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The Sig P290RS 380 and 9mm are the same height(3.9"), length(5.5"), and width(1.1") as the P238. The P290 is a double action only (DOA) pistol, and for some that is a plus and others it is a minus. I have owned both versions (380 and 9mm), and the P290RS is the softest 380 I have owned, and I have owned quite a few. It is 5 oz heavier than the P238. If cocked and locked is your preference, P238 would work, if heavier trigger with a second strike capability matters the P290RS might work. One benefit of the P290RS is that you can get it in 9mm and it has the same dimensions as the P238, in a DAO platform.

I had no failure issues with either P290RS that I owned.

View attachment 305636

Not too easy to find, but always a variety of new and used on Gunbroker.
My cousin just purchased a LNIB P290 in 9mm .... Great pistol... I just have had the chance to run around 50rds through the pistol.... I like the trigger .. DAO ..feels similar to a a S&W 642 I once owned that had a great trigger job ...
Though a small pistol , with 124gr FMJ , very manageable.... BTW .. He got it at a steal at a LGS

My deep concealment pistol is a Taurus TCP .. Good trigger .. Has been very dependable...
 

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Discussion Starter #44
10thmtn said:
Maybe carry your G42 in a more concealed manner? Smartcarry?
Depending on how my testing works out, this might become an option. Turns out, there's a place I can rent most of the guns I'm interested in, and I'm willing to do that if I need to.

mamaxwell said:
I would recommend the RM380 small emough to carry the all steel construction makes it easy to shoot.
I will add this to my list. I will say though, that I'm going to be renting a Kahr P380 on Monday, and if I like that gun, I'm probably going to buy it.

In any event, I have until spring to figure this out. After years of travelling around New England in our motorhome, my wife and I are now retired and the owners of a brand new diesel pusher, which we will be using to travel much farther from home. Even though my carry permits are good for 30 states, that leaves a lot of places where we wouldn't be legal, and we've been struggling with how to handle this, even considering travelling unarmed. Then, this past week, this story has been all over our airwaves in New Hampshire:

https://www.foxnews.com/us/texas-deputies-missing-new-hampshire-couple-murdered-rv-stolen

This has focused our minds, and we both realize that as an older (OK, old) couple travelling alone far from home (in an expensive motorhome, no less), we are at a higher risk of being targeted by predators like the ones who killed this couple. Obviously, I've been around long enough to understand the importance of situational awareness and staying away from bad areas, but I now realize that there's no way I'm going to travel around the country unarmed. It seems likely that I will, on occasion, find myself in locations where I will end up in jail if it is discovered that I'm carrying a gun, or that there's a loaded gun in the motorhome. We're old, with no criminal records, don't go out partying at bars, etc., so we know that as long as we're driving close to the speed limit, we're probably not going to attract official attention, but I want to make sure the odds are as much in my favor as possible. I'm looking for a gun that won't be made by people who who are trained to make them, like cops and criminals. That's what this is all about.
 

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Note that the the P380 is at best a tiny two finger on the grip pistol . The shorter slide will be harder to rack to and at 10oz is lite and its crazy expensive compared to a cm380 thats the same size . If they have a kahr ct380 to handle it see and feel the difference .
 

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@Talldog - FWIW I have had bad luck with Kahr. Owned four of their polymer guns, and would never recommend them. Their warranty and service is sub par as well.

I personally spoke to a head tech there, and he told me their guns are vulnerable to tolerance stacking, which is why some run fine, and some never do.

Do yourself a favor and look elsewhere.

For a NPE, nothing beats a Smartcarry or a pocket pistol in a wallet holster.
 

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@Talldog - FWIW I have had bad luck with Kahr. Owned four of their polymer guns, and would never recommend them. Their warranty and service is sub par as well.

I personally spoke to a head tech there, and he told me their guns are vulnerable to tolerance stacking, which is why some run fine, and some never do.

Do yourself a favor and look elsewhere.

