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http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/news/archive/local_22121330.shtml

The above article is an concern. What exactly does he mean by a more aggressive form of policing? Most local LEO's are in favor of conceal carry and do not have a problem. However many "chiefs" are against it and try to cloud the issue with "Officer safety" when their real intent is a liberal agenda of gun control. One thing to bear in mind police chiefs are political appointments.


Wisconsin does pass a concealed carry act, the public could expect “a more aggressive style in policing.”

“If we already have such safe communities, why would we want to change that?” Myers said.

If it does become legal to carry concealed weapons in Wisconsin, “expect to see a more aggressive style of policing,” Myers said.
 

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What's up with police chiefs??

During the testimony phase before Nebraska's CCW bill went to the Unicameral for debate/consideration the Chief of Police of Nebraska City (Pop 7500) testified against CCW. Chief Muldoon is the president of the state chiefs of police association. How the chief of what's probably a 15 person dept becomes the exalted grand poobah of police chiefs is beyond me. I'm guessing there's not a lot of competition for the position. Undoubtedly the high point of his life.

His premise is that CCW will lead to more guns among the public and therefore will result in more gun accidents in the home, and more shootings among the citizenery. He couldn't say what the breakdown of chiefs of police in Nebarska was for/against, just that he was against it. He didn't put up much in the way of a spirited defense of his position...he had zero stats or studies to support his position, just seemed to expect that his annointed position as pres of the chief's association gave him a defacto platform to spew his drivel.

Fortunately, LB 454 seems destined for passage & governer's signature late this year.
 

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This ''more aggressive'' crap grates!! We are the cop's friend, not enemy for C-sake!!

Do not these Cops in question realize, the average CCW is way more responsible than most - has usually in some form had some basic (at least) training and - ''hello'' ---- has been checked to make sure he/she has a clean sheet!

So - all these risky CCW's are gonna make things hot are they - the ''rivers of blood'' garbage and stuff. Plus - if they have both some training and sense are and will be more cognissant of safety rules than most too.

I'll wager the majority of CCW's are the most loathe folks in the nation to ever wish to use a firearm in anger. I stand by that.
 

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Remember that Chiefs are politicians. That's how they get those jobs. It's generally not the top of the normal career progression charts. They may have been with us at one time, but their ambition later clouds their integrity and judgement.
 

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Yet another reason I left Green Bay and came here. The PC would crap himself if he talked with his officers. An instructor at my cop school I went to in GB is a GB officer. He said himself and many ( almost half of the 400-some officers) are in favor of CCW in WI. He said the PC is very left wing and doesn't get it anymore. Too much time behind the desk.


Liberal hotspots in WI are Madison, Milwaukee, and most recently, Green Bay.
 

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Green Bay Police Chief Craig Van Schyndle said:
concealed carry is a very dangerous proposition.
Prove it. Let's see you back up that statement with one fact.
 

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Today, MANY if not MOST cops are antigun

country85 said:
http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/news/archive/local_22121330.shtml

The above article is an concern. What exactly does he mean by a more aggressive form of policing? Most local LEO's are in favor of conceal carry and do not have a problem. However many "chiefs" are against it and try to cloud the issue with "Officer safety" when their real intent is a liberal agenda of gun control. One thing to bear in mind police chiefs are political appointments.


Wisconsin does pass a concealed carry act, the public could expect “a more aggressive style in policing.”

“If we already have such safe communities, why would we want to change that?” Myers said.

If it does become legal to carry concealed weapons in Wisconsin, “expect to see a more aggressive style of policing,” Myers said.
Well, one hint is to look at the politics of the main organization representing Chiefs of Police in this case the IACP (International Association of Chiefs of Police) is a globalist NWO antigun group. Know what I call their idea of police and civic paradise? A POLICE STATE.

I used to agree with the notions that street cops are pro Second Amendment and Pro-CCW permits and I would have been correct 20 years ago. But with the proliferation of liberal educators pushing the liberal antigun AGENDA and you have students who have been raised and passed thru grade after grade without hearing the OTHER side of the issue and they never question the agenda of disarmament.

Where are the police overwhelmingly educated? Public Schools. In fact the message takes SO well that they think that guns are so evil they themselves shouldn't become experts in firearms handling. That's why you now have dozens of cops shooting HUNDREDS of rounds at the same time at one BG and....missing. Now, I'm talking the average street cop, not the SWAT guys, or warrant squad or other special units.
 

