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Have you ever attended a formal training school aside from whatever you took for your CCW permit?

  • Yes

    Votes: 15 39.5%
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    Votes: 14 36.8%
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  • Sig Sauer Academy

    Votes: 1 2.6%
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  • Lethal Force Institute

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  • Other (list in response)

    Votes: 7 18.4%
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·

Larry Vickers 20 year combat veteran of Army Special Forces, 15 of which spent in SFOD-D.
Special Forces Operational Detachment Delta.

 

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Training for a CCW? Wow, talk about a poll tax to exercise a right! Nope, no CCW training. Does being raised by a USMC DI count and learning to shoot 1911s from him when I was knee high count?
 

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Does Uncle count?
 

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That’s just old and older.
This is “ New School”….
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Training for a CCW? Wow, talk about a poll tax to exercise a right! Nope, no CCW training. Does being raised by a USMC DI count and learning to shoot 1911s from him when I was knee high count?
Absolutely USMC DI counts. So you’re fortunate enough to be in a Constitutional Carry state. Tennessee just made that, for handguns only but we’re moving it forward.
 

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Other.

Taught to shoot and hunt by relatives and family friends who had spent time in the Marine Corps during WWII and Korea. My informal training started in the summer between second and third grades and lasted until I graduated high school and went in the Navy. Twenty-two years in the military including Marine Advanced Infantry training at Camp Pendleton. Spent tours in Viet Nam including as an advisor on Swift Boats. Qualified Expert Marksman with military rifles and the 1911 every year until I retired.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Does Uncle count?
Depends on the level. Basic or AIT? Nope. But if you were on a team as I was when I was the XO of the 9th ID pistol team, sure. We got match grade 1911’s and ammunition and Olympic coaches.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Other.

Taught to shoot and hunt by relatives and family friends who had spent time in the Marine Corps during WWII and Korea. My informal training started in the summer between second and third grades and lasted until I graduated high school and went in the Navy. Twenty-two years in the military including Marine Advanced Infantry training at Camp Pendleton. Spent tours in Viet Nam including as an advisor on Swift Boats. Qualified Expert Marksman with military rifles and the 1911 every year until I retired.
Swift Boats? Did you serve with John Kerry? Also known as Lieutenant Lurch?
 
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Swift Boats? Did you serve with John Kerry? Also known as Lieutenant Lurch?
He was there for four months in 1968/1969. I was there for twelve months in 1970/1971. I was also there in 1965/1966 and 1972/1973.

Lurch and I are tight!

356941
 

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I attended the Sig Sauer Academy five times for advanced instructor level courses not because I was required by any law, but because I desired to increase my own skill set and up my game as an instructor. It was extremely cost effective. Even though I was still a working educator at the time and not the comfortably retired teacher I am today.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
He was there for four months in 1968/1969. I was there for twelve months in 1970/1971. I was also there in 1965/1966 and 1972/1973.

Lurch and I are tight!

View attachment 356941
By the way, welcome home! Job well done.

The ‘Nam vets never got their well deserved parades and accolades. They were vilified and spat on. So when I’m at the VA for my own appointments and I see one (wearing the hat or t-shirt) I always tell them that. I’ve gotten spontaneous tears more than once.
 

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I’ve taken classes with Tim Chandler, Greg Ellifritz, Rob Tackett, Brett Harnish, Jay Lalue, Ty Cooper, a couple others; spent quite a few months shadowing GMan here when he was putting a program together after his retirement. John Murphy and Ashton Ray are on the card for later this year.

I prefer day classes to multi-day big school programs. I only take in so much high level information before I’m smoked, therefore prefer to spread a school’s program out over 8-12hr sessions. If I have a problem getting something down, I can repeat that course before moving on.
 

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Your choices do not allow for both a "Yes" answer and an "Other" answer. If you didn't go to one of the listed schools, logically Yes=Other.

I was taught to shoot by my father, who was a Navy Gunner's Mate and part of Permanent Shore Patrol (military police) in WWII. He set up a wax bullet range in the basement for me and let me shoot his Colt Official Police on it as much as I wanted. Years later, I shot a qual course for a security guard license and tied the highest score ever shot on the course, which was only done by one other person out of hundreds who had fired it. All in the ten ring, all but two out of the X ring. Later I qualed expert in the Navy with both the revolver and 1911 and competed on a Navy shooting team.

