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First off i want to say i do not use marijuana or advocate its use in any way. Please dont butcher me for asking this question...

A friend and i had a discussion at work today about the legalities of a CCW in Michigan if you have a medical marijuana license. Do you think that your permit would be revoked if you used marijuana medicinally and legally or would be given a hard time when going in front of the gun board to renew or get a new permit.

This is a hypothetical question and i again would like to please ask to not be verbally beaten by the Defensive Carry community for asking this question.
 

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No...

Why should "they" give a hard time to anyone taking "legal" pharmaceuticals?

No...but pm me and I'll come up and represent you "gratis" if they do...
 

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IANAL

I suspect they would look at that the same way they do about anti-depressants. Of course, if caught CC while under the influence of marijuana (medical or otherwise) I am sure they would treat it the same as alcohol.
 

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Mowie-Wowie affects your reflexes and judgment, just like alcohol, street pharmaceuticals, and some prescription drugs. If you're involved in a shooting and are found to be impaired by any of the above, it's your butt all the way. Just like any of the above, I would NOT use it and carry.
 

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It's a drug like any other, and if it is legal, then now problem with the permit. Like alcohol, if impaired, then put the gun away...pretty simple.:yup:
 

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One of the questions you will be asked after a shooting, or should be is, "What prescription drugs have you taken and when was the last time you took them?"

Now if the answer to that question goes in front of a jury, how would they look at the answer you gave? Just something to keep in mind.

Biker
 

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My opinion is that you would be "under the influence" whether the MJ was legal or not. Have you ever heard of someone getting off on a DUI because they consumed alcohol "for medicinal use only"?
 

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The real problem is the feds, no matter what the state says is or isn't OK. Even if the state will let you have marijuana and give you a gun permit, its not legal under federal law for illegal drug users to possess firearms. Marijuana is currently a schedule I controlled substance under federal law. The current administration has no interest in enforcing federal law on marijuana when it legal under state law, but that could aways change. Heck, if the current administration figures out they can go after anyone who legally uses marijuana under state law and completes a 4473 stating that they are not users of illegal drugs who is to say their position won't change; any chance to go after gun owners.
 

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I have to agree that if legal it should be treated by the state and very specifically by the individual in the same manner as alcohol or any other prescription. BUT even if legalized, personal opinion may play a big role in the boards decision. Pro-Liberty, Pro-Gun, and Pro-Marijuana are all different views that ban together and clash regularly.

I also have to agree about the very real concern of how the fed would treat it if they were ever involved. Better stay within the state's boundaries.
 

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We are a shall issue state and have medical marijuana permits.

There is something of a question right now regarding how permits and CHLs relate.

A group of sherriff's have asked the state's attorneys to figure out if they should deny licenses to those with MM certificates.

There is no practice of denying CHLs to people with narcotic prescriptions...I have a "permanent" prescription for Vicodin and there has never been a hint of an issue.
 

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Biker, ask away

One of the questions you will be asked after a shooting, or should be is, "What prescription drugs have you taken and when was the last time you took them?"

Now if the answer to that question goes in front of a jury, how would they look at the answer you gave? Just something to keep in mind.

Biker
Ask away. The answer will always be the same. Wow, I'm really shook by this awful defensive action I took to stop this dude from killing me. I want to talk to my lawyer before I say anything more.

Now, I 'spose you might find some 'scuse for demanding a blood test and doing full toxicology. And yes, folks can't refuse to give "evidence." But you sure better have some grounds for doing that.

And sure, maybe after if you all need to put the effort in you can somehow subpoena medical records--with some difficulty.

And I suppose while in the house looking around you all might see that certain prescriptions were sitting out and just "notice" who the prescription was written to and for what med.

I guess the point though is, that's a question no one should answer.
 

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No longer a problem with the states

The real problem is the feds, no matter what the state says is or isn't OK.
No longer a problem. Current DOJ policy is to not prosecute medical MJ offenses at the Federal level in states where it is legal.
 

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<---Certainly not an expert, but a 'scrip is a 'scrip, right...? Would you have to explain or defend your legally prescribed Vicodin, Ambien, Valium, Zoloft, Paxil, Plavix, Rogaine, or Viagra...?
 

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Ultimately someone is going to be a test case on this.

There may even be an interesting situation where one member of household is a CCW permit holder and never touches the stuff, and the spouse has a Medical Marijuana License/Prescription for their cancer treatment.
 

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...A group of sherriff's have asked the state's attorneys to figure out if they should deny licenses to those with MM certificates...
Like you, I have never used marijuana (thought I think unlike you, I believe it should be as legal as alcohol). There are things I'm, not sure about, like if legal, how it could be tested for in a traffic stop (if over used). Just making an up front caveat to my opinion.

