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Discussion Starter #1
Didn't want to hijack Ti Carry's thread on the KC Star article dealing with Kansas. This is just something that happened to my wife and I here in Missouri. An interesting sidebar to liberal or anti-ccw thinking.

My wife, Lesa, was especially outspoken about concealed carry (pro, of course) before the public vote here. We went to all kinds of places so she could talk to people. She is self-employed - cleans houses - so she makes bank deposits a couple times a week and was always worried that someone would figure out her schedule and rob her. Here, we could not keep a loaded gun in a vehicle unless it was in plain sight.... not good if you want to keep vehicle glass.

Anyway, a liberal friend of ours would constantly go on about how terrible it would be to have CCW, etc. My wife asked her "so, if you're getting raped, you don't want to defend yourself?"
She says "no, I couldn't hurt anyone, no matter what."

CCW gets voted down, time passes, legislature gets it through.. you all know the story. A couple years pass.
Same liberal girl is talking at a party and the subject of rape/assault comes up. The girl says "well if I'm with Lesa, she'll protect me" -
 

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Your wife should tell her, you voted against CC, you are on your own. Typical liberal who wants everyone else to protect them but votes against the means to do it.
 

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David, That is the sad truth! Expecting other people (your wife) to protect them is just ludicrous.

Lesa's friend better hope Lesa is with her 24/7/365 to protect her then. Your wife should start charging them for protection.


Ti.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Ti - from what I understand, we couldn't protect her if we wanted to. The piece of a ruling I was quoted went something like - if protecting a non-family member, we cannot use any more force than we know they would use in the same situation. That girl said no force at all, so we can't help her.
Not sure if this is true, but I heard if from a prosecuting attorney who is also pro-gun.
 

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Are you talking about a Missouri statute that says this?

From what I understand you can absolutely protect someone that is in trouble, say being raped or attempting to muder another. That is the first time I have heard of that one.

Can you explain further and possibly show the statute saying this?


Ti.
 

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It's not would, it's could. In other words if the person is in fear of serious bodily harm or death they could use deadly force to protect themselves. This means that you could also. A subtlety of the words, but important.

My problem with defending someone else, is that they may testify that they were not in fear of serious harm or death, which can put me in a bit of a ringer. So it may come down to me saying I believed that they were in fear of serious bodily harm or death and them saying they weren't. Judge or jury gets to sort it out and you are at the mercy of people who will have days or weeks to decide what you had to decide in seconds or less.

-Scott-
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Ti - no, I can't -- but thanks to this forum, Scott just did - Thanks! Could. That makes sense.
I managed to take my own thread off topic.....
but, over the past hour or so, I've thought of a couple other people I know who were very much against CCW - and now on several occasions I've heard them say that they feel better if I'm around when we're going someplace. I will never figure out that mindset, and I guess that's a good thing.
I won't have to open my door and say "Baa..."
 

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O.k. would or could, whatever. That is not waht David was touching on IMO.

This is what is confusing me.

David wrote,
if protecting a non-family member, we cannot use any more force than we know they would use in the same situation. That girl said no force at all, so we can't help her.

Are we saying this is a law or just the best thing to do?


Ti.
 
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