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Through the years Chiefs have gone from street cop, who are generally on our side, to politician who think they know more than we the public do. This Green Bay Chief is sputtering the same dribble you hear time and time again which always proves to be untrue.

Here in Minnesota after several years of CC some Chiefs admitted in a news article that there hasn't been a problem. The worst I heard was that one issued a permit to someone they may not have under the old law but even that person turned out to not be a problem.

If these chiefs would only talk to one another instead of trying to climb the political ladder they might learn something. Keep up the good fight Wisconsin.
 

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country85 said:
“If we already have such safe communities, why would we want to change that?” Myers said.

Yup. Green Bay is such a safe place now. We have had how many murders in the past five years? An increase of what percent? Hell, we don't even need LE anymore, it is so safe. The community polices itself. There is no crime here. What are you talking about?

Wisconsin had 49 murders, 4000 some rapes, and 6000 some assaults in 2004 alone. I'd say WI is getting along fine. :mad:
 

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Sent to editor of the GP Press Gazette by me:

"I am appalled at the blatant disregard for the safety of civilians by the chiefs of police in WI and for the gun grabbers in Madison/Milwaukee/GB. If carrying a concealed weapon was so dangerous, wouldn't you think that the other 46 states who have concealed carry would have repealed their laws? The only ones who it is not safe for are the criminals. They haven't because it saves lives. Criminals prefer UNARMED victims.

Law enforcement already treats everyone as armed and dangerous; it's what keeps them alive on the streets every day. If WI is so safe we wouldn't need LE. Police officers carry guns both on and off duty. Why? For protection. If someone has enough guts to attack an officer, they won't think twice about attacking a civilian.

I was born in Oshkosh and lived there for 10 years, lived in Milwaukee for 4 years and lived in Green Bay 10 years. I recently moved to Michigan because they issue concealed weapon permits. THEY take my safety seriously. I am the only one who is responsible for my own safety. Cops can't be everywhere everytime. They protect the general population, not the individual.

Remember, in 1872 the Klu Klux Klan pushed the legislature to ban concealed weapons so when they went to attack Blacks, the Blacks couldn't protect themselves with a firearm. Not supporting the Personal Protection Act in WI is the same as supporting the racist, murdering efforts of the KKK. Remember that."
 

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Guess I am lucky. The new sheriff (since I worked for the S.D.) is more pro gun than the last. But he came thru the ranks to become sheriff. The last sheriff was a politician all the way.
 

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This ''safe community'' stuff is utter crap!! Superficially a community can seem safe - in as much as crime figures may be modest by other standards. This however does NOT make the individual guaranteed safe from attack - neither does it change the fact that the cops, doing their best - cannot in any way respond and be on the scene during the vital seconds or minute when something goes down.

''Serve and protect''?? The best they can maybe but for the average cop it is more likely he/she will arrive and have to reel out the ''crime scene'' tape, call the coroner and then start mopping up and measuring up. We know - irrefutably - only WE can take responsibility for our own safety and that of loved ones - no one but no one can do it for us. It is that simple and yet some Police Chiefs would try and fool folks it is otherwise.
But with the proliferation of liberal educators pushing the liberal antigun AGENDA and you have students who have been raised and passed thru grade after grade without hearing the OTHER side of the issue and they never question the agenda of disarmament.
Ex - that reminds me of your excellent thread re agendas and issues - something I thought was very profound and innately logical. Well to those of us with even half a brain, who not exist on gut emotions and little else!!

There are too many malevolent agendas - and too few real issues addressed.
 

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What scares me is the "aggressive style of policing". What does that mean? SWAT teams get called out for a traffic stop? Jaywalkers arrested at gunpoint?

I wish Sen. Zien had also mentioned that the police are not obligated to answer every 911 call. I think most people are unaware of this, especially the fact that there is legal precident for this. Given that fact, any police chief who is anti-gun is basically saying "you're on your own, but I don't want you to have the means to effectively defend yourselves."

It is good to know that not all police officers are anti-2nd Amendment. For example: http://www.leaa.org/
 

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DirksterG30 said:
What scares me is the "aggressive style of policing". What does that mean? SWAT teams get called out for a traffic stop? Jaywalkers arrested at gunpoint?
I'll post the following link and will not comment. I am already in deep trouble on another board. But you can arrive to your own conclussions

Slaying victim's kin rip officials

The officers were armed because they knew Diotaiuto had a firearms license, Voss said.
 

