti.

 

[Bud White]

Your right sprinfields do have a lot og MIM parts but not the high amount of breakage..

Yeah i dont like its made in braizil but i also dont like my tv is not made in america nor 95% of the parts in my supposed american assy car .


So any more it dont really matter springfield doesnt seem to have the problems kimbers do and thatblasted exteranl extractor wonder if they got that figured out yet

 

[rocky]

I had a "micro." I have such HORROR stories and nightmares associated with that gun that it's probably a main reason I swore off sub-compact 1911's altogether.

Same here.

Also I chose SA over Kimber for the Ambi safety. Being LH, I didn't want to spend all that money on a gun, then need a 'smith to dig into it.

 

[TN Eleven]

Springfield makes a good 1911, so did Kimber, and I believe they'll make good guns again. That said, in less than 5" models, Kimbers external has been a real pain in the rear, for them and for owners of their guns. That is being solved. As stated in another post, they are putting internal extractors back in, as a "fix", and in new guns. Lets hope they learned just like Coke did a few years ago, if it isn't broken, don't fix it.

I picked up one of the new Pro Carry HD II's with an internal extractor. This isn't a ringing endorsement, but it made 500 rounds without a failure. I won't carry it yet, not enough rounds, but a good start.

The best of luck with your purchase.

Michael

 

[Ti Carry]

Your right sprinfields do have a lot og MIM parts but not the high amount of breakage..

This is true, but MIM is MIM and I attribute less SF breakage to less being produced and sold.

Yeah i dont like its made in braizil but i also dont like my tv is not made in america nor 95% of the parts in my supposed american assy car.

I also agree with this too, but if at all possible I can buy an American
made and maufactured item I will.

So any more it dont really matter springfield doesnt seem to have the problems kimbers do and thatblasted exteranl extractor wonder if they got that figured out yet

I some what agree here too, but to me it does matter if I can buy American! and the reason it seem's like Springfield doesn't have as many problem's is again, the amount being built and sold. "Law of large numbers", Springfield is way less publisied than Kimber is, and Springfield did not make the mistake of switching to an external extractor to try and save manufacturing cost's as Kimber did!

Springfield already save's cost's by having there gun's built in Brazil. Kimber has corrected this problem and has returned the internal extractor back to the line up after several EE design failers. Atleast Kimber didn't sell out and have China start building them to cut cost. Kimber tried and failed with the extractor change and has gone back to what work's. I never agreed with the extrator change and do not own and EE Kimber nor will I ever own one. I would say that Kimber's problems are 65% EE and 35% feeding problems, that an IE design and better mag's will fix.

Such is life.

TI

 

[Bud White]

Kimbers have more out there sthan springfields i find that hard to belive just by sales here i see Kimbers sit and sit in the case here and springers hard to come buy becuse there always sold


But no point in arguing you like Kimbers and i dont you dont like Springers i do to Each there own

 

[gregarat]

Brazil, U.S., Austria,. It doesn't matter to me where a firearm is made. It doesn't have much to do with who gets the $ in the end. Springfield's firearms may be made in Brazil, But where do the major shareholders live? Brazilians may do a funky job putting it together, but where does Springfield owners sent there guns to get them to act properly? We live in a global economy. I only care if it goes bang every time.

But no point in arguing you like Kimbers and i dont you dont like Springers i do to Each there own

I agree.