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Oh yep....this kind of crap happened before, and may still happen for all I know. There was/is a political angle on this as well. When I was a cop, sheriff's would also bond supports/campaign contributors after they were elected. I have seen this first hand. This is why I think the "shall issue" is the way things are supposed to be.
 
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If you read up on the history of "gun control" laws, you will find that the original laws were intended to keep guns out of the hands of freed slaves. That was so the KKK and the white establishment could keep "order". And believe me, that wasn't just in the South. The Northerners were afraid of freed slaves coming North and causing trouble.
 

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If you read up on the history of "gun control" laws, you will find that the original laws were intended to keep guns out of the hands of freed slaves. That was so the KKK and the white establishment could keep "order". And believe me, that wasn't just in the South. The Northerners were afraid of freed slaves coming North and causing trouble.
Spot on....if I am not mistaken some of these laws were present in New York and New England States as well.
 

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Which is why it still amazes me that the liberal side of the political fence, unusually heavily populated with some particular races, tend to be so anti.

If we could ever get Anderson Cooper and Piers Morgan to understand the history of this we stand a chance at getting the word out to the masses.
 

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Which is why it still amazes me that the liberal side of the political fence, unusually heavily populated with some particular races, tend to be so anti.

If we could ever get Anderson Cooper and Piers Morgan to understand the history of this we stand a chance at getting the word out to the masses.
I agree. A real and honest look at history shows that the fight for 2nd Amendment is the most equality based platform one could hope for. Like most other issues, the anti's and liberals have both Shanghaied and perverted it to try and impose their own corrupt/twisted set of values and principals.
 

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Human nature does not change...many biases remain geographically across this country.

Race bias, political bias, power bias..regardless; the result is the same; "No permit for you if (I) say so"
 

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If we could ever get Anderson Cooper and Piers Morgan to understand the history of this we stand a chance at getting the word out to the masses.
Surely you jest, and I will try not to call you Shirley.
 

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I never thought about the fact that the "may issue" laws for gun permits may be rooted in racism until I read this article by Massad Ayoob.
Haven't done a lot of thinking, huh? "May issue" is biased for any number of reasons.
 

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Haven't done a lot of thinking, huh? "May issue" is biased for any number of reasons.
Yah, like whether you are owed favors by the issuing party. Iowa permits are granted by the Sheriffs of each county. Before Iowa became shall issue some counties were may issue or no issue with a small percentage being shall issue. You could identify permit holders from may issue counties by the hole in their wallet and the brown stuff on their noses.
 

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If you read up on the history of "gun control" laws, you will find that the original laws were intended to keep guns out of the hands of freed slaves. That was so the KKK and the white establishment could keep "order". And believe me, that wasn't just in the South. The Northerners were afraid of freed slaves coming North and causing trouble.
Ohio outlawed concealed carry for all private citizens in 1859, and never restored it until 2004. I seriously doubt that freed slaves were the cause for this 145 year prohibition, as it applied equally to everybody. The Klan certainly held no sway here in 1859.
 

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I never thought about the fact that the "may issue" laws for gun permits may be rooted in racism until I read this article by Massad Ayoob.
Regardless of generalities, assumptions, and a seemingly collective racial guilt, not all evils of society find their underpinnings in racism.
 

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Ohio outlawed concealed carry for all private citizens in 1859, and never restored it until 2004. I seriously doubt that freed slaves were the cause for this 145 year prohibition, as it applied equally to everybody. The Klan certainly held no sway here in 1859.
Mike, I don't live in and have never lived in Ohio, so you may be more up on Ohio history than I am. However, according to http://www.ohiohistorycentral.org/w/Ku_Klux_Klan

"The Klan of the 1800s was different from and the Klan of the 1910s and 1920s in two major ways. The Ku Klux Klan of the early twentieth century extended their prejudice to include more groups than African Americans. The new Klan disliked foreigners, non-white racial groups, and non-Protestants. During the nineteenth century, the Klan was strongest in the South, but during the early twentieth century, the KKK was popular in the North as well.

The Ku Klux Klan was especially strong in Ohio during the 1910s and 1920s. In Summit County, the Klan claimed to have fifty thousand members, making it the largest local chapter in the United States. Many of the county's officials were members, including the sheriff, the Akron mayor, several judges and county commissioners, and most members of Akron's school board. The Klan was also very popular in Licking County, where the group held its state konklave (convention) in 1923 and 1925. More than seventy thousand people attended each event. The konklaves were held at Buckeye Lake, a popular tourist attraction in the early twentieth century."
 

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Oh yep....this kind of crap happened before, and may still happen for all I know. There was/is a political angle on this as well. When I was a cop, sheriff's would also bond supports/campaign contributors after they were elected. I have seen this first hand. This is why I think the "shall issue" is the way things are supposed to be.
Personally I prefer the path of NH and AZ and in case you ask I carry under HR 218.
 

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IMO, may-issue is by definition arbitrary, relying upon fuzzy determination of justifications and no fixed, simple set of qualifying standards, allowing an ostensibly permissive process to become exclusionary in practice, often to the exclusion of all. Unconstitutional by any other name, it seems to me.

Of course, I believe the whole regulation/permissions process itself to be unconstitutional by definition, but there it is.
 

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Mike, I don't live in and have never lived in Ohio, so you may be more up on Ohio history than I am. However, according to http://www.ohiohistorycentral.org/w/Ku_Klux_Klan

"The Klan of the 1800s was different from and the Klan of the 1910s and 1920s in two major ways. The Ku Klux Klan of the early twentieth century extended their prejudice to include more groups than African Americans. The new Klan disliked foreigners, non-white racial groups, and non-Protestants. During the nineteenth century, the Klan was strongest in the South, but during the early twentieth century, the KKK was popular in the North as well.

The Ku Klux Klan was especially strong in Ohio during the 1910s and 1920s. In Summit County, the Klan claimed to have fifty thousand members, making it the largest local chapter in the United States. Many of the county's officials were members, including the sheriff, the Akron mayor, several judges and county commissioners, and most members of Akron's school board. The Klan was also very popular in Licking County, where the group held its state konklave (convention) in 1923 and 1925. More than seventy thousand people attended each event. The konklaves were held at Buckeye Lake, a popular tourist attraction in the early twentieth century."
Nice, and accurate, so I will elaborate on my original assertion. The Ku Klux Klan did not even exist when Ohio outlawed concealed carry for all private citizens in 1859. The War of the Rebellion had yet to be fought. There was no large mass of freed slaves here of which the state government felt the need to disarm. The concealed carry prohibition here had nothing to do with racism.
 
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Nice, and accurate, so I will elaborate on my original assertion. The Ku Klux Klan did not even exist when Ohio outlawed concealed carry for all private citizens in 1959. The War of the Rebellion had yet to be fought. There was no large mass of freed slaves here of which the state government felt the need to disarm. The concealed carry prohibition here had nothing to do with racism.
Well put. I stand/sit corrected.
 
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Illinois' new carry law is as discriminatory as "may issue" was in the other states. Particularly discriminatory against those who need the protection the most.

High fees, lengthy training requirements discriminate against the poor, single mothers, and others who find it difficult to put food on the table.

The shootings that occur in Chicago now, occur in neighborhoods where unemployment and under-employment are the norm.. Gangs rule the territory.

And those trying...no, struggling... to get out have little hope of it... And they cannot defend themselves now, against the criminal element, and with the new law still will not be able to walk the streets with the protection afforded by a permit to carry.

The new law it's just as racist, and discriminatory as jim crow laws in the south were.




Yeah, I got tapatalk, too. So what?
 
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