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I've watched the public schools here in Georgia do away with shop classes in all the major metro counties and force motorheads into classes that they find desperately boring. On the other hand, a master plumber here makes more than most accountants, every single liberal arts major, and many masters-degreed professional jobs - but there just aren't enough of them.

Several of the European companies that have come to Georgia to setup production have had to institute their own in-house training for skilled jobs because they can not find anyone who meets their standards. Those that complete those courses make a terrific living. Georgia Power has an apprentice program that is 4 years long that results in employees that get stolen away for huge salary increases because of the quality of their skill sets and the lack of qualified applicants. They started the program because the new employees that came to them from the Voc-Tech schools were......incredibly poorly trained and had zero work ethic.

Yes, we have FAR too many people going to college. As a corollary we have FAR too many high GPAs coming out of high schools. I've watched kids that tell me they have 4.+ GPAs (what happened to 4.0 being the highest???) that simply can not make change or write a complete sentence.

The centralization of education at the federal and state levels, with EVERYONE in those buildings (other than clerical staff) having graduate degrees and believing that EVERYONE needs a college degree, is a huge problem. The resulting attitude that if you don't have a college degree you are somehow a failure and to be looked down upon is shameful. A couple years ago I had a master carpenter come to our house to do custom cabinets for the kitchen for my wife. I was watching him work one day and complimented him saying that I wished I had the skills that he did. He stopped, looked at me, and said that I did not need to blow smoke up his 6 - that he knew that since he worked with his hands and that I'm a doctor I looked down on him. I was flabbergasted. I meant what I said. If I could choose my own skill set I'd do fine finish wood work, but my hands betray me. So, I went to college. Point is, somehow we have several generations that have been brainwashed into believing that without college people are failures.
 

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I took machine shop in high school. Nothing ever became of it, but it was fun while it lasted. We had wood shop, machine shop, and auto shop. Tried the college thing but just wasn't into it. I did go back after I retired from the service and attained two AA degrees.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
My son did the best of both worlds.
Went to Texas A&M University, got his bachelor's degree in Marine Transportation at the Texas Maritime Academy down in Galveston.
Had to take the basic stuff for his BA, but most of his education was learning to be a merchant mariner. Learned a trade and got his BA.
Will always have a good high paying job
 

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My son took the auto technician course during high school because he knew early on that he wasn't interested in going to college. He graduated from high school 10 years ago and had a job waiting immediately. I dare say he's doing better financially today than a lot of his classmates who went to college. On the other hand I have a niece who went to college and got a 4 year degree. The last I heard she was waiting tables at the Pizza Hut.

Tradesmen are in demand pretty much everywhere, so they make good money. That demand will only increase since kids are being told that college is the only way to go, and none of them want a job that involves any sort of physical labor or God forbid, getting their hands dirty.

Maybe I'm just cynical but it seems to me that most young people today want, and think they will get, a job that is simply sitting behind a computer screen and playing games all day. Oh, and at real high pay to boot.
 

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Worked in the service department at a car dealership for decades.
Biggest problem we had was finding qualified techs.
Most of the guys in the shop were in their 40s and 50s. backs and knees going out.
People would ask why is it taking so long to get their cars into the shop. Why don't we just hire more help.
I would explain to them that there is no more help.
Kids do not want to do this type of work. I would suggest that instead of sending their kids to college, they should sent them to trade school instead.
This is an affluent town and you would have thought that I had insulted them with the idea that their kid should become a mechanic and make a good living!
Not my child, he needs to go to college and get into debt for a job most will not find.
 

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Another option is the military. They need good people and you can learn a solid trade there, if you choose to.

I have a nephew who is not "book smart" and even has a mild learning disability. But he is a hard worker, has a lot of common sense and discipline and is good a working with mechanical and electronic systems. He joined the Air National Guard as a command and control tech. After a few years, he got a job with a major defense contractor, training people on the kinds of systems he operated in the Guard. He has done really well for himself.
 