Up to that point, it was all learning by practice and mentoring. I didn't take any kind of a shooting course until I got my first CCW license. Civilian shooting training wasn't even a "thing" back then. I was working armed security before API, the forerunner to Gunsite, was even founded. Cops got basic training in the academies, but then just re-quals after that.

Later, I got a good bit of training money from a company that laid me off and I used most of it to take a bunch of shooting courses, on a variety of different defensive shooting topics. I think training is great, but only if it improves proficiency. I went to a lot of courses where I'm pretty sure some of the participants didn't improve at all. I went to a couple where I'm not sure I improved any more than if I had just gotten equivalent range time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I’ve taken classes with Tim Chandler, Greg Ellifritz, Rob Tackett, Brett Harnish, Jay Lalue, Ty Cooper, a couple others; spent quite a few months shadowing GMan here when he was putting a program together after his retirement. John Murphy and Ashton Ray are on the card for later this year.

I prefer day classes to multi-day big school programs. I only take in so much high level information before I’m smoked, therefore prefer to spread a school’s program out over 8-12hr sessions. If I have a problem getting something down, I can repeat that course before moving on.
I only had one course at the Sig Academy that went more than one day. Another was a full day and three were half days. Three hundred rounds downrange in four hours (which also includes class time) is smokin’! The instructor interaction with the students in the Academy is superb.
 
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Your choices do not allow for both a "Yes" answer and an "Other" answer. If you didn't go to one of the listed schools, logically Yes=Other.

I was taught to shoot by my father, who was a Navy Gunner's Mate and part of Permanent Shore Patrol (military police) in WWII. He set up a wax bullet range in the basement for me and let me shoot his Colt Official Police on it as much as I wanted. Years later, I shot a qual course for a security guard license and tied the highest score ever shot on the course, which was only done by one other person out of hundreds who had fired it. All in the ten ring, all but two out of the X ring.

Later I qualed expert in the Navy with both the revolver and 1911 and competed on a Navy shooting team. Up to that point, it was all learning by practice and mentoring. I didn't take any kind of a shooting course until I got my first CCW license. Later, I got good bit of training money from a company that laid me off and I used most of it to take a bunch of shooting courses, I think seven or eight of them, on a variety of different shooting topics.
When I was on active duty as an infantry officer, we all used to mock the Military Police (“Mop Pushers” Mud Puppies” etc) but later on it was pointed out to me a very valid point: They’ve gotta be pretty bad assed because 85% of the folks they deal with are trained professional killers who’ve likely “done the deed” and more than once!
 
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I learned point shooting/threat-focused from one of the best, Robin Brown. Enough name-dropping for one thread.
 
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When I was on active duty as an infantry officer, we all used to mock the Military Police (“Mop Pushers” Mud Puppies” etc) but later on it was pointed out to me a very valid point: They’ve gotta be pretty bad assed because 85% of the folks they deal with are trained professional killers who’ve likely “done the deed” and more than once!
Funny story about that from my Dad in WWII. A sailor was trying to impress some girl at an arcade in Honolulu by shooting a .22 rifle at a procession of duck silhouettes in one of those arcade booths. The sailor claimed the sights were off and he was being cheated. He was probably right. The argument escalated and the sailor pulled out a 1911 and shot up the booth. My Dad took the call and had to run the guy to ground and arrest him. That could have gotten ugly.

Also, Dad said MP jeeps, including one he was driving, got randomly shot at while on patrol. He was a crack shot, but never had to shoot anyone.
 

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Not a “school” per se, but we hired people to come put on, or assist with different types of training.
 

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Grand father was a WWI vet, cop, competition shooter, Dad was a competition shooter. I was taught the right way as soon as I was old enough to hold a BB gun. US ARMY MP, City Cop, Federal Agent. Been training and carrying since the 1970's
 

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I had many pistol classes throughout my LEO career from different high level pistol instructors (Rob Leatham, Robin Brown "Brownie", 7677 etc.) because I was on our SWAT team for over 10 years and pistols were frequently used in CQB operations/entries. (although often using different tactic's than most citizens might employ. I was also a designated sniper so I got some good "long gun" training which was a totally different skillset.
Military "SF" trainers and high level "LEO" SWAT instructors were most beneficial for my training applications as a LEO (since 95% of our engagements were with a pistol, but the military sniper instructors were far and away the experts with long guns, since they are their "bread and butter" weapons of use. One had to keep in mind the totally different "rules of engagement" between the two types of training.
 
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