For a NPE, nothing beats a Smartcarry or a pocket pistol in a wallet holster.
Unfortunately I have owned 2 Kahr pistols and both broke fairly soon. I really like their ergos and trigger and at a glance their build quality looks great but, both of mine had triggers break. One would not reset and the other went completely dead before "break-in" was completed. I know when you get a good one they have been great for some people, just not me and they are the only two firearms that have ever been a bust for me. I don't mean to bash a brand just relating my own experience.
 

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Discussion Starter #48
It seems like no matter what brand you're talking about, you'll find people who praise it and people who trash it. Regarding Kahrs, right here in this thread you can find both extremes. It's hard to know what to think about anything.

In my case, the smallest carry gun I've ever owned is my Glock 42. I own an NAA Black Widow, but I don't carry it. Anyway, lots of folks will tell you that it's the best thing ever. Mine, in addition to being my smallest, has also been my least reliable. It's already been back to the factory, and after a couple thousand trouble free rounds since I got it back, it seems to be headed south again. Just this past Friday, in 112 rounds, I had 1 failure to feed, 1 failure to strip the next round from the mag and 1 failure to lock back on the last round.
@10thmtn and @forester58, were your failures with any particular series? I've often wondered about the build quality of the CT and CW series.
 

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I had an early P9 that had too much frame flex. Then I went through 3 expensive PM9s. The first was an early one. The next was a replacement they sent me when they couldn’t fix it, which I sold. Then years later bought another PM9 thinking they were sorted out.

Check their warranty. That’s all you need to know. All makers can have issues but some stand behind their products better than others. In my experience Glock and Ruger are excellent.
 

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It seems like no matter what brand you're talking about, you'll find people who praise it and people who trash it. Regarding Kahrs, right here in this thread you can find both extremes. It's hard to know what to think about anything.

In my case, the smallest carry gun I've ever owned is my Glock 42. I own an NAA Black Widow, but I don't carry it. Anyway, lots of folks will tell you that it's the best thing ever. Mine, in addition to being my smallest, has also been my least reliable. It's already been back to the factory, and after a couple thousand trouble free rounds since I got it back, it seems to be headed south again. Just this past Friday, in 112 rounds, I had 1 failure to feed, 1 failure to strip the next round from the mag and 1 failure to lock back on the last round.

@10thmtn and @forester58, were your failures with any particular series? I've often wondered about the build quality of the CT and CW series.
Both of mine were CW pistols.
 

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I guess something to consider how much you plan to shoot the gun, and how much your arthritis will impact your ability to shoot it.

Personally, my deep concealment gun right now is my Keltec PF9. It''s almost the exact same size as a G42, but is a 9mm. It's definitely a bit snappy for an auto, but is much less snappy than a PPK in 380. The trigger is a like a very light revolver trigger. Though I have had good luck with them, Keltecs have a bit of a spotty reputation. If I didn't trust Keltec, I'd get a Ruger LC9, or if I liked striker guns I'd get a LC9s.

I think something that might reframe this entire thread is a bit of discussion about deep concealment holsters.

Personally, I carry a full sized gun OWB because it's comfortable, I have a CCL, and I am overly worried about being spotted. When I go into deep concealment, I often transition to a smaller gun (typically a revolver although the PF9 has been getting carried quite a bit lately) in my front pocket.

But if I need deep concealment and still want a full size gun, I carry Appendix in Waist Band (AIWB). If you can pull it off, AIWB renders even a full size gun invisible. I have carried a 1911 Commander, Browning Hi Power, and even a S&W M29 AIWB and the gun basically disappears. However, the limiting factor is your belly - I have a bit of a gut and can pull it off, but I do have to carry a gun with a longer barrel or my gut pushes the grip out and it prints quite badly. The one thing about AIWB is you have to be very careful when reholstering - I always remove the holster from my pants, put the gun in the holster, then put the holster back in my pants.