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Who misses Home Economics and the good smells that come from baking in that room? I remember the whole hall smelled like food it was wonderful! The smart fellows took that class too cause they knew this is where the girls were plus they learned how to sew on a button and cook without being gay :yup:
 

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Who misses Home Economics and the good smells that come from baking in that room? I remember the whole hall smelled like food it was wonderful! The smart fellows took that class too cause they knew this is where the girls were plus they learned how to sew on a button and cook without being gay :yup:
Yep, Good old Home Economics.
Where we taught girls how to be good, submissive housewives.
Another lost trade. :)
 

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Yep, Good old Home Economics.
Where we taught girls how to be good, submissive housewives.
Another lost trade. :)
You were a Home Ec teacher? Friend, you spend too much time on the computer to be a home maker, lol 😉
 

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I couldn't afford to go to college and taking out loans to do so seemed silly to me. I joined the Navy Reserves at the beginning of my senior year of high school. I graduated on a Friday night and was on active duty the following Monday. I got an AS degree in engineering and a BS degree in engineering before I retired. I worked as an engineer, senior engineer, supervisor of engineering, and staff engineer before receiving an early retirement, severance package, and early signing bonus during a merger.

My wife's best friend has a daughter who was in abusive relationships and drugs for several years until she decided to go to college. She wants to help people.

She received her BS degree in psychology and her MS degree in psychology. She is currently working on he Doctorate. She has done it all on student loans. She takes vacations to Europe and Asia during summers using student loans. She is now in her forties with over $400,000 in student loans with never working a day in her life.

She married her step brother. She wants to help people.
 

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Having spent almost 21 years in schools, I think I can make a couple of intelligent comments.

1) We have $1.5 T in student debt because of the way "institutions of higher levels of thievery" charge $5 K per semester hour for kids to get indoctrinated in the fine art of basket weaving and liberal ideology.

2) We have $1.5 T in student debt because said institutions are way more focused on their athletic programs than on real education.

3) We have $1.5 T in student debt because said institutions have made the position of tenured professor something akin to a god on a throne. Untouchable, uncontrollable, insatiably greedy.

4) We have $1.5 T in student debt because parents are generally practicing the time-tested practice of dumping their children on the least likely path to success in life. I have no idea why parents would do this. A great deal of "advertising" goes out every year encouraging parents to send their kids to the best "party school" where they will learn how to consume a quart of Vodka in 15 minutes in the presence of like-minded "students."

Whatever else may be a factor, the rise in population-wide stupidity may be laid at the feet of "education."

I think at this point, it should be a requirement that no one be allowed to enroll in a college or university without first serving four very instructive years in the armed forces.
 

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This leaves out the additional money paid out in taxes each year from the portion of tuition that is subsidized by the gov.
 
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I think at this point, it should be a requirement that no one be allowed to enroll in a college or university without first serving four very instructive years in the armed forces.

^^^ AMEN! I also think that to be POTUS a person should have to spend time in the armed forces, just a personal opinion and may not be popular but have always thought so.

Heck I think kids should be sent to military school not public school. better yet, by-pass the liberal kids, folks need to stop having babies and sell the liberal one’s to some communist country on Russian eBay :yup:
 

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Shop classes also taught what many of us took for granted. For several summers I was team leader for groups of teenagers doing mission work for World Changers. We did various construction projects for elderly/ disabled in the rural Appalachian Mountains. Most all of the teens could not read a tape measure, square a structure by measuring the diagonals, or use a square or conventional level. By the end of the projects they were all competent enough to get an entry level construction job and helped out some good people in need during the process!:smile:
 
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Another option is the military. They need good people and you can learn a solid trade there, if you choose to.

I have a nephew who is not "book smart" and even has a mild learning disability. But he is a hard worker, has a lot of common sense and discipline and is good a working with mechanical and electronic systems. He joined the Air National Guard as a command and control tech. After a few years, he got a job with a major defense contractor, training people on the kinds of systems he operated in the Guard. He has done really well for himself.
My cousin sounds just like your nephew. We got him into the Corps and he never looked back. Was taught to be a heavy engine mechanic and transitioned into the reserves after 8 years and has ALWAYS had work. He tells everyone, the Corps taught him how to put in an honest days work and to take pride in everything he does. He still tells me I f'd up by being a "college puke". :smile:
 

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My buddy does handyman/hvac/some basic automation work for various businesses. Knows a lot about various mechanical/controls etc... he does about 500K a year in revenues for his labor mostly, small amount of expenses. He's smart but so could a lot of people with mechanical aptitude and some training. A nice gig he made for himself in the trades.
 
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