Many of these groups in MI are less interested in clarifying the law then they are crying over spilled milk because a vote passed legal medical marijuana and / or shall issue.

I'm hopeful it will be treated like any other legal prescription, as it is the will of the people on both counts.

Good thread.
 

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No longer a problem. Current DOJ policy is to not prosecute medical MJ offenses at the Federal level in states where it is legal.
Exactly, as I said in my first post, current DOJ policy could change at any time. Its policy, it doesn't have the force of law. Until the law is changed prosecutions could happen. Under a new administration policy could easily be changed, or the current administration could figure out they could deny gun rights to a whole new subset of people without having to pass any new legislation. Do you trust them not to decide to do so? The prosecutions don't even have to be for possession of marijuana in violation of federal law, so long as the prosecution can prove the defendant is an illegal drug user (under federal law), then the prosecution could be for only weapons offenses.
 

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Landric???

Exactly, as I said in my first post, current DOJ policy could change at any time. Its policy, it doesn't have the force of law. Until the law is changed prosecutions could happen. Under a new administration policy could easily be changed, or the current administration could figure out they could deny gun rights to a whole new subset of people without having to pass any new legislation. Do you trust them not to decide to do so? The prosecutions don't even have to be for possession of marijuana in violation of federal law, so long as the prosecution can prove the defendant is an illegal drug user (under federal law), then the prosecution could be for only weapons offenses.
Is your concern that the Federal law needs to be changed, rather than the current policy? If so, you are probably right, but it isn't going to happen, so we have to deal with what is, rather than what some might like.

You asked -"Do you trust them not to decide to do so" (prosecute)?

Of course not. DAs do the strangest things if they think they can get a conviction. E.g., a Federal employee, non-military, prosecuted for sedition because of a job performance dispute? It went no place but they tried.
 

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Like you, I have never used marijuana (thought I think unlike you, I believe it should be as legal as alcohol). There are things I'm, not sure about, like if legal, how it could be tested for in a traffic stop (if over used). Just making an up front caveat to my opinion.

Many of these groups in MI are less interested in clarifying the law then they are crying over spilled milk because a vote passed legal medical marijuana and / or shall issue.

I'm hopeful it will be treated like any other legal prescription, as it is the will of the people on both counts.

Good thread.
Couple of bad assumptions not justified by my post there...

First of all, I have smoked some marijuana when the occasion arises since Vietnam...though it has never been a major part of my life.

Secondly, I am a member of L.E.A.P., an organization of current and former law enforcement who advocate the total abolition of any and all drug prohibition. (see our rationale here:LEAP - Law Enforcement Against Prohibition - Cops Say Legalize Drugs)

Also, at least one of the sheriffs asking for clarification (my local sheriff and a good friend of mine) is a proponent of both marijuana decriminalization and the 2nd Amendment. He is just asking for clarification so he can better do his job.
 

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Is your concern that the Federal law needs to be changed, rather than the current policy? If so, you are probably right, but it isn't going to happen, so we have to deal with what is, rather than what some might like.

You asked -"Do you trust them not to decide to do so" (prosecute)?

Of course not. DAs do the strangest things if they think they can get a conviction. E.g., a Federal employee, non-military, prosecuted for sedition because of a job performance dispute? It went no place but they tried.
My real concern is that the feds will use activity legal under state law to deprive people of their rights. In this case someone being a user of illegal drugs (under federal law, but not state law) being prosecuted for firearms violations in federal court where marijuana is not now, under any circumstances, anything other than an illegal drug. Even if the prosecution is unsuccessful, one would be out a mountain of legal fees, and suing the government is difficult under the best of circumstances. When one is tried for something that is clearly a violation of federal law winning such a law suit would be basically impossible.

So yes, I think the law should be changed. I'm more than happy to enforce drug laws so long as they are on the books, but I'll be the first to say that they don't work, and I'd rather see all drugs legalized. I don't think the current laws stop people who want to be drug users for being drug users, and at the same time they promote violence.
 

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Couple of bad assumptions not justified by my post there...

First of all, I have smoked some marijuana when the occasion arises since Vietnam...though it has never been a major part of my life.

Secondly, I am a member of L.E.A.P., an organization of current and former law enforcement who advocate the total abolition of any and all drug prohibition. (see our rationale here:LEAP - Law Enforcement Against Prohibition - Cops Say Legalize Drugs)

Also, at least one of the sheriffs asking for clarification (my local sheriff and a good friend of mine) is a proponent of both marijuana decriminalization and the 2nd Amendment. He is just asking for clarification so he can better do his job.
You and I may be thinking of different people.
 
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