If you are skinny enough and don't have a gut that pushes it out, you could easily hide that G42 if you carry it AIWB. In fact, I started off pocket carrying a .380 years ago, and when I transitioned to carrying on my belt I ultimately realized I could conceal a much larger gun than I first thought. If you want to try AIWB carry, Blackhawk makes a dirt cheap holster called the ARC that I highly recommend. Sadly they only make them from Glocks and a few other very popular brands and models. I'd love to have an ARC for my H&K USPc and my 1911, but hey don't make them.

However, if I wanted to transition to deep concealment all the time, I would at least explore carrying a full size or compact gun in a belly band. Personally, I'd start with a 4" gun then move smaller if I was printing too much. I already dress in a button down shirt all the time, but I'd be sure to get them loose enough to hide the gun.

So, before you buy a new gun, try AIWB and a belly band. You may discover that you want a bigger gun when you see what you can get away with.
 

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Discussion Starter #54
drmordo said:
So, before you buy a new gun, try AIWB and a belly band. You may discover that you want a bigger gun when you see what you can get away with.
I can't get AIWB to work at all for me, and Lord knows I've tried. And bigger guns are out of the question. If we were talking about get made, get kicked out, maybe. But this is not that.
 

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Something that hasn’t been mentioned is the LCR snubby in .327 Fed Mag. It’s larger than the micro .380s, but has the advantage of using any of the .32 revolver cartridges, from mild to wild. Might be less abusive on the hand with the right load.
 

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I have 4 kahrs with 12,000 rounds them before 2 rounds of hand surgery caused me to go to a heavier wider pistol after a few months of weak hand carry . Family have carried 3 of the kahrs for the last 6 years with another 4000 rounds fired with zero issues and I or them ether used the slide hold open as a release as kahr says . No one wants to shoot the little cm9 so its still at home I did not learn that way and did not teach it to each one of them . I do start a new kahr with at least 50 rounds of the HP +P load I would hope to carry in it , nope weak and slow cheap fmj fodder and I reload all practice ammo . That's a 124gr 9mm 155gr 40 and 200gr swc coated for the last 5 or 6 years .

Pick a production handgun that's has not had issues ?? For kahrs they use heavy recoil springs built for hot +P loads so start at least with quality ammo and use good grip control , when group size goes to heck , your done With a little cm9 that might be 50 rounds max . My tp40 pet loads with a 155gr at 1260fps for practice and underwood for carry at 1321fps .

The OP has arthritis so a double action revolver trigger may not be so good ether . Kahrs little 380s have rather lite 4lb range pull weights
 

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I grew up in Northern NJ back in the 50's and 60's when I'd walk to my hunting area with a bow or a gun over my shoulder. Today I'm sure the climate has changed so much that I can't hardly believe what I read about that state. It may be the most dangerous one to try to travel through armed. Just go around it is what I read others say.
 

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@Talldog - FWIW I have had bad luck with Kahr. Owned four of their polymer guns, and would never recommend them. Their warranty and service is sub par as well.

- My kahr p380 is presently at the manufacturer for the second time
- complete lemon
- high tolerances/200 round break in my @SS

- the internet stories are true
- save yourself from the nightmare and skip them



..
 

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Discussion Starter #60
Thanks again to all for the responses. As I had said previously, I have a few months to figure this all out and prepare. After giving it a lot of thought, I'm not sure that difference in thickness and height between the G42 and guns like the P380, BG, P238 , LCP and LCPII warrants switching platforms, especially given the shootability of the Glock, not to mention that I'm a Glock Certified Armorer with multiple of their pistols. Overall length is the main area where the Glock is significantly larger than the others, and that's meaningless with regard to concealability. And after doing a $#!+load of reading over the past several days, I've come to the conclusion (not that I didn't already know, really) that all of these micro platforms have reliability concerns. For all of the pistols I mentioned above, you can find people who swear they've never had a problem and others who swear the gun is a complete POS.

So on the advice of @10thmtn and @drmordo, I'm going to spend some time researching different methods of carry for the guns I already own, such as the SmartCarry, belly bands, etc. If anyone has insights, I'd love to hear them.
 
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