Defensive Carry banner

1 - 20 of 25 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
ok so you give an armed robber a quick lesson in the double tap instead of giving him your wallet... thing is... you are about to be legally robbed of way more money by the court system/lawyers.

I read someplace that some state make you pay nothing for your defense... what states are these?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
624 Posts
I have never heard of the state funding your defense in civil court, if that's what you are asking. I guess in criminal court, you could have a public attorney take the case.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,290 Posts
Never heard of that and it makes no sense. The locale would be prosecuting you and the state paying for your defense? Maybe in heaven but not on earth.

Same with civil suits, they're civil. The state has no legal interest unless a party.

You may be thinking of Victim's Compensation. We have that in NY, a student of mine who was mugged and his jaw broken applied and his medical bills were paid or partially paid. Maybe you're confusing the two. But that's strictly aid in paying for medical expenses for a victim of crime, or perhaps it has to be violent crime - not sure. But nothing legal - except legal aid if you mean an attorney appointed if you don't have money for one yourself. You still pay I think on an income-basis. (I think, others may know legal aid stuff).
Maybe you mean that? That's for anyone who lacks resources, nothing to do with CCW or street-crime.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,333 Posts
I think he is talking about a case were he has a private attorney, goes to trial and is found not guilty due to self defense, and the state having to reimburse the lawyer's fees.

That only occurs if:

#1 You screw up badly enough to have the cops arrest you for your actions.
#2 Your attorney cannot get the charges dropped or a disposition worked out that you will take.
#3 You go to trial (facing 30 years) and are found not guilty by the jury.

A few states have laws which say after you have gone that far and gotten acquitted, the state pays you reimbursement for legal fees.

The key word is REIMBURSEMENT.

As in "I gave MitchellCT $65,000. He did a great job, and I went to trial, then got acquitted. He submitted an affidavit to the court of his fees, and some time later the state sent me a certified check for $65,000."

They don't fork over the lawyer fees in advance, only if you win.

Not a mistrial.

Not if your lawyer is a pitbull and the case gets thrown out on procedural grounds, or dropped because he has photos of the holiday party at the courthouse which features the State's Attorney trying to make love to a statue in the hallway while wearing the Judge's robe...

Not that I have those photos. Not were they can be found, anyway...:wave:

You have to go to trial and WIN.

Big Risk.

Huge.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
156 Posts
Check out the gun laws sticky on the main page. Washington State has a law that if you are found not-guilty due to justifiable self-defense, the state will pay for your legal defense as long as you weren't involved in any other illegal activity that may have precipitated the incident.

It wasn't entirely clear to me (maybe I should re-read it) whether that would also apply to civil suit.

I know that in Missouri even if you are completely legally justified and have no charges pressed by the DA you can still be sued in civil courts and you're defense is entirely your own financial responsibility. Which I think sucks. A complete miscarriage of justice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
so what if i'm a georgia resident and i shoot some guy in self defense on the streets and its super obvious that its justified..... am i going to be out $10,000+???


seems cheaper to flee if you load your ammo with gloves.... lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,333 Posts
so what if i'm a georgia resident and i shoot some guy in self defense on the streets and its super obvious that its justified..... am i going to be out $10,000+???
It depends.

You are asking for an answer to something that is very complex.

Seek more training.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Check out the gun laws sticky on the main page. Washington State has a law that if you are found not-guilty due to justifiable self-defense, the state will pay for your legal defense as long as you weren't involved in any other illegal activity that may have precipitated the incident.
That's exactly what I was talking about. I heard some other places do that, I just wanted to know which ones.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
140 Posts
Idaho law says that you have civil immunity for self-defense. This is to keep BG's from suing you for shooting them in SD.


TITLE 6
ACTIONS IN PARTICULAR CASES
CHAPTER 8
ACTIONS FOR NEGLIGENCE
6-808.Civil immunity for self-defense. (1) A person who uses force as justified in section 18-4009, Idaho Code, or as otherwise permitted in sections 19-201 through 19-205, Idaho Code, is immune from any civil liability for the use of such force except when the person knew or reasonably should have known that the person against whom the force was used was a law enforcement officer acting in the capacity of his or her official duties.
(2) The court shall award reasonable attorney’s fees and costs incurred by the defendant in any civil action if the court finds that the defendant is immune from such action pursuant to this section.
(3) As used in this section, "law enforcement officer" means any court personnel, sheriff, constable, peace officer, state police officer, correctional officer, probation or parole official, prosecuting attorney, city attorney, attorney general, or their employees or agents, or any other person charged with the duty of enforcement of the criminal, traffic or penal laws of this state or any other law enforcement personnel or peace officer as defined in chapter 51, title 19, Idaho Code.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
24,512 Posts
I believe what your talking about is if your found not guilty the state has to reimburse you for your legal fees. I remember reading somewhere about it, but don't remember what state it was.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
140 Posts
Texas does as well; sadly, this doesn't protect you against legal fees dealing with a criminal charge from the DA.
Well hopefully it is a legal SD shoot and you won't have to worry about that. This is why we must all be aware of the laws of our state and if travelling - the laws of those states as well.

