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I have done sims in the past, this looks like something I would really like....
 
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It is as close to real as you can get as your are using real guns, real bullets with real people. The actors (who is shooting at you) can change the scenario in a blink of and eye, it really keeps you on your toes.
 

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wow,, that is pretty amazing simulation training. Wonder how the bad guys know when they are hit. Maybe some kind of sensors that they wear? Maybe its a per-scripted scenario?
 
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wow,, that is pretty amazing simulation training. Wonder how the bad guys know when they are hit. Maybe some kind of sensors that they wear? Maybe its a per-scripted scenario?
They do have senors on vest that they wear to tell them were the hits are at and they do play of that as if it isn't a kill shot then they keep going.
They had snuck my wife in on me once as a hostage, I walked in and she was taped to a chair with a bad guy with a gun to her head (when they run hostage type scenarios they use fake or airsoft guns) as not to be pointing a real gun at hostages. It was pretty intense and I am proud to say out of all the people who attended that class I was the only one who didnt get my wife shot, I took the head shot, well several- all the way to the ground lol.
 

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What is the advantage over live drills with the use of Simunitions? Not being critical at all, it's a very nice training apparatus, but what about cost effectiveness? It could be cost prohibitive for a lot of your smaller more rural PD/SD's.
 
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This dosent even compare to the simunitions as far as with simunitons its still in your head that it isnt real bullets. with troysgate it seem that just knowing your using real ammo and real people you forget all the (this is a training scenario) and you feel like you are in a real life fight for your life, I have done several kinds of drills with about everything that is out there and this is the only one that has ever reached this level on a metal level. This is hands down the realistic you are going to get no question about it.

The cost is another story and I am not sure what the classes are going to run as of late, they have went threw some changes and I havent talked to the owner (Randy Martin) in a couple of weeks. It used to be $150 for a 8 hour class but there is on in Texas that is $350 - $400 a class.
We have many low budget agency's in and around our area and most have attended the troysgate system, they do try to work with agency's to get them in.
I have no idea what it cost to buy the system and have it set up but I would expect it to be good chunk. Im sure it would be cheaper to go to were a system is already set up as opposed to buying into it.

BTW if it helps any those are the guys who test my holster designs.
 

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Service life and cost of the reflective screens seems like the limiting factor. Still, it looks like a good system.
 
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It looks like a great way to induce stress inoculation. Based on the little it shows I like the fact that you get to shoot live ammo. It certainly looks better than a general simulator such as Gander Mountains 300 degrees scenario simulator. With that said, unless I'm missing something troygate doesn't have the introduction and immediate feedback of pain in you get shot in a scenario. Overall, it looks like would another excellent form of training to work on becoming a thinker first and a fighter second. If there was one up in the Midwest area and the price was reasonable ($200 per day of class) I'd consider traveling to try it.
 

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It is normal to see a person shaking from 20 feet away after there first run no matter what there level of experience in shooting is, there are a few who get sick and vomit.
There was one fellow who was a soldier in Afghanistan and who is now a leo who dropped to his knees screaming and crying and everyone came running and thought he had been hit by a ricochet but it seems he had ptsd and the scenario brought back some bad memory's (He gave them permission to discuss this with others)

Your fist class is the nerve racking class and then every class there after starts being less shocking and more like training, this is by design and it one of the things that that prepares you so well to a real situation as you have for all intended purposes already been in a life or death situation.

I am not trying to be a salesman and just describing how it feels, You first class you WILL be shaking and can be seen shaking at 20 feet away. If you ever get a chance to take a class based on this system then please do take it you will be so glad you did.
The videos don't do it justice as you can see the reflective screen but when you are in the scenario the reflective screen dissapears, all you see is a threat coming for you- most of the instructors do wear ballistic vest as there have been a few people who was so addled by the scenario that they have turned with the gun still in hand and ready to fire all while pointing at the safety instructor (those guys have got very good at picking this up and controlling the situation).

I do a piss poor job of explaining the experience but Oleg Volk is working on a artical about it and I am hopeful he can get all the details to come across as I scramble to try and do.
This is a extraordinary experience and a great learning tool and it does prepare you so well that the shock factor does go away really fast as your mind is more prepared for a deadly encounter. First class is a shocker, second class is more like just training, third class you can have some fun but you are very prepared for the real thing.

One note... He does not do the sniper training scenario to average citizens and limits those classes to military and Leo only.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
It looks like a great way to induce stress inoculation. Based on the little it shows I like the fact that you get to shoot live ammo. It certainly looks better than a general simulator such as Gander Mountains 300 degrees scenario simulator. With that said, unless I'm missing something troygate doesn't have the introduction and immediate feedback of pain in you get shot in a scenario. Overall, it looks like would another excellent form of training to work on becoming a thinker first and a fighter second. If there was one up in the Midwest area and the price was reasonable ($200 per day of class) I'd consider traveling to try it.
They had discussed a vest for the trainee for feedback on being shot but with the amount of stress the first class dumps on you they have not went that route for safety reasons. For lack of better words the first class will scare the **** out of you. If you do decide to take a second or third class the shock factor does drop tremendously and this is my design as the brain learns and prepares you for the situation.

You learn so much on the first class, by the second class you can put it to use, third class you can have some fun and experiment a little but none of them will shock you like that first class.
 

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Sounds like a road trip for me.
 
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It is as close to real as you can get as your are using real guns, real bullets with real people. The actors (who is shooting at you) can change the scenario in a blink of and eye, it really keeps you on your toes.
Yep. with sims you are using a real gun, with real people shooting at you, with paint rather than bullets. It is one of the best forms of training I can think of....
 

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Now I really want to take the class. Any way you can convince them to trade the hills of the NC for the mountains of CO?
 

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Awsome training tool. Although I thought I be seeing one of those insanity schools where they shoot live ammo at each other narrowly missing. I dont think it's for everyone, playing with live ammo will always have issues. The US Special forces, SAS, SBS and such types have live shooting houses, but I doubt I'll ever meet their skillset. IN the back of the participants minds they know they arent really being shot at, and they are really shooting anyone... It's no where near being involved in an actual shooting. While it looks like fun, it's really for serious gun packers like SWAT and and CERT style guys and of course military operations.

However I could see the system tweaked to scenario's and situations that may face the average non-sworn civillian in real life..
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Actually they do... Home invasions, intruders, parking lot scenarios, school shootings, armed robbery's and so on, Family members taken hostage and so on.
Most of the videos that have been taken just dont do the system and the one I posted was done in downtown Lenoir NC by a crew. There are several videos online but they just dont pick up what you see and feel.
 
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