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Knowing how you would react after doing it is presuppositional. Hollywood makes it look good and romantic. It is not. Some good people are haunted the rest of their lives because of what they did in order to save their life or that of others.
 

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PC Army? OH NO!

tanksoldier said:
US military training with regard to the warrior mindset is laughable.

Trust me, the military (the US Army portion anyway) is so PC it would make your head spin. We certainly aren't making any steely-eyed killers. We can barely get them to come to work with a proper haircut, shaved face, sober and on time.

Give me a troop who manages 3 out of 4, 95% of the time and I'm a happy NCO.
Are you serious? Man I remember doing elevated pushups off the bar in the "O" Club and my buddy having to take a leak but being unwilling to lose his spot at the bar, he took an empty highball glass and quietly released into it under the cover of the bar itself, then he put the warm frothy liquid up on the bar....Guess that'd be taboo these days, huh? Ahhhh the fond memories of the good old days....
 

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I have the book. Bought it several years ago. Found it interesting, but depressing. I must be getting old.
 

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Try dry dining-ins on for size. No grog, no sergeant at arms, and you'd better be careful with the content of your skit.


ExSoldier762 said:
Are you serious? Man I remember doing elevated pushups off the bar in the "O" Club and my buddy having to take a leak but being unwilling to lose his spot at the bar, he took an empty highball glass and quietly released into it under the cover of the bar itself, then he put the warm frothy liquid up on the bar....Guess that'd be taboo these days, huh? Ahhhh the fond memories of the good old days....
 

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NO GROG??? AT A "DINING IN?" OMG. I remember the Div CG leading the toasts at a Dining In and starting the the POTUS and proceeding ALL the way down the chain of command to HIM. Everybody got blasted. Thank the Lord it was usually wine or beer. The Rangers would do whiskey SHOTS.
 

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Col. Grossman is GTG for the most part. He makes a lot of good points, but if you read him you would do well to conduct some of your own research into the statistics he uses. Don't simply accept everything he has to say at face value.

His research methods have been questioned, and some of the research upon which he bases his theories has been discredited, like many here have stated.

He makes very good points in "On Killing", just as he does in "On Combat". However, just because someone makes a few good points doesn't mean they're the gospel. Take it all with a grain of salt, and always question the statistics.

Remember:
There's Lies, Damn Lies, and Statistics :yup:
 

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Wow...no grog at a dining-in. Even the Air Force hasn't gotten that PC yet.
 

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With regard to the subject, less so the book, I've noticed the situations on Cops and some other shows that video LEOs in the pursuit of their job.

Many officers, when faced with situations where they, not only should have fired, but would have been completely justified in doing so, didn't. Fortunately, most of the time it ended without anyone getting hurt. But in at least one situation I observed, one officer was wounded.

I just have to wonder if they were concerned with legal ramifications in their mind, that kept them from shooting.

I keep hoping we get the Castle doctrine passed and signed soon here in Michigan. I KNOW I won't hesitate, whether that law is in effect or not.

But maybe that's just me. :wink:
 

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Sure, the enemy was threatening your life, but only because you are his enemy. In different circumstances you might actually find you and your enemy have a lot in common. You and a BG in a street situation is quite a bit different. One thing for sure, it's not going to be an easy thing to get over if you must kill someone.
A soldier can respect an enemy soldier and still kill him.
A BG on the street trying to kill you gets no respect.

A intelligent man would have a harder time with the aftermath killing an enemy soldier that is just doing his job than he would when killing some thug that just wants your stuff and has no qualms with hurting to get it. Its all about respect.


I just have to wonder if they were concerned with legal ramifications in their mind, that kept them from shooting.
You better beleive it...because in many places, you are danged if you do and danged if you dont...its a no win situation.
 

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Try sitting with two CWO's talking about hand receipts...with no grog. God Bless my DD214. LOL

Anyways, I liked Grossman's book. Disagreed with alot of it but found alot of it useful as well. The key in reading anything is that your reading the authors opinion of the findings of his research. I was especially pleased with the section on the aftermath of a shooting. Most people only plan up to the shooting itself and dont think about dealing with the psychological effect afterwards. Or the physical for that matter. All in all good book.
 
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