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Well we are hoping this tragic case forces people to realize that the police are NOT responsible for protecting them, I think it's going to shock people quite a bit and will open up pandora's box. It sounds like gun owners up here plan to keep this in the news with lots of letter writing and it will also make a good women's right to self defence issue.


Regina police sued after 911 call fails to prevent murder
Last Updated Mon, 10 Apr 2006 11:23:27 EDT
CBC News

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/natio...uit060410.html

Relatives of a murdered woman in Regina are suing the city's police force, saying officers took too long to respond to a 911 call from a neighbour who heard her screaming.

Derek Kinna said he wonders if his mother, Janice Louise Kinna, could have survived the stabbing injuries inflicted by her boyfriend two years ago if police hadn't taken more than half an hour to show up.

"What if they got there sooner?" Kinna asked. "What if they walked in there during the middle of the act and possibly had a chance to stop the bleeding?"

Kenneth Eldon Ireland later pleaded guilty to second-degree murder. He was sentenced to life in prison with no chance of parole for 10 years.

The emergency call at the heart of the lawsuit, filed Friday, was made by a neighbour at Kinna's east-end Regina apartment building who heard the 47-year-old woman screaming on April 7, 2004.

Records show police showed up 31 minutes after the call was logged. They found Kinna dead of multiple stab wounds.

Ireland was arrested hours later.


FROM APRIL 19, 2004: 30-minute 911 delay under investigation

At the time of her death, Kinna had a restraining order against Ireland that required him to stay away from her. He had previously been charged with assaulting her.

The family is also suing SaskTel, where both Kinna and Ireland were employed, saying the Crown corporation failed to protect Kinna at work.

Kinna left work in the company of her killer on the day she died, but her son doesn't think she went willingly.

"He went past security after knowing he shouldn't be having any contact with her," said Derek Kinna. "[At] that point in their relationship, I can't see my mom leaving with him unless some kind of ultimatum was put on her."

No one from the Regina Police Service or SaskTel had anything to say about the lawsuit.

However, shortly after Kinna's death, Deputy Chief Clive Weighill said officers were facing a backlog of high-priority calls that afternoon.

When the call about Kinna came in, officers were dealing with a break and enter in progress, an escapee from a psychiatric ward, a newborn baby left alone in a car, an assault in progress, and a person who had been hit by a car.
 

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31 minutes....:mad:

Colin said:
When the call about Kinna came in, officers were dealing with a break and enter in progress, an escapee from a psychiatric ward, a newborn baby left alone in a car, an assault in progress, and a person who had been hit by a car.
Hopefully you are right, Colin...maybe this will open a few eyes.
 

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A tragedy that goes to prove IMO that no 911 call will ever save a life. The action needed is immediate thru an individual's own resources.

This is exactly why we carry and are even armed at home, well I am.
 

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thats to bad ... The suit wont go anywhere though it has all ready been upheld in court that the police aren't there to protect the individual
 

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True, but you could allege that they were negligent in their duty. They don't have a duty to protect a specific person, but they do have a duty to perform in a competent manner.
 

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tanksoldier said:
True, but you could allege that they were negligent in their duty. They don't have a duty to protect a specific person, but they do have a duty to perform in a competent manner.

I Agree 100% responding in a timely manner would have been nice ..

But i think there was a case similar to this and the out come was the police aren't responsible even for piss poor response time ...

unless I'm thinking of a different case it involved a murder also
 

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Bud White said:
thats to bad ... The suit wont go anywhere though it has all ready been upheld in court that the police aren't there to protect the individual
Save that this is a Canadian case, so that precedent does not apply.

I would expect a similar result, though.

Matt
 

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Still a good example of why one must assume responsibility for one's own defense. Canada has taken steps to prevent their citizens from protecting themselves, and this is the inevitable result.

Matt
 

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Sad result. 911 is a good system, but it's just that, a system. A dispatcher on the phone can't provide any self defense help, you have to be able to provide for yourself.

Another incident sadly proving the point that gun control is not criminal control.
 

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tanksoldier said:
...They don't have a duty to protect a specific person...
That's exactly what my thought was.


tanksoldier said:
...they do have a duty to perform in a competent manner.
True, but since the SCOTUS, ruled that LE is not obligated to protect individuals, it would seem to me that it would be extremely difficult to get a judgement in favor of the individual in this case.
 

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Tangle said:
That's exactly what my thought was.


True, but since the SCOTUS, ruled that LE is not obligated to protect individuals, it would seem to me that it would be extremely difficult to get a judgement in favor of the individual in this case.
The case is being brought in Canada, where they are less bound by the rulings of the SCOTUS.

But I suspect their findings will be much the same.

I liken it to first aid - I spent 15+ years as a Paramedic. Call 911, and we bring all sorts of great tools and training to you. But if you cannot do the basic first aid before we get there, none of it may make any difference.

Same thing with the police - call 911 and you'll get the quickest possible response with the given call load. The police will do their best to protect you when they get there. But if you cannot hold the fort while you wait for them, it may not make any difference when they get there.

So I plan to dial 1911 first, then 911 if, God forbid, the need ever arises.

Matt
 

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It reminds me of an incident a few years ago when the local university had a riot which brought in all available LE from the state,city and county to assist. I was the only PO available to respond in the city! We (LE) can not protect under al circumstances, and more often then not respond after the fact. Every person should be prepared to protect themselves and that is why the majority of street level PO's support the right to bear arms.
 

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And, let us not forget the problems in NO. The police were far too thin.
 

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I like to see such lawsuits brought forth, loudly and very publicly.

I also like to seem the fail, as they all will.

Such things can then be thrown in the faces of the "anti" crowd, every time they say we must depend upon the police to protect us.

The LEO's job begins after a crime has been committed. Not before.

mm
 

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tanksoldier said:
True, but you could allege that they were negligent in their duty. They don't have a duty to protect a specific person, but they do have a duty to perform in a competent manner.
Well according to the end of the article it's not like they were all hanging at the donut shop.

I didn't notice if they mentioned how the call came in. Depending on the wording of the caller it may have been given a low priority. Sure isn't in the same class as the kid in Detroit who's Mother died!
 

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madmike said:
I like to see such lawsuits brought forth, loudly and very publicly.

I also like to seem the fail, as they all will.

Such things can then be thrown in the faces of the "anti" crowd, every time they say we must depend upon the police to protect us.

The LEO's job begins after a crime has been committed. Not before.

mm
Me too, mm, but I've had to concede that the anti's don't care about these sorts of things, nor truth, nor fact. It's an emotional, religion deeply ingrained in them. They simply can't or won't analyze and come to a decision. They look solely at idealism as they see it.
 

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Too true, Tangle. Too true.

They won't be "confused by facts," or "influenced by truth."

None are so blind as those who will not see.

mm
 

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Discussion Starter #19
MattLarson said:
Save that this is a Canadian case, so that precedent does not apply.

I would expect a similar result, though.

Matt

Actually we can use British or US precedents if no Canadian ones are to be found.
 

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Colin said:
Actually we can use British or US precedents if no Canadian ones are to be found.
That's very interesting. So if there are no Canadian precedents exist, the lawyers will argue points made by British and American courts? There's something I would not have thought.
 
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