If I am prosecuted for protecting myself or my family then I will deal with the court costs and any other ramifications that arise.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
220 Posts
Washington State

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer.

The first section protects you from civil charges, the second part deals with reimbursement, and the third deals with if you were engaged in criminal conduct.

RCW 9A.16.110
Defending against violent crime — Reimbursement.

(1) ]No person in the state shall be placed in legal jeopardy of any kind whatsoever for protecting by any reasonable means necessary, himself or herself, his or her family, or his or her real or personal property, or for coming to the aid of another who is in imminent danger of or the victim of assault, robbery, kidnapping, arson, burglary, rape, murder, or any other violent crime as defined in RCW 9.94A.030.

(2) When a person charged with a crime listed in subsection (1) of this section is found not guilty by reason of self-defense, the state of Washington shall reimburse the defendant for all reasonable costs, including loss of time, legal fees incurred, and other expenses involved in his or her defense. This reimbursement is not an independent cause of action. To award these reasonable costs the trier of fact must find that the defendant's claim of self-defense was sustained by a preponderance of the evidence. If the trier of fact makes a determination of self-defense, the judge shall determine the amount of the award.

(3) Notwithstanding a finding that a defendant's actions were justified by self-defense, if the trier of fact also determines that the defendant was engaged in criminal conduct substantially related to the events giving rise to the charges filed against the defendant the judge may deny or reduce the amount of the award. In determining the amount of the award, the judge shall also consider the seriousness of the initial criminal conduct.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,796 Posts
The only situation like that I am aware of is if you are a govenrment employee (ie. Police Officer, or other law enforcement officer). If you are and are in an officer involved shooting they will offer to defend you in civil court provided the shooting is beyond reproach. The problem here is that like anywhere else the lawyer works for whom ever pays him. If you are sued, your supervisor, your chief your agency, and your jurisdiction may also be sued. If the jurisdiction is paying the lawyer, the lawyer's main concern is the jurisdiction not the officer. Pay for your own lawyer, it will be worth it to have someone on your side who is devoted to you and you alone not 2-5 other respondants. In a criminal case you are on your own. It will be the state or U.S. that prosecutes you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
350 Posts
If you have assets to care about (e.g. your home), you should have an umbrella insurance policy. And if you carry a firearm for self defense, you should ensure your policy covers this. Your policy should also have a duty to defend clause so that the insurance company is required to provide a legal defense for you.

Here is a web page I found doing a quick Bing search that explains duty to defend: http://coveragelaw.blogspot.com/2009/02/on-defensive-excess-insurers-and-duty.html
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
so if its an obvious justified shooting, most likely the DA will see this and not have you in court... meaning no fees?

like if 2 armed men carjack you, and you are able to kill them, would your average DA have enough sense to drop everything and let you go on your merry way?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
13,164 Posts
Average DA??

so if its an obvious justified shooting, most likely the DA will see this and not have you in court... meaning no fees?

like if 2 armed men carjack you, and you are able to kill them, would your average DA have enough sense to drop everything and let you go on your merry way?
In a sense there is no such thing. You aren't dealing with the average DA. You are dealing with the one in your state, county, or city. You are dealing with the luck of the draw in a sense, the guy in charge where your incident happens.

While I (and all of us) would like to believe that all DAs would seek justice instead of convictions, we know from history e.g., the Duke rape case, and many others notorious cases I've forgotten about, that sometimes that isn't the driving purpose --DAs as everyone are human and make errors of judgment.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,088 Posts
Re: Missouri
2. The court shall award attorney's fees, court costs, and all reasonable expenses incurred by the defendant in defense of any civil action brought by a plaintiff if the court finds that the defendant has an absolute defense as provided in subsection 1 of this section. (Castle Doctrine)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Gents

Mississippi is one of the states that you are discussing.

If someone shoots another and that someone pleads self-defense and the DA tries him anyway and the defendant is found not guilty then the state has to bear the defendant's entire burden (costs,fees,and expenses) of trial.:smile:

Bill

You are also immune from civil action.
 
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
Top