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Miggy - darn it - another site that wants you to reg'. I have given up on BugMeNot - it never seems to work - and do not want to reg myself.

I guess it is about cops ''arming up'' because of a legal CCW person.
 

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More related to what DirksterG30 posted:

Posted on Tue, Aug. 09, 2005






Relatives, friends criticize death of man in Sunrise police raid

BY JANETTE NEUWAHL

[email protected]


Wearing black armbands with painted gold hearts, family and friends grieving the death of a Sunrise man shot and killed in a police drug raid staged a peaceful protest at a City Commission meeting Tuesday night.

A dozen mourners stood in memory of Anthony Andrew Diotaiuto as a friend, William DeLarm, told officials why he thinks the death of the 23-year-old bartender was wrong.

''No where in the Constitution does it say that you can be killed by those sworn to protect and shield the public,'' said DeLarm.

About 6:15 a.m. on Friday, a police SWAT team raided the south Sunrise home where Diotaiuto lived with his mother, Marlene Whittier. Diotaiuto was alone at home.

Lt. Robert Voss, a spokesman for Sunrise police, said officers entered the home with a search warrant to look for evidence that Diotaiuto dealt drugs. The officers were armed because they knew Diotaiuto had a firearms license, Voss said. When they found Diotaiuto with a pistol, Officers Sean Visners and Andre Bruma fired, Voss said.

Police screamed such warnings as ''Freeze!'' and ''Police!'' when they walked into the home, Voss added. But Diotaiuto ran into his bedroom, Voss said.

''My heart goes out to the family and friends [of Diotaiuto] and all of the members of the police department feel the same way,'' said Voss, reserving comment on the family's accusations until a formal report is released. ``It's a tragedy and our officers are going through a tough time.''

The death of Diotaiuto was the first time the 14-year-old SWAT team has shot a suspect, Voss added.

Voss said he could not immediately say how many times police shot Diotaiuto, but Brian Kickbush, the boyfriend of Diotaiuto's mother, said there were about 10 gunshot wounds.

Diotaiuto died soon after the shooting. Police said they found 2 ounces of marijuana at the home, along with some plastic bags and some weight scales.

Voss said Sunrise detectives had been observing people visiting his home and an undercover investigator or informant had bought drugs from him, Voss said.

David Arker, a manager who worked with Diotaiuto at the Carolina Ale House in Weston, said his employee and friend only smoked marijuana ''casually'' and did not sell drugs. He said Diotaiuto was a hard worker.

Diotaiuto's girlfriend, Leslie Kellner, 21, said he also worked as a DJ and sold his prized sports car to pay for the home he shared with his mom. ''If he was a drug dealer, he could have bought his mom a new car, but he couldn't even afford to fix it,'' said Kellner, 21.

Diotaiuto's loved ones said they did not think police properly identified themselves.

''If Anthony knew who was at his door, he would have cooperated,'' Kellner said.

Sunrise Mayor Steven B. Feren told the group he was sorry for their loss, but that the city was waiting for an investigation before more answers would be available.

A funeral Mass for Diotaiuto will be 11 a.m. Wednesday at St. David's Catholic Church, 3900 S. University Dr., Davie.
 

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Miggy,

Thanks for posting the article. I routinely carry my 1911 in the house, and it got me thinking - what would happen if the police kicked in my door, or if I answered the door with a loaded gun on my person, not knowing it's the police?
 

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Thx too Miggy from me.

Dirkster - I carry all waking hours - period. I too wonder if I got a ''no knock'' what would happen - more than anything because how the heck am I to know the intruders are genuine cops anyways.

Anyone can bust the door down and yell ''armed police'' - and in heat of moment when one's thought is protection of self family and home - well - I do not relish having to find out. In fact I have no possible reason to think I'd get a no knock anyways but - rumor has it.... busts have been made at wrong address at times!

Worrying - ain't it.
 

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That was precisely the argument on the other board that ended up degenerating into a full fledge confrontation. In South Florida we had cases of BG's pretending to be cops and doing home robbery invasions. Some advocated that, to be in the safe side, not to do a thing 'cause maybe the bad guys will let you live. The discussion went downhill from then on.
 

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In Oregon, the Portland Police Chief is the same. The rest of Oregon, to my knowledge, the chief's just keep quiet because the People don't agree with their politics.

Police Chiefs are appointed, Sheriffs are elected. The Sheriff does what the People want, Police Chiefs do what the pols want.

Wayne
 
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